Are V-Jump power levels reliable

[JulieYBM]

Everything happened where everything happened. Battles powers happen where battle powers happen. It's a little hard for anything to affect or matter to something other than where it is stated.

[CaBrPi]

True but the Mankankosappo has failed where as the Kienzon hasn't. The Kienzon could be indestructible. You have a good point though Ill give you that.

Where has it failed? Sure, Raditz dodged it, but practically everyone that the Kienzan was used on dodged it...

The Kienzon has cut through things that should be much more powerful than it, I.E. Freeza's tail. I recall the mankan... screw this, special beam canon has failed to cause damage before.

Like Rocketman said, the Makankosappo was only used twice in the manga, both times against Raditz. The first time, he dodged it (remember Nappa dodging the Kienzan in its very first usage?), and the second time, it went right through him.

I know there's a theory that Piccolo "perfected" it, but this is Dragon Ball, where there are no subtleties. So, unless Piccolo shouted "MAKANKOSAPPO!" while firing off that whatever-it-was, it wasn't the Makankosappo.

[DragonBalllKaiHD]

I recall Piccolo also used Makankosappo along with Kuririn's Kamehameha against Nappa. Technically it would be his third one.

[TheMightyOzaru]

I recall Piccolo also used Makankosappo along with Kuririn's Kamehameha against Nappa. Technically it would be his third one.

Doesn't Cell also use well... 4 on Goku?

[Rocketman]

I recall Piccolo also used Makankosappo along with Kuririn's Kamehameha against Nappa. Technically it would be his third one.

It looks similar, but he doesn't call it and his hands are in a different position. Call it a maybe at best.

Cell using it is filler.

[Saiga]

It's not definite, but I do believe it was a Makankosappo. Didn't he say it wouldn't take as long to charge if he had both arms? So it makes sense that the attack would be performed differently.

[hleV]

I know there's a theory that Piccolo "perfected" it, but this is Dragon Ball, where there are no subtleties. So, unless Piccolo shouted "MAKANKOSAPPO!" while firing off that whatever-it-was, it wasn't the Makankosappo.

I think SSJ3 Gokū used Kamehameha against Pure Boo without shouting the technique's name.

[Fox666]

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[Kaboom]

It also says this...

Makankosappo
[makankou sappou; lit. "Demon Pierce Light Kill Cannon"]
First Appears Chapter 201
Category Ki Manipulation
User(s) Piccolo, Cell
Characteristics
After losing to Goku at the 23rd Tenkaichi Budoukai, Piccolo invented this technique after much training. It's a technique whose purpose was to defeat Goku, but it ended up being first used during the battle with Raditz. Concentrating ki into his fingertips, he fires it out in the form of a screw. As the kind of technique that concentrates ki into a single point, its force is enough to pierce through the opponent's body. It possesses considerable destructive and piercing power, but it's weakness is that it requires time to gather ki. Because of this, Raditz was able to read through the technique, and the first blast merely destroyed his shoulder pad. However, when fired a second time, it not only pierced through Raditz's body, but also Goku's as well, since he was holding Raditz. This shows the incredibleness of its power. (Daizenshuu 2, p.210 /
Daizenshuu 4, p.111)
Anime
Apart from Piccolo, Cell fired it as well during his battle with Piccolo in Ginger Town. It seems that its force was the same as right when Piccolo first devised it.

Not only the Makankosappo's power is stressed, but also its ability to pierce through opponents thanks to its highly-focused and pinpoint-focused form. So it seems perfectly reasonable to expect it to be able to affect opponents stronger than itself or the user because of those properties, just like the Kienzan.

Thus, Raditz at 1500 works fine.

[Saiga]

The Daizenshuu mentions he fired the Makankousappou against Nappa.

Oh, really? Which one? Because I'd be really interested if that confirmed!

[Herms]

Well last I checked the V-jump power levels put Kami at 220.

That was from an issue of Weekly Jump actually, rather than V-Jump. It was part of the issue that featured the chapter with Goku and Vegeta's big beam struggle.

Also, please don't necro-post.

Perhaps Kami has lost power over the years, while Popo's gotten a lot stronger from training Goku and the humans.

On that note, there's that Boo arc filler where Popo fends off Super Saiyan Goten and Trunks. Screw Broli, maybe Popo's got infinitely rising ki.

[DragonBalllKaiHD]

On that note, there's that Boo arc filler where Popo fends off Super Saiyan Goten and Trunks. Screw Broli, maybe Popo's got infinitely rising ki.

Still stuck on my post about "infinitely rising ki"?

[Fox666]

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[Saiga]

Perhaps Kami has lost power over the years, while Popo's gotten a lot stronger from training Goku and the humans.

On that note, there's that Boo arc filler where Popo fends off Super Saiyan Goten and Trunks. Screw Broli, maybe Popo's got infinitely rising ki.

Have we ever seen the two of them in one place before?

[Herms]

Maybe Popo is like that optional boss in Chrono Trigger who you can fight repeatedly, and he gets stronger and stronger as your party levels up.

The kanzentai links are off, so I can't check. But I remember it said something about it being different when he used against Nappa, but was still fired from the fingertip later in the anime and movies.

You may be misremembering. Kaboom's already posted the Daizenshuu 7 technique dictionary entr for it, which doesn't mention that. Daizenshuu 2 and 4 only deal with the manga and so wouldn't mention the anime and movies. I don't recall the anime-only daizenshuu ever going that in-depth with techniques outside of Daizenshuu 6's page on movie exclusive techniques. So I don't know where there'd be a statement like that.

[Kaboom]

Yeah, I dug around the old Kanzentai translations (using a web archive to view old cached versions of the pages) and couldn't find anything about it either.

[TheDevilsCorpse]

Have we ever seen the two of them in one place before?

[Bussani]

I recall Piccolo also used Makankosappo along with Kuririn's Kamehameha against Nappa. Technically it would be his third one.

Like Rocketman said, that's possible. Whatever the case, Nappa dodged it, so we don't know if it would have pierced him or not. If Makankosappo has ever hit and not pierced its target, it was filler (although I can't think of this happening off the top of my head). The same can be said about Kienzan, of course.

I'm fine with Makankosappo piercing a stronger target. It's like how light focused through a magnifying glass can vaporize ants, but light not focused through a magnifying glass can't. Of course, if you focused enough ki to one spot and defended with it, you could probably stop the attack.

[Fox666]

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[CaBrPi]

Piccolo also used it against Tullece in DBZ Movie 3.