Saiyan hybrids in the stars?

Bussani · Post by **Bussani** » Mon Sep 15, 2008 1:34 am

Rocketman wrote:
Bussani wrote:
Velasa wrote:I always assumed that Goten and Trunks didn't have tails because someone had the sense to remove them before there were purple monkies running around.
Same, but if that quote from Toriyama is right he didn't agree with us.
It may be a quote from Toriyama, but it's one that must be ignored.

Fair enough. XD It's not an important question anyway really.

SaiyaMel · Post by **SaiyaMel** » Mon Sep 15, 2008 3:07 am

Then their tails were perma-removed after birth. Goten's probably by Piccolo.

Xyex · Post by **Xyex** » Mon Sep 15, 2008 11:40 am

I'm of the opinion that an active SSJ gene 'deactivates' the tail/Oozaru gene. Thus, as Goten and Trunks were born as SSJs they were also born without tails or the ability to ever grow one. And there's nothing in the canon that discounts that possibility.

Let's say Saiyans have 48 chromosomes, the extra pair containing the data for tails, Oozaru, and SSJ. Introduce Saiyan sperm to Human egg and....nothing. They cannot match up.

According to the genetics of our world.

But nothing says in Dragonball that there can't be something coded into the Saiya-jin DNA that makes it just replicate itself if there's no matching chromosome. Thus the Saiya-jins could have 52 of them and they'd still be compatible with humans, they'd just replicate the missing ones.

SaiyaMel · Post by **SaiyaMel** » Mon Sep 15, 2008 1:38 pm

I'm going with Rocketman's theory, as nothing in the canon discounts it either.

Bussani · Post by **Bussani** » Mon Sep 15, 2008 8:15 pm

Xyex wrote:I'm of the opinion that an active SSJ gene 'deactivates' the tail/Oozaru gene. Thus, as Goten and Trunks were born as SSJs they were also born without tails or the ability to ever grow one. And there's nothing in the canon that discounts that possibility.

Even though there's no real evidence for that, it does make sense. It's what a lot of fans used to think too. Saiyans are weird after all, the way they get stronger after recovering from intense injury. It isn't inconceivable that they could pass on major changes to their next generation. It makes them even more dangerous if you think about it.

Rocketman · Post by **Rocketman** » Mon Sep 15, 2008 8:42 pm

Bussani wrote:Even though there's no real evidence for that, it does make sense. It's what a lot of fans used to think too. Saiyans are weird after all, the way they get stronger after recovering from intense injury.

Humans do that in the real world, though on a lesser scale. That's what exercise is - damaging the muscles and connective tissues and stuff, then your body repairs them stronger.

Bussani · Post by **Bussani** » Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:31 pm

Rocketman wrote:
Bussani wrote:Even though there's no real evidence for that, it does make sense. It's what a lot of fans used to think too. Saiyans are weird after all, the way they get stronger after recovering from intense injury.
Humans do that in the real world, though on a lesser scale. That's what exercise is - damaging the muscles and connective tissues and stuff, then your body repairs them stronger.

True. I'd never thought of it that way.

Jackal puFF · Post by **Jackal puFF** » Sat Sep 27, 2008 1:24 am

I was right. Saiyan hybrids have to be out there.

lol just look at table and his wife.

Saiyan-Professor · Post by **Saiyan-Professor** » Sun Sep 28, 2008 2:12 pm

Jackal puFF wrote:I was right. Saiyan hybrids have to be out there.

lol just look at table and his wife.

How does that prove that hybrids are present in the Dragonball universe besides the ones on earth? I do not believe that it is ever mentioned whether Table and that little whatever it is that he is married to have any children.

Jackal puFF · Post by **Jackal puFF** » Mon Sep 29, 2008 8:18 pm

Saiyan-Professor wrote:
Jackal puFF wrote:I was right. Saiyan hybrids have to be out there.

lol just look at table and his wife.
How does that prove that hybrids are present in the Dragonball universe besides the ones on earth? I do not believe that it is ever mentioned whether Table and that little whatever it is that he is married to have any children.

I don't know, but they prob would in the future!

Kid Trunks · Post by **Kid Trunks** » Mon Sep 29, 2008 8:24 pm

Xyex wrote:I'm of the opinion that an active SSJ gene 'deactivates' the tail/Oozaru gene. Thus, as Goten and Trunks were born as SSJs they were also born without tails or the ability to ever grow one. And there's nothing in the canon that discounts that possibility.

What about the idea that, being hybrids, they had a 50-50 chance of having a tail or not? And it just happened that Gohan had a tail, while the rest (Goten, Trunks and Bra) didn't. And by the time Pan came along, her chances were minimal.

Saiyan-Professor · Post by **Saiyan-Professor** » Mon Sep 29, 2008 8:28 pm

Jackal puFF wrote:
Saiyan-Professor wrote:
Jackal puFF wrote:I was right. Saiyan hybrids have to be out there.

lol just look at table and his wife.
How does that prove that hybrids are present in the Dragonball universe besides the ones on earth? I do not believe that it is ever mentioned whether Table and that little whatever it is that he is married to have any children.
I don't know, but they prob would in the future!

I believe there are more Saiyan survivors on other worlds that bore hybrid children. However, the manga or the anime does not give us any evidence that that is the case. The closest we come to it is Table, but he might just be the one exception, and there is a lack of proof that he has kids or that thing he is married to can even have any cross-species children.

Super Ghost Kamikaze · Post by **Super Ghost Kamikaze** » Mon Sep 29, 2008 8:28 pm

Kid Trunks wrote:
Xyex wrote:I'm of the opinion that an active SSJ gene 'deactivates' the tail/Oozaru gene. Thus, as Goten and Trunks were born as SSJs they were also born without tails or the ability to ever grow one. And there's nothing in the canon that discounts that possibility.
What about the idea that, being hybrids, they had a 50-50 chance of having a tail or not? And it just happened that Gohan had a tail, while the rest (Goten, Trunks and Bra) didn't. And by the time Pan came along, her chances were minimal.

Or just the thought that they decided to remove the tails soon after birth, considering that there was no point in having it, and there would be several problems caused by them having tails.

Rocketman · Post by **Rocketman** » Mon Sep 29, 2008 8:49 pm

Kid Trunks wrote:What about the idea that, being hybrids, they had a 50-50 chance of having a tail or not? And it just happened that Gohan had a tail, while the rest (Goten, Trunks and Bra) didn't. And by the time Pan came along, her chances were minimal.

Genetics does not work that way! [/Morbo]

As for Pan:

Kid Trunks · Post by **Kid Trunks** » Mon Sep 29, 2008 9:00 pm

Rocketman wrote:
Kid Trunks wrote:What about the idea that, being hybrids, they had a 50-50 chance of having a tail or not? And it just happened that Gohan had a tail, while the rest (Goten, Trunks and Bra) didn't. And by the time Pan came along, her chances were minimal.
Genetics does not work that way! [/Morbo]

Maybe "Dragonball genetics" do

Keeping it nice and simple.

Dayspring · Post by **Dayspring** » Tue Sep 30, 2008 12:04 am

Kid Trunks wrote:
Rocketman wrote:
Kid Trunks wrote:What about the idea that, being hybrids, they had a 50-50 chance of having a tail or not? And it just happened that Gohan had a tail, while the rest (Goten, Trunks and Bra) didn't. And by the time Pan came along, her chances were minimal.
Genetics does not work that way! [/Morbo]
Maybe "Dragonball genetics" do Keeping it nice and simple.

Daizenshuu genetics claim being 1/4 Saiyan removes the ability to go Oozaru and SSJ, if that helps.

SSj_Rambo · Post by **SSj_Rambo** » Tue Sep 30, 2008 12:38 am

Dayspring wrote:Maybe "Dragonball genetics" do Keeping it nice and simple.

Daizenshuu genetics claim being 1/4 Saiyan removes the ability to go Oozaru and SSJ, if that helps.[/quote]
Does it clearly state that? It seems like something that wouldn't need to be stated (and would probably please a lot of people had it gone un-said...especially those Pan fanatics) and would make one less plot-hole for GT had it not been stated. Not to mention that it makes one of the most popular parts of GT a plot-hole.

Dayspring · Post by **Dayspring** » Tue Sep 30, 2008 12:43 am

SSj_Rambo wrote:
Dayspring wrote:Maybe "Dragonball genetics" do Keeping it nice and simple.
Daizenshuu genetics claim being 1/4 Saiyan removes the ability to go Oozaru and SSJ, if that helps.

Does it clearly state that? It seems like something that wouldn't need to be stated (and would probably please a lot of people had it gone un-said...especially those Pan fanatics) and would make one less plot-hole for GT had it not been stated. Not to mention that it makes one of the most popular parts of GT a plot-hole.[/quote]Very clearly:

"Since she is only 1/4 Saiyan, she can neither transform into a giant monkey nor become Super Saiyan."

The reason Pan never became SSJ in GT was to honor that rule. Then they toss that out with the GT special.

Velasa · Post by **Velasa** » Tue Sep 30, 2008 3:15 am

That's because they were boys, of course. Toriyama's basically said that the reason Bra or Pan never go ssj is because he couldn't figure out how to draw them. I call bullshit on his part.

Xyex · Post by **Xyex** » Wed Oct 01, 2008 2:23 pm

What about the idea that, being hybrids, they had a 50-50 chance of having a tail or not? And it just happened that Gohan had a tail, while the rest (Goten, Trunks and Bra) didn't. And by the time Pan came along, her chances were minimal.

What about it? If SSJ over rides Oozaru and tails then why would anyone after Gohan have a tail? Goten and Trunks were SSJs and I've no doubt that Bra was as well (GT not withstanding because it has no relevance to the discussion) since I figure SSJ is 'passed down' if one of the parents has it when the child is concieved. Hell, for that matter, Bra would have acess to SSJ2 from the start.

And we only see her for a short span of time at the end so there's nothing at all to contradict this. Same goes for Pan. There's a number of options open to her. She could have 'inheritied' Gohan's 'mystic' nature or she could have access to SSJ2 if Gohan still has that to pass on. The whole fifty fifty thing never made any sense.