Did Toriyama Say DBO is Canon?

[Herms]

If anything , it actually retcons some things he said about DB, like Vegeta being the first to die due to bad blood pressure.

What?

He says that in Daizenshuu 4:

"Everybody dies eventually, but Vegeta seems like he has high blood pressure so he'll probably go suddenly."

[NeoKING]

But other than that, we have absolutely no proof he came up with anything story related for now.

If you recognize Toriyama style, you know he created most of the backstory

You can't seriously be using this as your point, right? Anyone can copy Toriyama's style - anyone's literary style can be emulated, no matter how notable or unique it may be. He's human, like the rest of us. There are many manga-ka who have similar imaginations to Toriyama, you know.

[Fox666]

He says that in Daizenshuu 4:

"Everybody dies eventually, but Vegeta seems like he has high blood pressure so he'll probably go suddenly."

Thanks. I must say that for me the "blood pressure" response is a joke.

You can't seriously be using this as your point, right? Anyone can copy Toriyama's style - anyone's literary style can be emulated, no matter how notable or unique it may be. He's human, like the rest of us. There are many manga-ka who have similar imaginations to Toriyama, you know.

I guess that is a possibility. However it seems for me that Toei never found a written that could really simulate a story with the style of quality of Toriyama.

[Michsi]

Thanks. I must say that for me the "blood pressure" response is a joke.

Yeah, but it doesn't sound funnier than the porn magazine based reproduction idea. And maybe he meant it back then, since this type of odd humour is part of DB.

[HECTOR4]

I've said.
No matter whether or not ideas of Toriyama, no matter whether or not a videogame, all you need something to be canon is to be part of the original work. Toriyama has said that DBO is part of her comic (is the continuation of her cómic)...therefore, of course, is part of the original work and therefore is as canonical as the comic itself.

Whenever something is official and is part of the original work, is canonical.

That is the meaning of canon, "to be part of the original work."

[Herms]

I'm with Herms on this to an extent. Some of the background seems to have been purely Toriyama, but there are some things that I have difficulty believing were entirely his work. Like I mentioned earlier, I really doubt he would have remembered the bit about Bob and Margaret. I think someone else working on the game came up with that bit. If anything, it's more of a collaboration between him and the staff.

It's not even so much that I think some things don't sound like they came from him, it's that saying "this seems like something he'd write, so he must have written it" isn't a very good arguement. Some people think the backstory for the majin race sounds like pure Toriyama, others disagree, and there's no real way to establish who's right, barring more details being revealed on what exactly Toriyama contributed. And even if something were universally agreed to sound like something Toriyama came up with, it could just seem that way because it was written by someone imitating his style, like neoKING said.

[Bussani]

Toriyama has said that DBO is part of her comic (is the continuation of her cómic)...therefore, of course, is part of the original work and therefore is as canonical as the comic itself.

No, he didn't. He said it's set in a world after the manga. GT is also set in a world after the manga. Just being a sequel to something doesn't always make it part of that something's canon, even, believe it or not, when it's written by the same author.

[TheDevilsCorpse]

Toriyama has said that DBO is part of her comic (is the continuation of her cómic)...therefore, of course, is part of the original work and therefore is as canonical as the comic itself.

Toriyama ought to be offended...

[Metalwario64]

Toriyama has said that DBO is part of her comic (is the continuation of her cómic)

Who's comic are you referring to?

[HECTOR4]

No, he didn't. He said it's set in a world after the manga. GT is also set in a world after the manga. Just being a sequel to something doesn't always make it part of that something's canon, even, believe it or not, when it's written by the same author.

Let's see ... Here's a reading comprehension problem or something:

"begins in a world 250 years after the manga."

What is the meaning of that phrase? It means that DBO is based on the comic, which continues after that story, that continues after the comic, and it´s the same world. Is obvious, by scrupulous you are, or wish you many turns to the topic. That is what Toriyama means and nothing else. We speak of "in a world..." is a form of expression, nothing more. And that is what many use as an excuse for not accepting the obvious.

Never said that DBGT was based on a comic book world after. Not to continue the comic. DBGT is based only and exclusively in the anime. Never said otherwise. DBGT isn´t based on the comic. I could never be its continuation.


While DBO is only based on the comic, then it´s obvious that continue from there and be part of history. DBO continues to manga, not anime, and therefore as the only official product that continues the comic, is the only canon with him. Is logic and obvious.

Toriyama has said that DBO is part of her comic (is the continuation of her cómic)...therefore, of course, is part of the original work and therefore is as canonical as the comic itself.

Toriyama ought to be offended...

Why? Toriyama isn´t as close-minded as many fan-boys.

Toriyama has said that DBO is part of her comic (is the continuation of her cómic)

Who's comic are you referring to?

Dragon Ball manga (drawing by Akira Toriyama).

[Michsi]

So basically what you are saiying is that from now on, if Toriyama ever decides to make anything DB related, especially if it's supposed to represent post manga events, he should be mindful that it doesn't clash with DBO's plot ?


Well , so much for old man Goku .....

On the other hand, DBO events are set far away enough in time , to allow room for a million other stories that have to clash with anything.

[dbgtFO]

Toriyama has said that DBO is part of her comic (is the continuation of her cómic)...therefore, of course, is part of the original work and therefore is as canonical as the comic itself.

Toriyama ought to be offended...

Why? Toriyama isn´t as close-minded as many fan-boys.

TheDevilsCorpse is referring to the fact that you are calling Toriyama a female, when you assign him the possesive form(her) of the personal pronoun "she" instead of giving him "his."

[ArchedThunder]

A female Toriyama? Now that is disturbing. *shivers*

[HECTOR4]

So basically what you are saiying is that from now on, if Toriyama ever decides to make anything DB related, especially if it's supposed to represent post manga events, he should be mindful that it doesn't clash with DBO's plot ?


Well , so much for old man Goku .....

No, not that.

So far the only product that was exclusively canon was the comic. There has been no product based strictly on the comic. All products appeared were based in the anime (video games, movies, OVAs, etc.). And the anime has never been canon. Never.

Now, the only product appeared and strictly based on the comic is the DBO. And logically is part of the original work. It´s the only product it is. With DBO is the first time you run from everything created by Toei and works by having the original work of Toriyama as the only benchmark.

All other products (anime, videogames, etc.) have their own history, but a history not related to the comic. These stories are not related to the canonical history.

But this has always been. It's not something that arises now.

The anime (and all its derivatives) has never been canonical. And other DB stories may appear valid in themselves, but not canonical. Without any problems.

On the other hand, DBO events are set far away enough in time , to allow room for a million other stories that have to clash with anything.

Exists an extensive and developed chronology (age 784 to age 1.000) with no room for almost anything.

But other stories can be created out of the canon. Stories based on the anime, What ifs, videogames based on the anime, etc...

TheDevilsCorpse is referring to the fact that you are calling Toriyama a female, when you assign him the possesive form(her) of the personal pronoun "she" instead of giving him "his."

Oh ... OK ... It's because of Google Translator (and my English so poor) XDDD ... Sorry, sorry ...Is my fail...U.U

[Adamant]

A female Toriyama? Now that is disturbing. *shivers*

[Michsi]

So far the only product that was exclusively canon was the comic. There has been no product based strictly on the comic. All products appeared were based in the anime (video games, movies, OVAs, etc.). And the anime has never been canon. Never.

I disagree. DBGT not canon? Maybe. DBZ not canon? Definetely NOT. There are plenty of examples why I don't think this argument is fair. IMO the strongest and surest example is Bardock.
He is an anime original character that has been written IN the the manga. What more proof does one need to see how much he acknowledges the anime? And Toriyama offered so many additional information and I believe he even mentioned something about the anime expanding the story , something that he himself couldn't do so in the manga.
Take for instance a filler scene from the saiyan saga. It was Toriyama's sugestion that Piccolo use the splitform whe he trained alone. Even though that is not in the manga, I consider it canon. It was Toriyama's idea and nothing in the manga contradicts it.
Same as namekian hearing being senstive to high pitched sounds. As far as I know, this has never been stated anywhere in the manga , yet it's an universally accepted characteristic of this race.

According to all of this, Toriyama worked more with the anime staff than with the DBO staff. because 95% of it confirmed to be his own ideas.

I seriously can't see how one can consider DBO canon and not DB/DBZ.

Exists an extensive and developed chronology (age 784 to age 1.000) with no room for almost anything.
But other stories can be created out of the canon. Stories based on the anime, What ifs, videogames based on the anime, etc...

Umm , no, not really. I myself could come up with a million story ideas that never need to touch any of the elements brought up by DBO.
Toriyama even said at the end of the manga something like "don't worry, for Son Goku and his friends will have plenty more adventures..." (or something like that), but according to DBO, nothing happens and all they do is grow old.

[Bussani]

Let's see ... Here's a reading comprehension problem or something:

"begins in a world 250 years after the manga."

What is the meaning of that phrase? It means that DBO is based on the comic, which continues after that story, that continues after the comic, and it´s the same world. Is obvious, by scrupulous you are, or wish you many turns to the topic. That is what Toriyama means and nothing else. We speak of "in a world..." is a form of expression, nothing more. And that is what many use as an excuse for not accepting the obvious.

Never said that DBGT was based on a comic book world after. Not to continue the comic. DBGT is based only and exclusively in the anime. Never said otherwise. DBGT isn´t based on the comic. I could never be its continuation.


While DBO is only based on the comic, then it´s obvious that continue from there and be part of history. DBO continues to manga, not anime, and therefore as the only official product that continues the comic, is the only canon with him. Is logic and obvious.

I reiterate: just being a sequel or continuation doesn't guarantee something is part of the original's canon. You're confusing canon with continuity again.

[Fox666]

"begins in a world 250 years after the manga."

Just to note that this tells nothing about the canonicity of it. You guys are seeing things that don't exist.

It's only a time-line reference. 749 is the year which Goku and Bulma meet.

[Raykugen]

Toriyama has said that DBO is part of her comic (is the continuation of her cómic)...therefore, of course, is part of the original work and therefore is as canonical as the comic itself.

Toriyama ought to be offended...

HECTOR4 is from spain, he don't talks english.

According to all of this, Toriyama worked more with the anime staff than with the DBO staff. because 95% of it confirmed to be his own ideas.

I seriously can't see how one can consider DBO canon and not DB/DBZ.

Definitelly NOT, DBZ is an anime like whatever based in an original manga, Toriyama only drew some anime characters (not too much) and gave some ideas.
And of course the 95% are his ideas, because is an anime, an animation series based on a original manga, an animation copy!
Akira Toriyama has designed the most of characters and designs of DB online. And also, he participated in the main story. He worked with the studio of DB online

[TheDevilsCorpse]

Toriyama has said that DBO is part of her comic (is the continuation of her cómic)...therefore, of course, is part of the original work and therefore is as canonical as the comic itself.

Toriyama ought to be offended...

HECTOR4 is from spain, he don't talks english.

So? I'm aware, and I don't care. It doesn't make it any less funny in my opinion...