Discussion, generally of an in-universe nature, regarding any aspect of the franchise (including movies, spin-offs, etc.) such as: techniques, character relationships, internal back-history, its universe, and more.
Sora Saiyan wrote:Unless Vegeta becomes the strongest at some point in the near future I don't think we'll see him being cocky. He's too outclassed by too many people for him to be cocky.
People who aren't the strongest can still be cocky. Vegeta showed the finger to the Ginyus while knowing he can do jackshit.
I just loved when he played with characters and not just being all serious now.
Best scene is where he mocked Gero but I reality knew he wouldn't have won. Still he was all cocky and played a mind game
Cocky Vegeta pretty much died out after the Namek arc, though. He had his fun when he was strongest in the artificial humans arc, but when he was outclassed his cockiness died until he became the strongest against Cell, but even then it didn't last very long.
After his fight with Cell I really can't remember seeing a truly cocky Vegeta, I'd say the closest we came in the Buu arc was against Pui-Pui.
The Gero part was really good, but Vegetas cockiness only started to die when he started to hit his limit, or he found out that SSJ wasn't as invincible as he thought it would be.
The thing with Vegeta is he's starting to become a goofy character. He's less feeling like a serious character put into goofy situations, and more he just is plain goofy. Soon it won't really be funny to see Vegeta in silly situations as he's becoming just as silly. I like asshole Vegeta, but not overly whiny Vegeta of the Cell arc. The only thing good about that Vegeta is when his pride is torn apart. I like Saiyan arc, Freeza arc, and Boo arc Vegeta. I ain't really sold on Super! Vegeta.
Why Dragon Ball Consistency in something such as power levels matter!
Spoiler:
Doctor. wrote:I've explained before, I'll just paraphrase myself.
Power levels establish tension and drama. People who care about them (well, people who care about them in a narrative) don't care about the big numbers or the fancy explosions. If you have character A who's so much above character B, who's the main character, you're gonna be left wondering how in the hell character B, the character we're supposed to care and root for, is going to escape the situation or overcome the odds. It makes us emotionally invested.
If character B doesn't escape the situation in a believable way that's consistent with previous events, then that emotional investment is gone. It was pointless tension, pointless drama made just to suck in the viewer. It has no critical value whatsoever. The audience is left believing that the author can just create whatever scenarios he wants and what happens to the characters is decided by whatever the author wants to happen, regardless of the events that happened in the story. Which, in fairness, is what happens, but the audience wants to be fooled. The audience wants to know that the world they're following has rules. That the world they're invested in isn't going to bend to external factors that are irrelevant to them.
An author can do whatever he wants with the characters, that's not false. But the author should also have the responsibility to make sure it fits in cohesively with the other events in the narrative he has created.
dbzfan7 wrote:The thing with Vegeta is he's starting to become a goofy character. He's less feeling like a serious character put into goofy situations, and more he just is plain goofy. Soon it won't really be funny to see Vegeta in silly situations as he's becoming just as silly.
Vegeta progression to becoming a goofy character won't happen until he starts a gag where, when nobody is around, he wears a top hat and while holding a cane, dances and sings ragtime songs.
Spoiler:
Akira Toriyama wrote:My policy is to try and forget things once they’re over. Since if I don’t discard the old and focus on what’s new, I’ll overload my brain capacity. I still haven’t lived down going, “Who the heck is Tao Pai-pai?” that one time I was talking with Ei’ichiro Oda-kun. But the fact that there are still people reading the series after all this time… All I can say is; “thank you.” Really, that’s all.
Akira Toriyama wrote:Drawing Dragon Ball again reminded me of two things--how much I love it, and how much I never want to do it again.
Kunzait_83 wrote:And if you're upset because all this new material completely invalidates the tabletop RPG rulebook-sized statistical system and flowchart for the characters' "canonical Power Levels" that you'd been working on painstakingly for the last bunch of years now... well I don't think there's a kind, non-blunt way of saying this, but that's 100% entirely your own misguided fault for buying so deeply into all this nonsensical garbage in the first place. And that you also have IMMENSELY skewed and comically backwards priorities in what you think is most important and needed to make a good Dragon Ball story.
Zephyr wrote:Goodness, they wrote idiotic drivel in a children's cartoon meant to advertise toys!? Again!? For the ninetieth episode in a row!? Somebody stop the presses! We have to voice our concern over these Super important issues!
Kamiccolo9 wrote:Fair enough, I concede. Sean Schemmel probably has some kind of hidden talent. Maybe he is an expert at Minesweeper. You're right; calling him "talentless" wasn't fair.
Michsi wrote: Mon Jul 04, 2022 11:29 amIn Super Piccolo got yelled off the stage by Vegeta in the U6 Tournament arc and lost to Jiminy Cricket in the ToP , he deserved 15 new transformations with his theme song played by Metallica in the background.
dbzfan7 wrote:The thing with Vegeta is he's starting to become a goofy character. He's less feeling like a serious character put into goofy situations, and more he just is plain goofy. Soon it won't really be funny to see Vegeta in silly situations as he's becoming just as silly.
Vegeta progression to becoming a goofy character won't happen until he starts a gag where, when nobody is around, he wears a top hat and while holding a cane, dances and sings ragtime songs.
Nah that's jump the shark goofy. He's already feeling like a goofy character so much, that I am starting to forget why he's taken seriously or "badass" as some put it.
Why Dragon Ball Consistency in something such as power levels matter!
Spoiler:
Doctor. wrote:I've explained before, I'll just paraphrase myself.
Power levels establish tension and drama. People who care about them (well, people who care about them in a narrative) don't care about the big numbers or the fancy explosions. If you have character A who's so much above character B, who's the main character, you're gonna be left wondering how in the hell character B, the character we're supposed to care and root for, is going to escape the situation or overcome the odds. It makes us emotionally invested.
If character B doesn't escape the situation in a believable way that's consistent with previous events, then that emotional investment is gone. It was pointless tension, pointless drama made just to suck in the viewer. It has no critical value whatsoever. The audience is left believing that the author can just create whatever scenarios he wants and what happens to the characters is decided by whatever the author wants to happen, regardless of the events that happened in the story. Which, in fairness, is what happens, but the audience wants to be fooled. The audience wants to know that the world they're following has rules. That the world they're invested in isn't going to bend to external factors that are irrelevant to them.
An author can do whatever he wants with the characters, that's not false. But the author should also have the responsibility to make sure it fits in cohesively with the other events in the narrative he has created.
