Golden Ôzaru, Chibi GT Kakarrot and Legendary Broli

Bussani · Post by **Bussani** » Fri Jul 03, 2009 3:56 am

Maphisto86 wrote:
Bussani wrote:
Maphisto86 wrote: Didn't I say that? Anyway, I conceded the point to you my friend since based on what we saw in GT, there is more evidence in favor of the fact that Son Goku's tail would not turn golden until he reached SSJ3. I myself think it was an artist's error personally, but there is nothing to back that up except one illustration on the first GT Perfect File Book Cover. So really my view is more of an opinion then a statement of fact. Touche'.

Back on topic!
Oh, I just meant you said that it wasn't until halfway through the Super 17 saga, and I disagreed because it first happened in the Bebi saga, that's all. I'm not trying to ram my theory down anyone's throats here. XD
Wait what!? Do you mean we first saw Goku golden tailed in the Bebi Saga or that we actually saw him with a tail while SSJ1? I only remember the former. *scratches head*

It was first colored gold when he went SSJ3 against Bebi. Or am I misinterpreting what you said?

Maphisto86 · Post by **Maphisto86** » Fri Jul 03, 2009 4:58 am

Bussani wrote:It was first colored gold when he went SSJ3 against Bebi. Or am I misinterpreting what you said?

Nope that was my bad.

Yeah that's what I remember. It was not until he confronted Super 17 that Son Goku turned SSJ1 for the first time since getting his tail back. As we saw in the fight against Bebi, Goku went pretty much straight to SSJ3. We did not see his tail before the transformation was complete.

Bussani · Post by **Bussani** » Fri Jul 03, 2009 5:57 am

Maphisto86 wrote:
Bussani wrote:It was first colored gold when he went SSJ3 against Bebi. Or am I misinterpreting what you said?

Nope that was my bad.

Yeah that's what I remember. It was not until he confronted Super 17 that Son Goku turned SSJ1 for the first time since getting his tail back. As we saw in the fight against Bebi, Goku went pretty much straight to SSJ3. We did not see his tail before the transformation was complete.

Ah, then I was half wrong in that case.

And I just watched that part of GT recently, too... It just doesn't go into my head.

Wojak · Post by **Wojak** » Fri Jul 03, 2009 6:19 am

Goku: I'm so strong, that when I go supa saiyan three, G, even my tail goes shiny golden, y'all!

Vegeta: You trippin' cracka? I'm so hot, even Bebi want's ma body. Kha-zam!

Piccolo: I'm so green, I rule the world with my smexy Namekian shit all down from hell, pussies. Fuck that Super Saiyan three, man, and fuck that "Bebi" shit. It's slimy green that you want, and it you don't watch out I'll drive-by your sorry asses with my ding-dong and blinden you with ma shine!

Sorry, too much Weeklytubeshow...

But seriously, an in-universe explanation would be (for me) that Goku perfected the SSJ3, so his tail goes golden aswell. But, since he has a low stamina it won't help for long though, since he can't sustain the transformation.

Rocketman · Post by **Rocketman** » Fri Jul 03, 2009 10:27 am

Freeza Heika wrote:The big fallacy is that you are basing Saiyan physiology off of the physiology of Earth species. For all we know, It can be vastly different in respects that we can't perceive based soley off of their appearance to the naked eye. The application of terms like hair or fur could be completely superfulous.

It has to be identical to Human physiology or they couldn't cross-breed with Humans.

Senzu_Bean · Post by **Senzu_Bean** » Fri Jul 03, 2009 10:30 am

Bussani wrote:While I agree with both of your posts, there's also the fact that the 'Oozaru fur' on the tail is always a different color to their head of hair.

Oozaru fur is all from the same color - dark brown.

I personally believe a Saiyan tail goes gold in all SSJ states, except SSJ4 of course. The Super #17 arc is full of plotholes and is completely inconsistent contrary to 'DBGT - Perfect Files'. However the DBGT DVD Box features SSJ Chibi Goku with a brown tail...

Post by **Herms** » Fri Jul 03, 2009 11:04 am

Rocketman wrote:It has to be identical to Human physiology or they couldn't cross-breed with Humans.

But if they were completely identical to humans in all respects, then they wouldn't be Saiyans, would they?

Senzu_Bean · Post by **Senzu_Bean** » Fri Jul 03, 2009 11:28 am

Regarding the Saiyans' tail, again, Broly has brown tail while in LSSJ, seen in Movie 11.

Rocketman · Post by **Rocketman** » Fri Jul 03, 2009 11:30 am

Herms wrote:
Rocketman wrote:It has to be identical to Human physiology or they couldn't cross-breed with Humans.
But if they were completely identical to humans in all respects, then they wouldn't be Saiyans, would they?

Modern Humans - Homo sapiens

Neanderthals - Homo neanderthalensis

Saiyans - Homo horribilis

The original Saiyan homeworld? It's Earth! IT WAS EARTH ALL ALONG

Maphisto86 · Post by **Maphisto86** » Fri Jul 03, 2009 12:05 pm

Senzu_Bean wrote:Regarding the Saiyans' tail, again, Broly has brown tail while in LSSJ, seen in Movie 11.

Actually he was in his normal state in the large cloning tube. When he transforms we do not see his tail.

EDIT: Oh, wait! As a matter of fact we do . . .

JulieYBM · Post by **JulieYBM** » Fri Jul 03, 2009 1:04 pm

Didn't Son and Vegeta go Super Saiyan in episode 41, after the Tenka'ichi?

Senzu_Bean · Post by **Senzu_Bean** » Fri Jul 03, 2009 1:13 pm

^ Exactly!

JulieYBM wrote:Didn't Son and Vegeta go Super Saiyan in episode 41, after the Tenka'ichi?

Yep, but only their heads are seen.

Dayspring · Post by **Dayspring** » Fri Jul 03, 2009 1:15 pm

Rocketman wrote:
Herms wrote:
Rocketman wrote:It has to be identical to Human physiology or they couldn't cross-breed with Humans.
But if they were completely identical to humans in all respects, then they wouldn't be Saiyans, would they?
Modern Humans - Homo sapiens

Neanderthals - Homo neanderthalensis

Saiyans - Homo horribilis

The original Saiyan homeworld? It's Earth! IT WAS EARTH ALL ALONG

Oh shit! Pola and Roid go back in time. Neanderthals jump aboard as they fly off into space. They head to Plant, use Tsuffel tech to return to their own time. Neanderthals on Plant evolve into Saiyans. THE DAIZENSHUU/OVA WAS RIGHT AFTER ALL!

Maphisto86 · Post by **Maphisto86** » Fri Jul 03, 2009 2:07 pm

As my final take on the SSJ color of a Saiyan's tail, I prefer it golden furred. I take it like the question of what Bulma's hair color is. In the manga, her hair was colored purple (and sometimes even blue!). In the anime, it was a light green (except in the movie "The Path to Ultimate Strength"). I am not saying I am right but that judging by the drastic color swap we see in GT it is not an unreasonable conclusion that the tail color, like Bulma's hair, is creative license on the part of the animators. However, the in-universe explanation that Busani and others put forward is backed up by what little we have seen in GT and Movie 11. So that theory takes precedence for now.

Bussani · Post by **Bussani** » Fri Jul 03, 2009 7:39 pm

Senzu_Bean wrote: Oozaru fur is all from the same color - dark brown.

I didn't say it wasn't? My point is it's different to the person's hair color. If the person was blonde (I know, I know, all Saiyajin have black hair. Well, how about a half Saiyajin?), they would probably still have a brown tail. I'm not saying that completely validates my idea, just pointing out that there does seem to be a difference between a Saiyajin's head of hair and their Oozaru hair.

Maphisto86 · Post by **Maphisto86** » Fri Jul 03, 2009 11:49 pm

Bussani wrote:
Senzu_Bean wrote: Oozaru fur is all from the same color - dark brown.
I didn't say it wasn't? My point is it's different to the person's hair color. If the person was blonde (I know, I know, all Saiyajin have black hair. Well, how about a half Saiyajin?), they would probably still have a brown tail. I'm not saying that completely validates my idea, just pointing out that there does seem to be a difference between a Saiyajin's head of hair and their Oozaru hair.

Yes, as anyone who sees the anime can plainly see, a Saiyan's tail is a light to moderate brown color while their hair is black or brown. In King Vegeta's case, he is a rare brown haired Saiyan but the shades are different between his hair and the fur on his tail.

Wojak · Post by **Wojak** » Sat Jul 04, 2009 9:36 am

Rocketman wrote:
Herms wrote:
Rocketman wrote:It has to be identical to Human physiology or they couldn't cross-breed with Humans.
But if they were completely identical to humans in all respects, then they wouldn't be Saiyans, would they?
Modern Humans - Homo sapiens

Neanderthals - Homo neanderthalensis

Saiyans - Homo horribilis

The original Saiyan homeworld? It's Earth! IT WAS EARTH ALL ALONG

I would like to add that new research has shown that Homo Neanderthalensis and Homo Sapiens have cross-breed with success, as skeletons have been found showing individuals that are a mixture between those species.
Homo Neanderthalis was once also known as "Homo Sapiens Neanderthalensis", because of its strong similarities to Homo Sapiens, but it was shown that they diverted from the Homo Sapiens 500,000 years ago.

But to show a modern example, a horse and a donkey can cross-breed and give us a mule, showing that different species are indeed "cross-breedable".

With this I would like to say that Saiya-jins and humans don't have to be identical to cross-breed.

And I would like to add that although we belong to the species Homo Sapiens, our subspecies (the only one still existing) is Homo Sapiens Sapiens to be fully correct.

Rocketman · Post by **Rocketman** » Sat Jul 04, 2009 4:36 pm

Wojak wrote:But to show a modern example, a horse and a donkey can cross-breed and give us a mule, showing that different species are indeed "cross-breedable".

With this I would like to say that Saiya-jins and humans don't have to be identical to cross-breed

All male mules are sterile due to horses and donkeys having different numbers of chromosomes. Gohan isn't sterile.

Freeza Heika · Post by **Freeza Heika** » Sat Jul 04, 2009 4:46 pm

Rocketman wrote:
Wojak wrote:But to show a modern example, a horse and a donkey can cross-breed and give us a mule, showing that different species are indeed "cross-breedable".

With this I would like to say that Saiya-jins and humans don't have to be identical to cross-breed
All male mules are sterile due to horses and donkeys having different numbers of chromosomes. Gohan isn't sterile.

A wolf and a dog can breed, but they aren't the same species or sterile. A wolf is a more ferocious, stronger version of a dog, like a Saiyan seems like a more ferocious, stronger version of humans.

Rocketman · Post by **Rocketman** » Sat Jul 04, 2009 5:01 pm

Freeza Heika wrote:A wolf and a dog can breed, but they aren't the same species or sterile. A wolf is a more ferocious, stronger version of a dog, like a Saiyan seems like a more ferocious, stronger version of humans.

Wolf - Canis lupus

Domestic dog - Canis lupus familiaris

They are the same species.