If you had to choose one major character to die in Super...

DBZAOTA482 · Post by **DBZAOTA482** » Fri Jun 05, 2015 9:36 am

Ushabtis wrote:instead of killing Gohan, why not kill Videl and/or Chichi? I think it'd have the same affect and its two birds with one stone. and why not make Gohan Piccolo 2.0 with Pan and they train and stuff.

It would not. Especially not Chi-Chi... she's almost not a character anymore and people'd just be "Good, she ruined Gohan. I'm glad she's died".

Ushabtis · Post by **Ushabtis** » Fri Jun 05, 2015 12:59 pm

I was more meaning in the show it'd affect people, at least parts of the main cast. In terms of the dbz fans no one would care if she died. Heck I gave Super Buu a thumbs up when he turned her into an egg and squished her.

If we're talking killing off someone for the shock value of it, then Chichi would be a pointless one to choose. Personally I'd hate to see any character die just for the sheer shock value of it, no matter who it would be.

Cold Skin · Post by **Cold Skin** » Fri Jun 05, 2015 1:47 pm

It's hard to find anyone worthy of killing off.
If it's a major character, then it's a shame, because it prevents him from being part of the action and have opportunities to be in the spotlight.
If it's a minor character, then it's useless, because nobody will care among fans and it will be like "He's dead, huh? Oh well, whatever, let's keep going...".

So, having someone to die is really tricky since it's sort of a no-win situation.

DBZAOTA482 · Post by **DBZAOTA482** » Fri Jun 05, 2015 2:31 pm

Ushabtis wrote:I was more meaning in the show it'd affect people, at least parts of the main cast. In terms of the dbz fans no one would care if she died. Heck I gave Super Buu a thumbs up when he turned her into an egg and squished her.

If we're talking killing off someone for the shock value of it, then Chichi would be a pointless one to choose. Personally I'd hate to see any character die just for the sheer shock value of it, no matter who it would be.

...And that's why making Chi-Chi a full-fedge housewife was a big no-no (especially since Toriyama admitted he can only write one personality type for females). Unlike Videl it was not too late for her... she proved she can compete with the boys... except the heavyweights (Goku, Tenshithands, Kami, Piccolo) even if some deny it.

Maybe Super can make up for the lousy treatment Toriyama gave her.

Scott · Post by **Scott** » Fri Jun 05, 2015 3:47 pm

Beerus-sama wrote:
Scott wrote:I can't believe some people think killing off Goku is a good idea. Without Goku, you have no Dragon Ball. It may well be called Dragon Ball, but the story is more about Goku's life, the Dragon Balls have just happened to play a central role in his life.
We had the namek Saga focusing on Gohan, Krillin and Vegeta
The Android Saga was with the Z-Warriors trying to stop them without Goku.
The first episodes of the Buu saga were about Gohan's school life without Goku.

I think we can have a story without him

But we all knew Goku would be back. If Goku wasn't ever going to come back then it just wouldn't be the same.

soulnova · Post by **soulnova** » Fri Jun 05, 2015 4:07 pm

Scott wrote:
Beerus-sama wrote:
Scott wrote:I can't believe some people think killing off Goku is a good idea. Without Goku, you have no Dragon Ball. It may well be called Dragon Ball, but the story is more about Goku's life, the Dragon Balls have just happened to play a central role in his life.
We had the namek Saga focusing on Gohan, Krillin and Vegeta
The Android Saga was with the Z-Warriors trying to stop them without Goku.
The first episodes of the Buu saga were about Gohan's school life without Goku.

I think we can have a story without him
But we all knew Goku would be back. If Goku wasn't ever going to come back then it just wouldn't be the same.

Yeah, there's a big difference between temporarily unavailable to permanently dead. Not even GT killed him off. He went to "live on" with the Dragon Balls. I agree that the show shines when he's out of service but Toei would never kill him for good.

TheAldella · Post by **TheAldella** » Fri Jun 05, 2015 7:05 pm

Trunks and Bulma both. I like Vegeta's rage fits.

FortuneSSJ · Post by **FortuneSSJ** » Fri Jun 05, 2015 7:18 pm

Piccolo. His death in GT felt right.
I would like to Keep Krillin alive in this series, by the way.

OutlawTorn · Post by **OutlawTorn** » Sat Jun 06, 2015 1:53 am

Ushabtis wrote:well you don't have to be a major character to die to advance plot.

That's true, but I believe the point being made was the thread is asking which "major character" (not simply "which character") one would choose to die, which is why I would choose Goku as it would force a bit more creative writing than the lazy formula of everybody getting tossed around like rag dolls only for Goku to swoop in and save the day.

TheAldella · Post by **TheAldella** » Sat Jun 06, 2015 8:55 am

I'd also like to point out that Goku rarely actually delivered the final blow to any of his opponents post-Raditz. He got killed with Raditz, he did rock Nappa, but Krillin and Gohan defeated Vegeta, he rocked Recoome and Burter around, then Jeice got away, then he ultimately lost to Ginyu and got hospitalized for a good bit of time, failed to kill Frieza, which led to the earth being in danger, having Trunks save em, then he lost to 19, never met any of the other androids, lost to Cell, then died. Then he went "I may be on a losing streak, but I'm gonna act like I did everything and not do anything now", let Buu go free when he was a super saiyan 3, then had Vegeta help him try and beat Buu after that, then used the Earth's energy to beat Kid Buu.

This brings his Z tally to
3.5 wins, as I don't count the Spirit bomb as a full victory.
11 non-wins.
Goku might as well be a secondary character. Try a different creative approach, you guys. The whole "Let's kill Goku because the plot has him beat everybody" thing is not only getting stale, but it's kinda invalid.

Doctor. · Post by **Doctor.** » Sat Jun 06, 2015 9:05 am

I don't think people really want Goku dead because he "kills everybody". One of the major themes of Dragon Ball is passing down the torch. Toriyama has tried to put that theme to good use ever since the Cell arc but it constantly fails since Goku keeps getting back into the spotlight. I, personally, don't want Goku to die early (though that'd make for good shock value like the Saiyan arc), or even mid-way through the series, I'd want him to die permanently at the end of the series to pass down the torch and to give a final goodbye to an excellent character.

Rocketman · Post by **Rocketman** » Sat Jun 06, 2015 10:46 am

TheAldella wrote:Goku might as well be a secondary character. Try a different creative approach, you guys. The whole "Let's kill Goku because the plot has him beat everybody" thing is not only getting stale, but it's kinda invalid.

That's why people are thinking this, though. DBZ itself is an ensemble cast while everything since has been The Goku Show Featuring Goku, Goku, And Goku, With Special Guest Star Vegeta.

soulnova · Post by **soulnova** » Sat Jun 06, 2015 12:16 pm

TheAldella wrote:I'd also like to point out that Goku rarely actually delivered the final blow to any of his opponents post-Raditz. He got killed with Raditz, he did rock Nappa, but Krillin and Gohan defeated Vegeta, he rocked Recoome and Burter around, then Jeice got away, then he ultimately lost to Ginyu and got hospitalized for a good bit of time, failed to kill Freeza, which led to the earth being in danger, having Trunks save em, then he lost to 19, never met any of the other androids, lost to Cell, then died. Then he went "I may be on a losing streak, but I'm gonna act like I did everything and not do anything now", let Buu go free when he was a super saiyan 3, then had Vegeta help him try and beat Buu after that, then used the Earth's energy to beat Kid Buu.

This brings his Z tally to
3.5 wins, as I don't count the Spirit bomb as a full victory.
11 non-wins.
Goku might as well be a secondary character. Try a different creative approach, you guys. The whole "Let's kill Goku because the plot has him beat everybody" thing is not only getting stale, but it's kinda invalid.

Most of his kills come from the movies I guess.

TheAldella · Post by **TheAldella** » Sat Jun 06, 2015 12:26 pm

Rocketman wrote:That's why people are thinking this, though. DBZ itself is an ensemble cast while everything since has been The Goku Show Featuring Goku, Goku, And Goku, With Special Guest Star Vegeta.

But that's only been the case for Toei-written material. The movies and GT aren't apart of this argument. Even in Battle of Gods, Goku lost, and Vegeta got a rage boost. Then in RoF, Vegeta still got to beat on the baddies. But this time around, the whole crew got to play in the 100-man melee! I'm not seeing what the problem is if you stick to Toriyama works.

Rocketman · Post by **Rocketman** » Sat Jun 06, 2015 4:01 pm

TheAldella wrote:Even in Battle of Gods, Goku lost

Becoming more powerful than anyone ever, being so special and cool that he absorbed the god power, and his excellent special coolness convincing the enemy to stop and suck him off over how cool and awesome and wow and ~ooooh~ he is is not "losing".

If Z was like the new shit, Cell would've halted the Games and joined up because fighting Goku was so orgasmic he never wants to lose the opportunity.

and Vegeta got a rage boost.

And Vegeta got SS4 and did it easier than Goku.

Then in RoF, Vegeta still got to beat on the baddies. But this time around, the whole crew got to play in the 100-man melee! I'm not seeing what the problem is if you stick to Toriyama works.

Same as GT. The lesser characters get to beat up on the mooks, then get one-shotted until Holy Godku can descend and show how it's done.

Kid Buu · Post by **Kid Buu** » Sat Jun 06, 2015 4:06 pm

Rocketman wrote:Same as GT. The lesser characters get to beat up on the mooks, then get one-shotted until Holy Godku can descend and show how it's done.

GT had good music though.

fadeddreams5 · Post by **fadeddreams5** » Sat Jun 06, 2015 7:02 pm

Rocketman wrote:
If Z was like the new shit, Cell would've halted the Games and joined up because fighting Goku was so orgasmic he never wants to lose the opportunity.

If Z was like the new shit, Gohan would have lost his ability to go SSJ from that one week of no training too.

Ushabtis · Post by **Ushabtis** » Sat Jun 06, 2015 7:20 pm

fadeddreams5 wrote:If Z was like the new shit, Gohan would have lost his ability to go SSJ from that one week of no training too.

Low blow man...low blow

dbzfan7 · Post by **dbzfan7** » Sat Jun 06, 2015 7:36 pm

fadeddreams5 wrote:
Rocketman wrote:
If Z was like the new shit, Cell would've halted the Games and joined up because fighting Goku was so orgasmic he never wants to lose the opportunity.
If Z was like the new shit, Gohan would have lost his ability to go SSJ from that one week of no training too.

Nah he'd go the way of Tails and forget how to do anything super human. He'd just be a bookworm and nothing more.

DBZGTKOSDH · Post by **DBZGTKOSDH** » Mon Jun 08, 2015 7:32 am

Rocketman wrote:Becoming more powerful than anyone ever, being so special and cool that he absorbed the god power, and his excellent special coolness convincing the enemy to stop and suck him off over how cool and awesome and wow and ~ooooh~ he is is not "losing".

How is this different from what we saw in the whole manga? Goku has been the special prodigy that surpasses everyone and learns everything fast since the very beginning to the very end... Even when Gohan & Gotenks surpased him by far, only the amazing Goku could save the day.

Rocketman wrote:Same as GT. The lesser characters get to beat up on the mooks, then get one-shotted until Holy Godku can descend and show how it's done.

Most of the time, Goku loses his fights, and even when he wins, he needs help from others most of the time...

Kanzenshuu

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