"Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

[The Undying]

that was before it's cut in half ....

You severely miss the point.

Goku encouraging Freeza to train at all shows that it's not as simple as letting him live out his days in shame and humiliation. Having Freeza's pride shattered was cited as the reason Goku withdrew, but within the broader context of sparing Freeza twice, he makes it abundantly clear (on multiple occasions) that it's more about feeling pity above all else.

The dialogue I quoted earlier wouldn't have been mentioned otherwise. He wanted Freeza to learn life's value, not suffer. He flat-out says this.

Frieza tells him that it is not worth escaping because the planet is going to explode before ... and he make it clear that his spaceship was ruined by vegeta but goku really doesn't care about that

Dunno what translation you're reading, but he's just saying that Goku doesn't have the means to escape. The dialogue on that exact page says Freeza can flee on his own and survive in the vacuum of space (unlike Goku) then Freeza himself says that he'll survive while Goku will die in the explosion.

Freeza would have easily escaped had he not obsessively attacked Goku. That was the whole point.

[Cipher]

Re: There being no need to heal Moro:

If Goku were interested in seeing if he might take him up on his offer—even if he expected Moro to attack him, as seems to be the case—he had to heal him. A wounded Moro would be forced to comply; the test is what he’ll do when he thinks he can still fight back or win.

If anything, the Senzu seems to be an indication that Goku isn’t actually prioritizing saving him, but testing him instead.

[JulieYBM]

If we get a turn and a twist that the Senzu is actually just a test and Gokuu somehow turned it into a dud I would be extremely pleased.

[Femme Fatale Kikaza]

If we get a turn and a twist that the Senzu is actually just a test and Gokuu somehow turned it into a dud I would be extremely pleased.

I don't know, Moro seems like he reacted to the bean positively, I don't get how you can turn a senzu into a dud without specifically preparing and it's not like Goku can just manipulate it at will.

[JulieYBM]

If we get a turn and a twist that the Senzu is actually just a test and Gokuu somehow turned it into a dud I would be extremely pleased.

I don't know, Moro seems like he reacted to the bean positively, I don't get how you can turn a senzu into a dud without specifically preparing and it's not like Goku can just manipulate it at will.

He can pour ki into the bean that deteriorates it.

That or we're just plain fucked and the fight is going to keep going on-and-on.

[The Undying]

Also, I said I wouldn't comment on previews, but Goku's reaction to Moro's assault should tell you that he wasn't actually anticipating him to reform. He's just giving Moro a free choice that he wouldn't otherwise have in his battered, defeated state.

Just food for thought. It's certainly more Goku-like than straight executing him while he's begging for mercy.

[BWri]

Right! I've been saying it for years now. Modern DB needs really good editors and a loremaster (fact checker) or team of them on the payroll. George R.R. Martin consults with his superfans, those who run the Westeros website and Toei/Shueisha should do the same.

Didn't know Martin had something like that. We definitely could benefit from that in this franchise. Some inconsistencies are so easy to avoid.

It's really fascinating how it all came to be and how he came to rely on them. When you get a chance, look up Elio García and Linda Antonsson. Either way, fan passion can oftentimes transcend author passion or at the very least, fans naturally have a great knack for memorizing details, superfans especially. Might as well harvest that sweet sweet brain matter to create a more engrossing story, especially when they've archived series history with the care of a historian.

Spoiler:

Around 2000, when A Storm of Swords was published, García and Antonsson began compiling a concordance of facts and details about Westeros, which they sent to Martin, leading him to state that they knew more about Westeros than he did. During the writing of the series' fourth book, A Feast for Crows, the couple became a regular fact checker for details regarding the series' many characters and locations.

[LoganForkHands73]

Also, I said I wouldn't comment on previews, but Goku's reaction to Moro's assault should tell you that he wasn't actually anticipating him to reform. He's just giving Moro a free choice that he wouldn't otherwise have in his battered, defeated state.

Just food for thought. It's certainly more Goku-like than straight executing him while he's begging for mercy.

Like, just by looking at the way the story is structured, I'm confused as to how people thought this was going to play out if Goku did decide to simply execute Moro on the spot, as everyone seems to desire? He ignores Moro's pleas for mercy and punches through his skull Dredd-style, and that's it -- happy ending, dinner at Capsule Corp, move onto the next arc? Hell no. There's a whole 'nother chapter worth of pages to fill up.

[Tai Lung]

that was before it's cut in half ....

You severely miss the point.

Goku encouraging Freeza to train at all shows that it's not as simple as letting him live out his days in shame and humiliation. Having Freeza's pride shattered was cited as the reason Goku withdrew, but within the broader context of sparing Freeza twice, he makes it abundantly clear (on multiple occasions) that it's more about feeling pity above all else.

The dialogue I quoted earlier wouldn't have been mentioned otherwise. He wanted Freeza to learn life's value, not suffer. He flat-out says this.

Frieza tells him that it is not worth escaping because the planet is going to explode before ... and he make it clear that his spaceship was ruined by vegeta but goku really doesn't care about that

Dunno what translation you're reading, but he's just saying that Goku doesn't have the means to escape. The dialogue on that exact page says Freeza can flee on his own and survive in the vacuum of space (unlike Goku) then Freeza himself says that he'll survive while Goku will die in the explosion.

Freeza would have easily escaped had he not obsessively attacked Goku. That was the whole point.

ok ... but anyway leaving the alive is a different thing than giving a senzu bean to an enemy ... there is no need if what goku wants is to lock him up

[DiscountDabi]

The interview mentions that something big happens on page 9, which is the page after the leaks ends.

Either MUI runs out and Moro’s attack actually lands. Or Goku murks him in one attack. I’m hoping for the latter.

[Femme Fatale Kikaza]

On the off chance MUI drops out, prepare yourselves for an extended fight...

[Ziegander]

Look, I can understand if Goku wants Moro to have a free choice.

The logic doesn't break just because Goku doesn't heal him before Moro makes the promise. I mean, at the very minimum Goku could have gotten the promise out of Moro before giving him the senzu bean. He could even have demanded Moro turn himself over to the Galactic Patrol before he gave him a senzu bean.

If Goku wanted to test Moro, that would have worked exactly the same. Whatever restraints, magical seals, manacles, whatever, Moro could have broken free from anything the Galactic Patrol could have imprisoned him with after Goku gave him a senzu bean.

But, yeah, there's also the argument that, why the fuck even give him a senzu bean in the first place?! I never expected him to kill Moro after Moro was helpless and begging for mercy. Of course Goku wouldn't kill him, and there could have been any number of logical reasons for Goku to give Moro a senzu bean, but for his reason to be, "Moro, I'll restore you to full power if you promise you won't hurt anyone ever again and imprison yourself for eternity," I mean that is LAUGHABLE! Are you kidding me?!

[Femme Fatale Kikaza]

Look, I can understand if Goku wants Moro to have a free choice.

The logic doesn't break just because Goku doesn't heal him before Moro makes the promise. I mean, at the very minimum Goku could have gotten the promise out of Moro before giving him the senzu bean. He could even have demanded Moro turn himself over to the Galactic Patrol before he gave him a senzu bean.

If Goku wanted to test Moro, that would have worked exactly the same. Whatever restraints, magical seals, manacles, whatever, Moro could have broken free from anything the Galactic Patrol could have imprisoned him with after Goku gave him a senzu bean.

But, yeah, there's also the argument that, why the fuck even give him a senzu bean in the first place?! I never expected him to kill Moro after Moro was helpless and begging for mercy. Of course Goku wouldn't kill him, and there could have been any number of logical reasons for Goku to give Moro a senzu bean, but for his reason to be, "Moro, I'll restore you to full power if you promise you won't hurt anyone ever again and imprison yourself for eternity," I mean that is LAUGHABLE! Are you kidding me?!

Yeah honestly that's why its so stupid to me. Restore Moro to full hp and expect him to surrender himself? What kind of reason is that? It makes Goku look like he jumped off the stupid tree because Moro is obviously not going to surrender himself while he's been restored to full power.

[Peach]

I am actually more interested in what’s coming next for the new arc than in the climax of the current one. And I am actually liking the climax, but 2 years of this arc has been a little too much. It definitely overstayed its welcome.

It seems the logical continuation would be to look for the Dragon Balls. The Super Dragon Balls. Moro did a lot of damage and I find it hard to believe that regular Shenron can restore all of it.

[EGonzo]

I just hope one day, when I have children, they live long enough to see the end of this arc.

[Kinokima]

The interview mentions that something big happens on page 9, which is the page after the leaks ends.

Either MUI runs out and Moro’s attack actually lands. Or Goku murks him in one attack. I’m hoping for the latter.

Neither of these are big twists though they are both expected outcomes

Either the Senzu will backfire on Goku or not taking Goku up on his offer will backfire on Moro

So if there is a twist for me it can’t be either of the above

[Cipher]

But, yeah, there's also the argument that, why the fuck even give him a senzu bean in the first place?! I never expected him to kill Moro after Moro was helpless and begging for mercy. Of course Goku wouldn't kill him, and there could have been any number of logical reasons for Goku to give Moro a senzu bean, but for his reason to be, "Moro, I'll restore you to full power if you promise you won't hurt anyone ever again and imprison yourself for eternity," I mean that is LAUGHABLE! Are you kidding me?!

I personally don’t see how anyone can look at the same pages I saw and think that Goku really expected Moro to take him up on the peaceful out, but I guess we’ll find out in a few days.

Goku’s reaction on Page 8 is not that of a man who is shocked his offer was refused. It’s a “Sigh, well, I thought so” one.

On Namek, he genuinely expects Freeza to run off somewhere and is surprised and disappointed when he doesn’t. Here, I think the reaction that would have surprised him would have been Moro actually cooperating. It’s (probably) just giving him one last character test, since Goku has the upper hand by such a large margin, even though he’s expecting him to blow it.

[ChronoTwigger]

So, I was right.
You should build me a golden statue.
Goku will give a sentzu bean to Moro.

And there's no strategy behind, is something modern manga lack a lot.
Honor.
Something that goes beyond the logical action to do.
If you'll strip out such things, Goku will become the sprite of your videogame and there will be no difference between Good and Evil.

That's DragonBall.
What some people asking for is GoblinSlayer.
You're in the wrong forum.

[GodVegetto91]

Toyotaro has gone full Ultra Instinct in this chapter, he wrote without thinking!

[Totamo]

Look, I already got my theory and if I am right, while I certainty don't think it will be pulled of to the finesse, it needs to be, People saying Goku wants to spare Moro or fight him at his best are going to have to be mystified.