Dabura >=< Perfect Cell(Not Super Perfect)?

[Fox666]

deleted

[TheMightyOzaru]

Dude stop forcing your viewpoint.

I'm not forcing my viewpoint. I'm just saying what I believe.

Just because the last Cell that was scene was Super Perfect does not mean he IS referring Super Perfect.

IMO, it doesn't make sense to be referring to an older version of Cell. If he was talking about an older version of Cell, then he would be more specific.

Goku doesn't say anything about his attacks being strong he just referrers to his ability to use Magic as a strength.

I know. My point is that Goku didn't say that Dabra was weaker than he expecting, which would make him weaker than Cell.

Gohan can so be a SSJ. His spikier hair, sharper face, sharper aura, and sparks, all the defining factors of a SSJ2, are not present on Gohan during the fight. He is likely just a SSJ.

Did you read my whole post? I already said that Gohan looks exactly like a Super Saiyan and not like a Super Saiyan 2. I already said that I believe that Gohan is erroneously drawn as a Super Saiyan, while he should be drawn as a Super Saiyan 2.

Ok thanks for adding the IMO to the end of things.

[Son_Gohan]

It's worth noting that Goku's statement is merely an assumption of Dabura's power, he is not sure of it himself, so it isn't to be taken as something concrete. Bringing up Cell as a point of reference is only emphasizing the idea of how much stronger they've gotten. I don't think it is supposed to be directed at any particular state of Cell, nor would it make any sense to specify it down to a form below his Perfect state, since he would no longer be considered a "frightening opponent" to them back then.

[hleV]

If someone had said about someone in Boo arc "he is about as strong as Goku" would Goku from the Piccolo Daimao arc be an option? It's the same thing.

What does the "arc" have to do with anything? If someone said that East Kaioshin was about as strong as Goku, would you assume that they're talking about his SS3?
Cell went from #16 to SS2s' level in a span of days. Goku told that 7 years ago Dabra would've been a threat, just like Cell was. It's not incorrect to compare someone to, say, Semi-Perfect Cell, because even though it wasn't his stronger form, he was still no less a threat.

[Fox666]

deleted

[Super Saiyan Turlast x4]

Cell before destruction was well beyond Super Saiyan Gohan. Goku would have to be referring to Cell before Gohan transforms into a Super Saiyan 2 for him to be referring to the Cell he fought. Dabra's power could be anywhere.

[Fox666]

deleted

[Bussani]

Ok thanks for adding the IMO to the end of things.

To be fair, he shouldn't have to. It was clearly that it was his opinion from the start.

[Undertaker]

Goku thought taking Dabura would be easy. Easy means SSjin because his SSjin 2 was not revealed yet. Buu Saga SSjin Goku is weaker than FP PC so Goku probably talked about the Cell he fought.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

OK, now I'm thinking putting Dabra at Perfect Cell's level. Yeah, that's what I'm gonna do. Makes more sense for Gohan to be Super Saiyan like this.

[Saiga]

OK, now I'm thinking putting Dabra at Perfect Cell's level. Yeah, that's what I'm gonna do. Makes more sense for Gohan to be Super Saiyan like this.

The dark side has claimed another.

[hleV]

The dark side has claimed another.

Jooooooin uuuuuus...

[Dabooyaka]

The only Cell that would give them trouble 7 years ago would be perfect Cell, So we can't be actually be considering his lower forms, can we?

[hleV]

The only Cell that would give them trouble 7 years ago would be perfect Cell, So we can't be actually be considering his lower forms, can we?

No. Goku said that before (meaning some point in the past), Dabra would've been trouble. Then he compares Dabra to Cell from 7 years ago.

[Kaboom]

The only Cell that would give them trouble 7 years ago would be perfect Cell, So we can't be actually be considering his lower forms, can we?

Less his lower forms (only as an example), and more the very wide range of power Cell had in his Perfect form.

[IDreamtIWasABee]

Dabra exists largely to serve as a proxy for Cell, fulfilling the same role in the Boo saga that Freeza did in the Cell arc: showing us how utterly insignificant the last villain's power is compared to the power of the enemies and heroes in the new saga. Goku's throwaway lines are only thrown in there to establish this connection. With this in mind, there's no reason to assume Dabra isn't in "Super Perfect" Cell's class.

You can fudge the dialogue and drawings to make Dabra weaker or stronger, but really, Goku's offhand judgment that they're equal is as straightforward as can be.

I guess people don't like a secondary character coming out of nowhere to be as powerful as Cell at his strongest, and I don't blame them, but at least Cell had a stand-in to get his beat-down from Boo, which is more than Freeza got when Trunks came out of nowhere to cut him to pieces.

[Gokuden]

Dabra was more patient than Cell, he's also the strongest Otherworld official in recent memory.
I like to think Dabra was as strong as Super Perfect Cell, and that the best Gohan could do now was holding him off due to lack of training, and not completely dominate him.

[Kaboom]

Dabra exists largely to serve as a proxy for Cell, fulfilling the same role in the Boo saga that Freeza did in the Cell arc: showing us how utterly insignificant the last villain's power is compared to the power of the enemies and heroes in the new saga. Goku's throwaway lines are only thrown in there to establish this connection. With this in mind, there's no reason to assume Dabra isn't in "Super Perfect" Cell's class.

If someone had been compared to Freeza, then cited as "stronger than I thought" by another character... but then a Goku who was somehow weaker overall than he was on Namek stalemated that character with just the Kaio-Ken, would we then somehow still assume that character was stronger than 100% Freeza. Same deal here. The "logic" doesn't match up with what we're actually presented.

Why not just settle for Dabra certainly being in Cell's general league, but not quite as strong as Cell's best? I understand the whole "measuring stick" approach, but like I've said before, it doesn't need to be so strict. Maybe it's just me, but that seems like a more sensible option than, "I'm going to pretend this character is doing something that there's no evidence of them doing, just to stick to a needlessly strict interpretation of a loose and vague bit of dialogue." That doesn't make any sense to me.

[Herms]

Maybe it's stupid of me to invoke another beaten to death controversy, but the Saibaimen are obviously stand-ins for Raditz in the same way Dabra serves as a stand-in for Cell, but Raditz's official BP is still a little higher than theirs, and Toriyama says in his memo to the anime staff on Saibaimen that their BP is slightly inferior to Raditz. So if you go by that, there's some precedent for the idea of a stand-in being about as strong but not quite as strong as the character they're standing in for.

[Rocketman]

And Mecha Freeza wasn't as strong as 100% Freeza.