Which series has better powerscaling, GT or Super?

[Draconic]

Z, because it introduced the "rule" that any character with a higher battle power than x will tank all of x's attacks perfectly, never get affected by their techniques... basically turning everybody below that power level useless. It's bullshit and horrible and Super fixed this mess by ignoring it completely. GT still functioned by some of it, but in general it was better.

If Z isn't written so bad, you don't have all this discussion going on in the first place. You don't hear Jojo fans diss DIU because Jotaro gets beaten by a rat or call BT horrible because its main character wins fights he, by any right, should have no way winning... The diversity in that series is what makes it fun. In contrast, everything post-Nappa sucks all the diversity out of the battles all trough to Buu. In comparasion, Super and GT are breaths of fresh air.

Even though those two suffer their own problems, at least they try giving fights a chance to be fun.

[SupremeKai25]

Z, because it introduced the "rule" that any character with a higher battle power than x will tank all of x's attacks perfectly, never get affected by their techniques... basically turning everybody below that power level useless. It's bullshit and horrible and Super fixed this mess by ignoring it completely. GT still functioned by some of it, but in general it was better.

I actually never noticed Z did that until you pointed that out. Yeah, Super has plenty of instances when a stronger character gets damaged by the attack of a weaker opponent. Goku with Frost, Fused Zamasu with Goku, and Jiren with 17 are the main ones that come to mind.

[TobyS]

GT followed on from z where Goku hasn't got much stronger in 7 years of non stop heaven training outside ss3 (only slightly stronger than cell games Gohan with both in ss2)
And ss3 is said to bring a saiyans power to it's limits.

Ultimate and majin power ups are said to bring a character beyond their limits.

And yet between GT and end of z Goku is SS3 tier in base with no explanation?
Guidebooks say Gohan didn't stop training yet he uses ss1 again and isn't still stronger than Goku as he should be.

He doesn't get insta gibbed by ss4 tier opponents while using base or ss1... It's a shit show.

Super, at least brings in the whole god ki concept to give an explanation how characters could be on a whole new level.

Other than the manga having a bit of inconsistency around black versus vegeta era fights it's pretty well consistent.

17 who can tirelessly work out is only confirmed to be stronger than SS2 or maybe 3 which is only like a 4 times increase possibly for him in all those years. He never fights a god form.

Roshi beats one d list pride trooper, who's never compared to anyone else, who's carelesly underestimating them and being a scouter reliant douchebag type. (We even though from dialogue that outside toppo and Jiren the rest of the 8 weren't even necessarily the next best 8 in the universe they just took the pride troopers because it was easy as long as they had Jiren

The other humans had ab overpowered opponent set on them by freeza. There was nothing they could do about it. It's not their fault.

People put way too much emphasis on the roshi Jiren scene. They are either being dishonest or stupid. The whole point is it's a no kill tournament so of course Jiren has to be throwing roshi level punches not to gib him. He's also going to be a snob and not want to put more than minimal effort in he ignored Goku a bunch of times already. Context is everything yet people ignore him.

Scaling

Super manga>>>>>>
(Reeeeeeaaaal big drop off)
Super anime (dragged down mostly by toei filler)
>>GT

[sunsetshimmer]

He doesn't get insta gibbed by ss4 tier opponents while using base or ss1... It's a shit show.

Name examples. The only SSJ4 tier opponents Goku have fought in base/SSJ were Super 17, Omega and ressurected Nuova.
Super 17 was toying with him to absorb energy and trashed him after that.
Nuova was holding back pretending to be evil which didn't stop him from sending Goku through several buildings with single punch.
Omega completely stomped them and he was well known for holding back and underestimating his opponents all the time. The only exception here is never explained boost Goku got which let him tank Omega's attacks like they were nothing in episode 63.

Guidebooks say Gohan didn't stop training yet he uses ss1 again and isn't still stronger than Goku as he should be.

What you said right now is completely dumb. If ultimate form brings Gohan to his limit then why Ultimate Gohan in DBS is stronger than he was in Z? Nothing stops base GT Gohan from reaching what was his limit in DBZ. He doesn't need ultimate form to be stronger than he was in Z using this form. And who said he should be stronger than Goku? Gohan got stronger, but Goku got even more stronger. Simple as that.

[Tai Lung]

Shouldn't we talking we talking more about which series has better character writing, voice acting, musical score, animation and/or stronger martial arts atmosphere? As supposed to whether one persons feats can be comparable to the other?

Wouldn't it still be GT?

At least it is in my book. It wasn't perfect. In fact a lot of it was plain bad. But it absolutely managed to capture the feeling of a dying era. The heroes are getting older, the cost of so many narrowly averted catastrophes getting more apparent, and even Goku "leaves the world" after seeing the Diablo Desert and his first real enemy (Yamcha. The Poorest of Dolts) one last time. Canon or not, I still love it. Almost invokes a Lord of the Rings feel with Frodo leaving Middle Earth with the other Ring Bearers.

mmm no

or at least I can't see that ... the new generation almost did nothing ... while goku did everything and even vegeta participated less I feel that people overvalue the end too much ... since we really can't see how now the earthlings and z fighters would survive without dragon balls or goku

[It_Is_Ayna_You_Flips]

Shouldn't we talking we talking more about which series has better character writing, voice acting, musical score, animation and/or stronger martial arts atmosphere? As supposed to whether one persons feats can be comparable to the other?

Wouldn't it still be GT?

At least it is in my book. It wasn't perfect. In fact a lot of it was plain bad. But it absolutely managed to capture the feeling of a dying era. The heroes are getting older, the cost of so many narrowly averted catastrophes getting more apparent, and even Goku "leaves the world" after seeing the Diablo Desert and his first real enemy (Yamcha. The Poorest of Dolts) one last time. Canon or not, I still love it. Almost invokes a Lord of the Rings feel with Frodo leaving Middle Earth with the other Ring Bearers.

mmm no

or at least I can't see that ... the new generation almost did nothing ... while goku did everything and even vegeta participated less I feel that people overvalue the end too much ... since we really can't see how now the earthlings and z fighters would survive without dragon balls or goku

I know Goku did all the work and while that's disappointing (because I wanted to see humans not suck for at least one arc) I still think it works. Sort of like Oddyseus returning home at the end of the epic or Aurthur falling into an enchanted sleep with what's left of his knights or, hell, Beowulf dying with no real treasure to leave his kingdom. It's supposed to be sad because the era of heroism has ended and there's no one able to fill that gap. After this point there will be no heroes, no fantasy, and no romance (the classical meaning of romance, I mean).

[Zarely]

Super I suppose. GT made no sense at all.

[Block88]

GT
Super PowerScaling is an utter mess

[Kataphrut]

Z, because it introduced the "rule" that any character with a higher battle power than x will tank all of x's attacks perfectly, never get affected by their techniques... basically turning everybody below that power level useless. It's bullshit and horrible and Super fixed this mess by ignoring it completely. GT still functioned by some of it, but in general it was better.

If Z isn't written so bad, you don't have all this discussion going on in the first place. You don't hear Jojo fans diss DIU because Jotaro gets beaten by a rat or call BT horrible because its main character wins fights he, by any right, should have no way winning... The diversity in that series is what makes it fun. In contrast, everything post-Nappa sucks all the diversity out of the battles all trough to Buu. In comparasion, Super and GT are breaths of fresh air.

Even though those two suffer their own problems, at least they try giving fights a chance to be fun.

I'm with you there. Truth be told, I don't remember GT well enough to say if it did that, but Super definitely did and it's actually why I prefer its approach to battles. I like not being 100% certain how a fight is going to play out before it happens.

[Draconic]

Z, because it introduced the "rule" that any character with a higher battle power than x will tank all of x's attacks perfectly, never get affected by their techniques... basically turning everybody below that power level useless. It's bullshit and horrible and Super fixed this mess by ignoring it completely. GT still functioned by some of it, but in general it was better.

If Z isn't written so bad, you don't have all this discussion going on in the first place. You don't hear Jojo fans diss DIU because Jotaro gets beaten by a rat or call BT horrible because its main character wins fights he, by any right, should have no way winning... The diversity in that series is what makes it fun. In contrast, everything post-Nappa sucks all the diversity out of the battles all trough to Buu. In comparasion, Super and GT are breaths of fresh air.

Even though those two suffer their own problems, at least they try giving fights a chance to be fun.

I'm with you there. Truth be told, I don't remember GT well enough to say if it did that, but Super definitely did and it's actually why I prefer its approach to battles. I like not being 100% certain how a fight is going to play out before it happens.

Super 17's absorbtion abillity gave SSJ4 Goku a lot of trouble, even though Goku was stronger. Most of the Shadow Dragons were weaker than... well... everybody, especially Goku, but they all had some trick to them that made them special.

It didn't always work but they tried, especially after the first arc where they just kinda had to come up with excuses why Goku doesn't just turn Super Saiyan and destroy all his enemies. But from the Machine Mutants on, every villian had something going for him.

The problem with GT and why'd put Super higher still is because everyone who did have interesting abillities... eventually just kinda settled on being stronger. Baby's cool possesion technique just lead to him being the strongest, Super 17's the same etc.

[It_Is_Ayna_You_Flips]

Another thing I liked about "powerscaling" in GT was its attempts to make age relevant. The humans weren't just useless because they were humans, they were useless because most of them were 50 and hadn't drunk immortality elixer like Roshi had.