What if Kid Boo had managed to destroy Son Goku?

[Michsi]

Yes, but the wording is a bit funny here.

Vegeta: "Er will sich verwandeln. -> "He wants to transform" implying Buu was doing this consciously.

[dbgtFO]

Yes, but the wording is a bit funny here.

Vegeta: "Er will sich verwandeln. -> "He wants to transform" implying Buu was doing this consciously.

Danish version: "Han vil forvandle sig." Exactly the same wording!
Yep, the danish version really is just a translation from the German one. Damn! I'm genuinely disappointed by Carlsen. Oh well.

Well the original version goes like this:
Vegeta: “…Look…He intends to perform another transformation…”

In conclusion, I can see why you got the impression that "Kid Buu" was stronger than "Super Buu."

[Michsi]

But I never got the impression that Kid Buu had gotten weaker unless Vegeta's statement has also been translated wrong.

He performed another transformation but nothing was said about his power being different.

In any case I always assumed this version of Buu was simply the most dangerous.

[Michsi]

But I never got the impression that Kid Buu had gotten weaker unless Vegeta's statement has also been translated wrong.

He performed another transformation but nothing was said about his power being different.

In any case I always assumed this version of Buu was simply the most dangerous.

[dbgtFO]

But I never got the impression that Kid Buu had gotten weaker unless Vegeta's statement has also been translated wrong.

He performed another transformation but nothing was said about his power being different.

In any case I always assumed this version of Buu was simply the most dangerous.

Well Vegeta did make a comment about Buu's size, while Goku said that they should be able to manage something against this Buu, as opposed to before, where they needed to fuse against Evil Buu to even dream of standing a chance. So that should at least give you the idea, that this current Buu wasn't as threatening as the one before, meaning he logically got weaker than Steroid Buu and Evil Buu.

I can't recall, what my impressions of the whole ordeal was, so it's always interesting to hear what others thought.

And yeah, Pure Buu being the most dangerous/troublesome is stated by Elder Kaioshin.

[Bussani]

But I never got the impression that Kid Buu had gotten weaker unless Vegeta's statement has also been translated wrong.

He performed another transformation but nothing was said about his power being different.

They thought they could handle him, though. Goku said they'd die if they even attempted to fight Super/Evil Buu and then his power goes up. Something wouldn't fit if his power stayed up, though I guess it's up to the individual to decide which part is "wrong".

Personally, I do think Buu's ki went down after the transformation was over; he was standing there completely calm, and most of the time in the past, characters haven't been able to tell what someone is completely capable of until they "get serious"--like when Goku tried to estimate Cell's strength and could only take a rough guess. It doesn't necessarily mean that Kid Buu's ki couldn't have gone back up when the fighting started, and it probably did... But Vegeta still seemed to think Goku could win, so either Goku was stronger than Super Buu after all, or Kid Buu was weaker than him. A very opinionated topic, to be sure.

[Fox666]

I don't believe the Pure Boo vs Evil Boo issue is optional.

The whole point in Evil Boo being so strong is that he was meant to be an opponent for Gotenks, not Goku. And it seems Evil Boo was even superior to Gotenks, as he only recognized that someone surpassed him when he sensed Gohan's Ki.

There have been many hints of Evil Boo power. I.e. after Gotenks fusion times out, Goku says Gohan alone would do the job. Goku asking Vegeta to fuse with him to fight Evil Boo after he lost all of his absorptions. Goku and Vegeta confidence after Boo finally reaches his original form. Etc. Even if some of them are open for interpretation, when you put them together everything points to the same direction.

The major problem is not characters statement or anything, but simply that Pure Boo was the final villain. The final villain being weaker is weird, but the whole idea of bringing Goku to fight again is also weird. Realistically speaking, Toriyama had a good idea of how out-classed Goku was against Evil Boo and his many forms, so he weakened Majin Boo so that Goku could fight him.

I guess some confusion was caused by the fact that South-Kaioshin absorbed Boo had a greater Ki than Evil Boo, but I believe this was simply a way to show that Dai Kaioshin was holding Boo power down.

[dbgtFO]

The major problem is not characters statement or anything, but simply that Pure Boo was the final villain. The final villain being weaker is weird, but the whole idea of bringing Goku to fight again is also weird. Realistically speaking, Toriyama had a good idea of how out-classed Goku was against Evil Boo and his many forms, so he weakened Majin Boo so that Goku could fight him.

I agree. Him being the final villain has led numerous fans to believe, he must be the strongest. It's also supported by the fact, that Pure Buu is the smallest Buu and usually Toriyama makes it a point to show, that the smallest villain is the strongest. We saw that with Vegeta, even though he was smaller than Nappa, he was actually way stronger than him. Freeza's true form is smaller than the other ones(2nd form and 3rd form, don't know about first form...) and Cell in his Perfect Form is noted to have gotten smaller like it's somehow less threatening.

And the animated adaption doesn't help, when it says that Pure Buu really is the strongest Buu, even though it contains the same lines as the manga, where it was laid out that Evil Buu(Gotenks absorbed) = Strongest Majin. Since a lot of fans started out watching the anime instead of reading the manga, I guess that has fueled the belief that Pure Buu must be strongest.

In the manga however, Buu is not the strongest, but he is the most dangerous/troublesome Buu, seen when he decided to blow up the Earth just because. So you could make the argument that even though he becomes weaker than before, he's still a foe you must take seriously or else you'll be sorry.

But the smaller form = strongest form at all times, simply isn't true:

• Vegeta is short, when human, but as Oozaru he has 10 times his normal Battle Power and he towers over everyone.
• Freeza is short in his true form, but at 100% power he becomes extremely buff, making him bigger than his normal form.
• And Buu is short in his original form, but with South Kaioshin absorbed, he becomes extremely buff, bigger and stronger than before. The one thing that sets him apart is that, we are introduced to the two forms in reverse.

Therefore you can't just claim that Pure Buu must be the strongest Buu, because he's the smallest form.

Another thing: I don't like this need to make your belief work by making huge unsupported claims.
It's better to go by what's stated, instead of making baseless assumptions to desperatly try and prove something. Whether you believe Pure Buu was stronger or Evil Buu was stronger, you're better off not claiming random shit, that you absolutely can't prove.

• Goku is absolutely no match for Evil Buu's strength and has to use fusion/porara to fight him, stated, not contradicted.
• Goku feels much more confident taking on Pure Buu and ends up as an equal match for his strength, stated and shown, not contradicted.

Pure Buu being weaker than Evil Buu by an unknown amount is what the manga tells us.

There is no over analyzing or anything going on. People who claim that are just desperate, because they can't prove it wrong without taking certain quotes completely out of context and by making huge unsupported claims.

I guess some confusion was caused by the fact that South-Kaioshin absorbed Boo had a greater Ki than Evil Boo, but I believe this was simply a way to show that Dai Kaioshin was holding Boo power down.

Yeah it pretty much is. Kaioshin notes how Buu up until absorbing Dai Kaioshin was evil itself and that he gained a heart by going so far as to lower his power through absorption. If it wasn't already evident, since Dai Kaioshin was the one who gave Buu a heart/made him good, it was the absorption of him, that lowered Buu's power, confirmed by Daizenshuu 7.

[jackjack]

He performed another transformation but nothing was said about his power being different.

Not sure if serious...

“We did it! This way, we might be able to manage something.” - this quote is all about his power.

They did it? What did they do? Entered Boo's body, removed his pods, and made him stronger? That can't have been their plan, right? Their plan is to return Boo to his fat form, which is weaker than merged Boo. So they couldn't have successfully done it unless it was a Boo form weaker than the merged one. I mean, how are they supposed to manage something now that Boo's gotten even more poweful than before?

[Bussani]

“We did it! This way, we might be able to manage something.”

Huh, I've never looked up the original version of that line before. In Viz's translation he says something like, "Yeah! We can take him!"--which seems a little more vague in comparison.

[Michsi]

He performed another transformation but nothing was said about his power being different.

Not sure if serious...

“We did it! This way, we might be able to manage something.” - this quote is all about his power.

They did it? What did they do? Entered Boo's body, removed his pods, and made him stronger? That can't have been their plan, right? Their plan is to return Boo to his fat form, which is weaker than merged Boo. So they couldn't have successfully done it unless it was a Boo form weaker than the merged one. I mean, how are they supposed to manage something now that Boo's gotten even more poweful than before?

There is no such line in my version or at least it's not in the chapter I looked up.

As I already mentioned, all Vegeta says after the transformation is done, is:

Vegeta in ch. 508 : Great, he shrunk. This is convenient for us (or something along those lines)

Also-

They did it? What did they do? Entered Boo's body, removed his pods, and made him stronger? That can't have been their plan, right? Their plan is to return Boo to his fat form, which is weaker than merged Boo. So they couldn't have successfully done it unless it was a Boo form weaker than the merged one. I mean, how are they supposed to manage something now that Boo's gotten even more poweful than before?

Which is the reason they look so dumbfounded in ch. 507. Something didn't go as planned.....

[dbgtFO]

There is no such line in my version or at least it's not in the chapter I looked up.

As I already mentioned, all Vegeta says after the transformation is done, is:

Vegeta in ch. 508 : Great, he shrunk. This is convenient for us (or something along those lines)

The second line is Goku's line, which is the line jackjack is referring to. Toriyama gives Vegeta a square speech balloon(indicating evil perhaps?), while Goku's speech balloon is round.

Also-

They did it? What did they do? Entered Boo's body, removed his pods, and made him stronger? That can't have been their plan, right? Their plan is to return Boo to his fat form, which is weaker than merged Boo. So they couldn't have successfully done it unless it was a Boo form weaker than the merged one. I mean, how are they supposed to manage something now that Boo's gotten even more poweful than before?

Which is the reason they look so dumbfounded in ch. 507. Something didn't go as planned.....

The quote jackjack posted comes from chapter 308.

[Michsi]

The second line is Goku's line, which is the line jackjack is referring to. Toriyama gives Vegeta a square speech balloon(indicating evil perhaps?), while Goku's speech balloon is round.

Oh, you are right! But the point of their statement remains the same though. Nothing about power seems to be mentioned.

Also I think the form of the speech bubbles indicates the tone a character uses. Vegeta probably speaks in a harsher tone.

The quote jackjack posted comes from chapter 308.

I know he/she was referring to that quote, it's why I said that my version doesn't have worded like that.
Vegeta's and Goku's shock and observation about Buu's power from the previous version is still noteworthy since the phrase used in the volume I have doesn't negate that. I don't know what the original says but apparently both Carlsen and Viz are similar with that translation.

And if anything after Buu screams they seem to lose that confidence that had a little earlier.

Oh well, I don't particularly care tbh. It always seemed more logical to me to have Buuhan, or whatever he is called, be the strongest. Kid Buu seemed to be the most dangerous since he was so unpredictable and chaotic.

[dbgtFO]

Oh, you are right! But the point of their statement remains the same though. Nothing about power seems to be mentioned.

Well Goku and Vegeta's plan was a succes: they made Buu weaker, so they are able to fight him without fusion.

Also I think the form of the speech bubbles indicates the tone a character uses. Vegeta probably speaks in a harsher tone.

Probably. I think it was elaborated upon on this very board a long time ago.

I know he/she was referring to that quote, it's why I said that my version doesn't have worded like that.
Vegeta's and Goku's shock and observation about Buu's power from the previous version is still noteworthy since the phrase used in the volume I have doesn't negate that. I don't know what the original says but apparently both Carlsen and Viz are similar with that translation.

The original says what jackjack posted(and jackjack is male unless I'm completely missing something here!!):

Goku: “We did it! This way, we might be able to manage something.”

And if anything after Buu screams they seem to lose that confidence that had a little earlier.

We can't really establish anything based on that... Buu suddenly screamed extremely loud, of course they were shocked and all "WTF was that??!"

Kid Buu seemed to be the most dangerous since he was so unpredictable and chaotic.

Exactly.

[Hellspawn28]

If Boo did kill Goku before the Earth was wish back to life then Buu would have destroy all of the Planets in the universe until nothing is left in the universe. No one would able to stop Buu since he is a total animal that will destroy anything in sight (Unless you want go by GT and think Rilld or Bebi could have stop him).

[Rocketman]

If Boo did kill Goku before the Earth was wish back to life then Buu would have destroy all of the Planets in the universe until nothing is left in the universe. No one would able to stop Buu since he is a total animal that will destroy anything in sight (Unless you want go by GT and think Rilld or Bebi could have stop him).

They're in the afterlife realm. Goku would just appear again with a halo, and unlimited full power.

[Hellspawn28]

I forgot about that for a moment . I don't know what Buu would do once he destroys every Planet and Star in the universe? It would be one big black void and he would be floating in space doing nothing.

[Bussani]

I forgot about that for a moment . I don't know what Buu would do once he destroys every Planet and Star in the universe? It would be one big black void and he would be floating in space doing nothing.

Being able to teleport anywhere at that point, I'd guess he'd set his sights on Otherworld.

Once he blows all that up? Uhhh... Man, he'd be bored.