Iconic scenes ruined by the dub?

[fadeddreams5]

I can think of more times the original version ruins the iconic scenes for me.

What does this mean?

I saw certain scenes in the dub version first. Then, I saw them in the Japanese version, and thought they were bad.

[ABED]

Do you still feel that way?

[Son Gohan 1995]

Id have to say Gohan's SSJ2 scene. The dub removed the song Tamashi VS Tamashi and also got rid of the Oozaru yell that accompanies Gohan's scream.

Don't forget the stupid monologue they put in.

[Son Gohan 1995]

Krillin's Death in Season 3's dub thanks to "Pop goes the weasel!" from Freeza.

What on earth were they thinking with that line!? *pop goes the weael?* seriously!? What's next? Ringa ringa roses?

[fadeddreams5]

Do you still feel that way?

I appreciate the Japanese version a lot more now. Back then, I just heard boring '60s music that put me to sleep. Now, I can see how that music works with the tone of the scene. I still prefer the dub version of most of those scenes though, such as Goku's SSJ and SSJ3 transformations. Just preference.

[Polyphase Avatron]

Am I the only one who actually sort of liked Linda Young as Freeza?

[fadeddreams5]

Am I the only one who actually sort of liked Linda Young as Freeza?

I never minded her. In fact, she was Frieza to me... until I heard Chris Ayres. It rare when you (as in, generally speaking) can prefer a new VA soooo much more than the one you grew up with. That pretty much says it all to me.

[kenisu3000]

In the Japanese version, one of the most powerful moments to me was when Goku says, "Kuririn-kun... He's been murdered!" Adding the suffix, which is something Goku never does, was a touch that really helped express Goku's pain.

Well, I hate to be the bubble-burster here, but Goku doesn't actually use the -kun suffix. This is one of the moments where Clyde happened to mishear the dialogue. Goku's line is "Kuririn ga... korosareta!" which is closer to "Kuririn's... been killed!"

[OmegaRockman]

In the Japanese version, one of the most powerful moments to me was when Goku says, "Kuririn-kun... He's been murdered!" Adding the suffix, which is something Goku never does, was a touch that really helped express Goku's pain.

Well, I hate to be the bubble-burster here, but Goku doesn't actually use the -kun suffix. This is one of the moments where Clyde happened to mishear the dialogue. Goku's line is "Kuririn ga... korosareta!" which is closer to "Kuririn's... been killed!"

Well. That just shattered my entire understanding of the scene. My whole life is a lie now!!! Despite that, I still don't think that changes my feelings on Nadolny's acting in the scene not being up to par when compared to Nozawa.

[Bullza]

Watching Kai now, at the part with Gohan vs Cell Kamehameha clash and everyone is chipping in to help.

It is nowhere near as good a scene without the Faulconer music. So Kai ruined that scene at least.

[IDreamtIWasABee]

It is nowhere near as good a scene without the Faulconer music. So Kai ruined that scene at least.

God, yes. I even like some of the Z dub's dialogue better. "This must be hard with all those wounds. I hope this makes them burn."

The dub created an iconic scene, by the way: Goku verbally slapping some sense into Vegeta so he'll fuse (the "birthrights" speech). Better than the anime, and worlds better than the manga.

[ABED]

The dub created an iconic scene

Did it really? I don't know if it's iconic, and even if it was, it wouldn't have created it.

Goku verbally slapping some sense into Vegeta so he'll fuse (the "birthrights" speech). Better than the anime, and worlds better than the manga.

There are some differences, but the dialog isn't that different.

Even if there are a few scenes the dub did better, the dub is so overwhelmingly worse in so many places that it swamps whatever scenes they might have done only moderately better, and it's no secret that I loathe the Faulconer music. One of the worst examples of how bad the dub ruined an iconic scene is Gohan turning SS2. The music is unmemorable, and the VO is patronizingly awful.

So Kai ruined that scene at least.

Really? It ruined the scene? It simply wasn't as good, it was outright ruined?

[Super Sonic]

Krillin's Death in Season 3's dub thanks to "Pop goes the weasel!" from Freeza.

What on earth were they thinking with that line!? *pop goes the weael?* seriously!? What's next? Ringa ringa roses?

That was sadistic gloating and making a bad pun.

[Bullza]

Really? It ruined the scene? It simply wasn't as good, it was outright ruined?

Yeah to me it really was. It answered what I had always asked myself for years prior to watching Kai.

"If I had watched DBKai first instead of DBZ would I have been as big of a fan as I am having watched DBZ first instead?"

Scenes like that gave me an answer, no I wouldn't have. I'd have really liked the show but I would never have been a huge fan, I would never have been on this site for example.

The DBZ dubbed w/Faulconer score version of that scene I've watched many times. I've even got a MP3 version of the scene on my IPod. The music and the dialogue makes it a very intense and epic scene.

And yeah I watched the scene in Kai earlier having finished Kai for the first time today and it wasn't nearly the same, the score was flat and dull and the dialogue wasn't memorable at all. My favourite scene in all DBZ was just "alright" in Kai.

There was other scenes in Kai that I felt the same about. Scenes I really like in DBZ with the Faulconer score being half the reason and then in Kai without that music the scene falls flat because it's lacking in any energy or intensity and fails to get me excited or interested.

[fadeddreams5]

The SSJ2 Gohan vs Cell scene in the Funi dub trounces every other version, imo. Not even close.

[supercat]

I really loved the exceptional job Chris Ayres did as Freeza though.

Why the "though"? He was in Kai, lol.

Also, topic creator, why do you use "Of" instead of "Have". I'm sorry for the question but I've seen many people do it and it never made sense to me, especially since I'm a non native speaker myself.

When it comes to the anime, I personally find both the scripting and voice acting done in Kai to be far more impressive. Between the passion emanating from each of the voices, and the well orchestrated dialogue, it's hard for me not to marvel at such a beautiful work of art.

Chris Ayres in particular, efficiently portrayed his character as he was meant to be depicted. Frieza was a sophisticated tyrant fueled by unfathomable levels of arrogance, yet somewhere deep inside, he was constantly plagued by a subtle trace of trepidation. I felt that Chris Ayres did a phenomenal job capturing all of these traits at the right times.

[ABED]

Care to give an example of the dialog in the dub and how it was ruined in Kai?

[Bullza]

Well some comparitive lines between Z and Kai for that scene

Z - You're all so anxious to die aren't you? Well all you had to was ask!
Kai - If you're in such a rush to meet Oblivion I'm more than happy to hurry you along.

The latter line lacked the intensity of what was said in Z.

The following yell by Gohan in Kai was much tamer than in Z.

Z - ...like Father like son right? Well I won't let you down.
Kai - ...I'm going all out, doing right by him.

Latter line is cheesy.

Z - Why can't you people just stay down!
Kai - I grow tired of your meddling.

So lame and again no intensity in the delivery.

Z - They just keep lining up to die!
Kai - You dare challenge ultimate perfection!

Same as above. Inferior line and delivery.

Then there's the scene where Tien gets up again and gives out a good solid yell before firing a blast off at Cell but in Kai it's so weak sounding that it's like he's about to sneeze.

Z - Ahhhh! No chance! You have no chance!
Kai - Bite at me all you want you puny knats you're all gonna diiie.

Horrible line delivery towards the end of that sentence, almost comedic.

Z - Say goodbye! *followed by a laugh"
Kai - Say hi to daaad *followed by a much weaker laugh*

Again just such a cheesy line that's almost comedic.

And then like I said the music was terrible in comparison and then they also cut out some lines and scenes like Vegeta hesitating on whether to go in or not and then shortly after he powers up and that's gone, I know that wasn't in the manga but the anime version was done far better than in the manga.

So yeah overall what was a great scene, a very intense, on the edge of your seat scene in Z was just a mediocre scene with weak delivery and little intensity in Kai. Kai did plenty of scenes better but that certainly wasn't one of them.

[ABED]

Z - Why can't you people just stay down!
Kai - I grow tired of your meddling.

So lame and again no intensity in the delivery.

I think you are making mountains out of molehills when you say it was ruined.

Z - ...like Father like son right? Well I won't let you down.
Kai - ...I'm going all out, doing right by him.

Latter line is cheesy.

Both could be argued are cheesy.

they also cut out some lines and scenes like Vegeta hesitating on whether to go in or not and then shortly after he powers up and that's gone, I know that wasn't in the manga but the anime version was done far better than in the manga.
I'd rather they didn't telegraph that moment.

So yeah overall what was a great scene, a very intense, on the edge of your seat scene in Z was just a mediocre scene with weak delivery and little intensity in Kai. Kai did plenty of scenes better but that certainly wasn't one of them.

Damn near every single one. I won't go into the music because there's nothing more to say than I think the dub music is altogether awful and doesn't understand DB in the least.

[Bullza]

I think you are making mountains out of molehills when you say it was ruined.

It was for me when one of the best moments in all of DBZ was just downright mediorce and tame in Kai.

Both could be argued are cheesy.

There's nothing cheesy about the first line. It's just a fairly ordinary line that was delivered well within the scene. Kai's line was pretty cheesy though, "I'm doing right by him"? Ugh no.

I'd rather they didn't telegraph that moment.

Maybe you could say that but his initial hesistation out of some kind of fear of Cell and then him over coming that and stepping in was done well without it being overly predictable what was happen to next.

Damn near every single one.

Well that's another matter, I personally think the Japanese music is one of the worst anime scores I've ever had to listen to and I went out of my way to replace the Kikuchi score with the original Kai score just so I didn't have to listen to it. I'm just talking about that one particular scene and for that scene the Z version runs circles around the Kai version due to the vastly superior dialogue, line delivery, additional scenes and score.