This is depressing.

[TheBlackPaladin]

As a dubbie myself, I totally know where you're coming from, Cootie. On the other hand, sometimes I wonder if it's not a good thing overall. Quite frankly, I can't stand Z's ending. I'm sympathetic that Toriyama grew exhausted, but that doesn't change the fact that Z has one of the most abrupt, sudden, and unsatisfying endings I've ever seen in an anime (in my opinion, of course). Quite frankly, I think it's a much more emotionally moving ending if we decide to end with the Cell Saga anyway.

[Adamant]

This would make sense only if Japan somehow made more money in everything else. It's like wanting to go buy a DVD of a Hollywood movie and being asked to pay $40. Unless I get paid generously or there was a wide variety of options for used buying/renting, I would not pay those prices. I may be understanding this wrong though.

Quite. It's like me be applying for a job and hearing I'd get paid 12$ an hour. Unless I was starving to death or there was no other person in the entire world willing to hire me, I would not accept such criminally low wages.

...or in other words, you're speaking out of your ass about a situation foreign to you. Don't do that.

[Cootie]

I've never even seen a full episode of Kai and I don't intend to invest in it. True, most of Z is filler, but I'd rather get the all of the Dragon Boxes and all of the manga simply because there's more content there

A bacon, lettuce, tomato and shit sandwich has more content than a BLT.

That's implying all filler is shit, which it isn't.

Yeah, there was that Arlia episode and the episode where Gohan had the dinosaur. And then there was... hmmm... well there was... I seem to be stumped now.

[Eire]

Wrote user who made thread about fillers and got many answers.

[Scorpio Kardia]

I don't mind that it ends how it did, i always liked the Cell saga ending anyway...

Dragon Ball Kai still pulled strong ratings so perhaps they will remake the Buu saga in the future.

[SonEric84]

I think Kai would have been more successful if it was completely re-animated, say, in the form of the opening of the series. I mean with the Dragon Boxes and then the Dragon Box singles, I'm sure most of the Japanese who wanted to buy the series did. Kai just didn't have much to offer in a way of new content. It's a shame that Dragon Ball was finally getting a decent dub in the U.S. and now it won't even be "complete" in a sense.

[kemuri07]

I've never even seen a full episode of Kai and I don't intend to invest in it. True, most of Z is filler, but I'd rather get the all of the Dragon Boxes and all of the manga simply because there's more content there

A bacon, lettuce, tomato and shit sandwich has more content than a BLT.

That's implying all filler is shit, which it isn't.

That's somewhat true. However, most of it is shit that only serves to bog down the entire show. Even as a kid, I grew frustrated with how there were plenty of episodes where shit didn't happen. So you can imagine how ecstatic I was when the trip to Namek literally took an episode.

There's a reason why DBZ gets mocked almost as much as it gets praised, and I think Kai helped fixed a lot of the pacing problems associated with the series.

I think Kai would have been more successful if it was completely re-animated, say, in the form of the opening of the series. I mean with the Dragon Boxes and then the Dragon Box singles, I'm sure most of the Japanese who wanted to buy the series did. Kai just didn't have much to offer in a way of new content. It's a shame that Dragon Ball was finally getting a decent dub in the U.S. and now it won't even be "complete" in a sense.

I don't really see the point in that. Sure, it'd look prettier, but it's still the same damn story. Besides, wouldn't it cost a lot of money just to reanimate the entire series? I don't think Toei would have been willing to take such a risk.

[rereboy]

I don't really see the point in that. Sure, it'd look prettier, but it's still the same damn story. Besides, wouldn't it cost a lot of money just to reanimate the entire series? I don't think Toei would have been willing to take such a risk.

You don't see the point in making a true remake of DBZ but you see the point of making DBKai which is DBZ with video edits and a new audio?

Kai, as a concept, was a pretty stupid. If they wanted to remake the series, they should have made a true remake.

There are tons and tons of people (like me) who don't really care about Kai and dismiss it as a cheap and lame way of trying to milk DBZ. And people like me would never do that if it was a true remake. In fact, I was pretty excited when I first heard of Kai, thinking it was a true remake. I watched the first episodes and I was really dissapointed... It was just a stupid way of milking DBZ, trying to pass the old anime for something new.

Now, if it really was a true remake, with very good animation and good pacing, it would be successful. Dragon Ball is one of the most popular animes in the world. If Kai failed, it was only because of the lack of general interest for a cheap and lame way of trying to milk DBZ and trying to pass it for something new. The public is not that stupid. Everyone can tell that Kai is just DBZ with edits and a new audio. And, if Kai failed, it was only because of that.

And if you need an example, just look at Fullmetal Alchemist. They remade the anime with just a few years between the original and the remake to make more like the manga. It was successful and I'm pretty sure Dragon Ball is more popular around the world and in Japan than Fullmetal Alchemist.

[Michsi]

That's somewhat true. However, most of it is shit that only serves to bog down the entire show. Even as a kid, I grew frustrated with how there were plenty of episodes where shit didn't happen. So you can imagine how ecstatic I was when the trip to Namek literally took an episode.

There's a reason why DBZ gets mocked almost as much as it gets praised, and I think Kai helped fixed a lot of the pacing problems associated with the series.

What I disliked in Z were mostly the filler scenes , not episodes. For instance when reaction scenes took a lot longer than they should other scenes were made to last longer. As for actual episodes, there were many that I liked and think were well done and added to the experience. Take the pre-saiyan arrival episodes, particulary the ones about Gohan. I can honestly say they helped shape and enhance , Gohan's growth in the 6 months he was alone, his relationship with Piccolo/ Other examples are Goku's stay on King Kai's planet, Tenshinhan & co. training, etc.. In Kai and tbh in the manga aswell , it all felt too sudden.

And I really liked the driving episode and the Garlic Jr.saga

Not to say there aren't bad fillers in Z, but there are worse offenders.

And I actually noticed scenes from the manga taken out of Kai and I'm not referring to the left out future Trunks episode, I mean like dialog cut out for no reason, and some bad editing (and this just from the first 2 , 3 episodes)

I don't really see the point in that. Sure, it'd look prettier, but it's still the same damn story. Besides, wouldn't it cost a lot of money just to reanimate the entire series? I don't think Toei would have been willing to take such a risk.

They did this with Dr. Slump a few years back. DBZ was probably a lot more popular so I don't see why it couldn't have been a contender for a complete reanimation. However, given Toei and the (imo) low production quality it uses for it's shows now a days, I don't think it would have been such a good idea. Not to mention that I don't like the style they draw DB in now

[kemuri07]

I don't really see the point in that. Sure, it'd look prettier, but it's still the same damn story. Besides, wouldn't it cost a lot of money just to reanimate the entire series? I don't think Toei would have been willing to take such a risk.

You don't see the point in making a true remake of DBZ but you see the point of making DBKai which is DBZ with video edits and a new audio?

Kai, as a concept, was a pretty stupid. If they wanted to remake the series, they should have made a true remake.

There are tons and tons of people (like me) who don't really care about Kai and dismiss it as a cheap and lame way of trying to milk DBZ. And people like me would never do that if it was a true remake. In fact, I was pretty excited when I first heard of Kai, thinking it was a true remake. I watched the first episodes and I was really dissapointed... It was just a stupid way of milking DBZ, trying to pass the old anime for something new.

Now, if it really was a true remake, with very good animation and good pacing, it would be successful. Dragon Ball is one of the most popular animes in the world. If Kai failed, it was only because of the lack of general interest for a cheap and lame way of trying to milk DBZ and trying to pass it for something new. The public is not that stupid. Everyone can tell that Kai is just DBZ with edits and a new audio. And, if Kai failed, it was only because of that.

And if you need an example, just look at Fullmetal Alchemist. They remade the anime with just a few years between the original and the remake to make more like the manga. It was successful and I'm pretty sure Dragon Ball is more popular around the world and in Japan than Fullmetal Alchemist.

Ok, fine. I'm willing to agree with you that both cases are fairly pointless. However, one exists and one doesn't and I just don't see the point in bitching what could have been. While I certainly agree that Kai has its faults, I don't think they automatically disregard the positives of Kai. I'll fully admit that it's Toei exploiting people's nostalgia, but I'm alright with that. Watching DB Kai on nicktoons feels like a new experience with the newly redone dubs and soundtrack, as well as the new pacing.

Getting back on topic: Sure it'd nice to see new animation, but it still doesn't change the fact that it's still the same DBZ we've been watching for over twenty years. Now, if we were talking about a complete re-imagining of the show, I'd be far more interested in that.

[kemuri07]

stupid computer.

[Pokewhiz7]

That's somewhat true. However, most of it is shit that only serves to bog down the entire show. Even as a kid, I grew frustrated with how there were plenty of episodes where shit didn't happen. So you can imagine how ecstatic I was when the trip to Namek literally took an episode.

That is true, but there still are some enjoyable episodes that you're missing out on with Kai. Like someone else said, I actually enjoy Garlic Jr. and I'll probably buy this just to see the driving episode. http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/ ... dition=new There was also Arlia, Gohan and the dinosaur, Gohan and the orphans, all the episodes in Hell, and the Other World Tournament.

[SonEric84]

I don't really see the point in that. Sure, it'd look prettier, but it's still the same damn story. Besides, wouldn't it cost a lot of money just to reanimate the entire series? I don't think Toei would have been willing to take such a risk.

Well, the original DBZ is more than good for me. I don't need a remake of any kind, but I just think if they were going to do it, they should have gone all the way rather than half-ass it by reusing footage from a series that was fine as it was. I really don't see why Toei doesn't have the funding to pull it off, they have some of the most successful anime series, including One Piece, which is extremely popular and still running.

But hey, I could be wrong and if they reanimated the show it may have been a total flop, but I just personally feel it would have at least been something new to look at. A re-imagining would have been cool too. I follow Kai on nicktoons, and I'm sure I will until the end, but I just miss a lot of the content from the old anime. It was nice to see the Freeza battle resolved more quickly though.

[Cootie]

Wrote user who made thread about fillers and got many answers.

My opinion over the matter changed over these past six months, Kai is probably one of the reasons why. I realized I didn't really care that Goku gets his feet glued to a ship for a whole episode or some wild goose chase on "Fake Namek" that wasted was just brutally bad.

[JulieYBM]

Wrote user who made thread about fillers and got many answers.

My opinion over the matter changed over these past six months, Kai is probably one of the reasons why. I realized I didn't really care that Goku gets his feet glued to a ship for a whole episode or some wild goose chase on "Fake Namek" that wasted was just brutally bad.

Actually, his feet were only glued on for about half an episode.

[SylentEcho]

Fillers in Z weren't all that long. Most other anime are a lot worse. Bleach has fillers for half a year at times, Naruto for one fourth of a year! DBZ hardly had any filler episodes.

The thing is, most people already knew the outcome of Z when they were watching it. Like almost everyone knew Goku beats Freeza, Gohan kills Cell etc, so they were quite impatient while watching it. Actually the filler gives viewers a good break between the break neck action.

Sure it would be a drag for some instances where they would just waste time like in the Freeza arc after Freeza started fighting. I admit some of those episodes were a chore to watch. That was the only time I liked Kai better than Z. Ginyu to Freeza arc.

I remember when I first saw DBZ before it stopped and before I started reading spoilers on the net. It was a roller coaster! You couldn't wait for another episode. The pace in Dragon Ball Z is just perfect in my opinion. It keeps the viewers wanting more. Always. Kai is a little rushed and sometimes feels like you've watched a bit too much.

[Rocketman]

Actually the filler gives viewers a good break between the break neck action.

That's why Armageddon stopped in the middle of the destruction of New York to watch some deer frolicking in the woods. Or why the Normandy landing in Saving Private Ryan is broken up by scenes of women washing dishes back in the States.

Oh wait, they didn't do that because that's retarded.

[Savage68]

As is the comparison of Dragon Ball Z to Armageddon or Saving Private Ryan.

[Rocketman]

As is the comparison of Dragon Ball Z to Armageddon or Saving Private Ryan.

Good point. Remember how Enter the Dragon kept cutting away to people doing housework?

[Kingdom Heartless]

Those are all movies... the same rules don't apply as a TV show.