Gohan was SSj 2 when he used the Kamehameha on Buu's shell.

[Savage68]

How plausible do you think this is?

Keep in mind the following:

- Kibito saw/felt how powerful SSj 2 Gohan was at the Budokai.

- After Kibito is revived, Kaioshin tells him that he never got to see how powerful Gohan really was.

- Gohan certainly wasn't SSj 2 against Dabura or when he fought Majin Buu.

- Gohan's aura appeared more SSj 2-esque than it had previously been(when he used Kamehameha).

- Lightning isn't always present for SSj 2. Kid SSj 2 Gohan had no lightning in his aura throughout pretty much his entire struggle with Super Perfect Cell.

- This would also further serve as an explanation as to why he never used SSj 2 against Buu; It was because he used up a tremendous amount of energy with the Kamehameha prior to fighting.

[Kaboom]

Powering up for and then using a particularly powerful attack is one of the instances where a Super Saiyan stage's normal appearance can be "overwritten." For this and the other reasons you listed, it's possible he actually managed to push himself into SSj2 for the attack for the first time since at the tournament.

But it would still beg the question as to why he was still back in just SSj1 after the attack. Perhaps the Kamehameha did drain him.

[Piccolo Daimao]

I think that was just Son Gohan's Super Saiyan form at full power, not anything like Super Saiyan 2. The aura is also a bad indicator for Super Saiyan forms, but Son Goku had a SSJ2-esque aura as a Super Saiyan Full Power. Though that kind of turned back into a regular Super Saiyan aura afterwards, though that could be because he had used up a lot of energy by then.

Keep in mind that a Super Saiyan 2's aura actually does resemble a Super Saiyan 3rd Grade's aura as well.

But anyway, I think Gohan was a regular Super Saiyan, just powered up to the max, when he fired the Kamehameha at Majin Boo's shell.

[Savage68]

So how do you explain the comment Kaioshin made to Kibito?

[Rocketman]

Gohan has no lightning in those panels, but Goku and Vegeta do on the very next page. So no, he's not a SS2.

So how do you explain the comment Kaioshin made to Kibito?

Supreme Kai is a dumbass.

[Godo]

Supreme Kai is a dumbass.

I think that comment actually explains everything that comes out of his mouth.
Even Goku, Vegeta and Gohan disregarded most of the things he said and were like "naaah, it's OK".
Vegeta even thought that Fat Buu could be defeated until he powered up, and Kaioshin shat his pants before he even powered up.

[Kaboom]

Keep in mind that a Super Saiyan 2's aura actually does resemble a Super Saiyan 3rd Grade's aura as well.

Uh, no it doesn't. Super Saiyan 2 has a jagged, fierce aura with lightning bolts in it. SSj Grade 3's aura is all freaked-out and volatile and just has lightning-shaped tips.


Super Saiyan 2
Super Saiyan Grade 3

Supreme Kai is a dumbass.

I think that comment actually explains everything that comes out of his mouth.

I wholeheartedly agree. The Majin Boo arc as a whole makes a truckload of a lot more sense if you simply assume Kaioshin has no f*cking clue what he's talking about.

[Savage68]

Gohan has no lightning in those panels, but Goku and Vegeta do on the very next page.

Yeah, we've all known this for quite some time now. But I mentioned in the OP that SSj 2 kid Gohan also had lightning absent from his aura during his entire beam struggle with Cell. Goku also didn't have lightning for his first showing of SSj 2, although that's not nearly as good an example as the kid Gohan thing.

Supreme Kai is a dumbass.

I really hope you're not citing the crap that went down in Babidi's ship.

[Kaboom]

Charging Ki for and then using an attack can "override" the way an aura normally looks. Such was the case with Gohan and Cell's Kamehameha clash.

[Savage68]

I know that charging-up can alter the established aura, but I've never seen any other SSj 1 characters retain that look throughout the entirety of an attack.

Even SSj Goku's aura remains exactly the same when he uses a Kamehameha.

[Godo]

I really hope you're not citing the crap that went down in Babidi's ship.

It's actually almost everything he says that has to do with power. He even thinks that Gohan could defeat Buu after the Z-sword training.
Except for the part where he claims that any Kaioshin could kill Freeza in one blow. Any Super Saiya-jin past the three years of training, before the arrival of Dr. Gero, can do that.

[Savage68]

It's actually almost everything he says that has to do with power. He even thinks that Gohan could defeat Buu after the Z-sword training.

What's wrong with that? He didn't know precisely what kind of power boost the sword training would yield, and Gohan didn't even get to finish it.

Except for the part where he claims that any Kaioshin could kill Freeza in one blow. Any Super Saiya-jin past the three years of training, before the arrival of Dr. Gero, can do that.

So, what's the problem with this?

I just don't recall any time Kaioshin has been erroneous in his ki-sensing, that was actually his fault.

[Godo]

I just don't recall any time Kaioshin has been erroneous in his ki-sensing, that was actually his fault.

Eh... which manga have you read?

[Savage68]

Probably Dragon Ball.

Can you give me any examples that meet the criteria or not?

[Godo]

Probably Dragon Ball.

Can you give me any examples that meet the criteria or not?

Unless you count in the fact of Kaioshin already have sensed SSJ2 Gohan's power, and yet being afraid of Yakon, Pui Pui and Dabra? Do I even need to mention those?

[Kaboom]

Kaioshin witnesses Super Saiyan 2 Gohan's power right in front of him, yet still thinks they're in any danger from pathetic chumps like PuiPui and Yakon. Thus, tries to insist that they gang up on said pathetic chumps instead of suggesting SSj2 Gohan wipe them out quickly and easily.

Later he thinks that swinging a sword around for a few hours has miraculously quadrupled Gohan's power or whatever would be required to beat Boo at that point.

Later on after fusing with Kibito he's still incapable of judging anyone's power, as he thinks he'll actually do any good against Boo.

In the anime, he thinks Kid Boo is the strongest one of them all.

On top of it all, he somehow infects Piccolo with the stupid-bug, as Piccolo continuously makes all sorts of goofy and quickly-proven-wrong assumptions about Gotenks' power (though, in fairness, at least these were almost entirely for comedic purposes).

[Savage68]

Unless you count in the fact of Kaioshin already have sensed SSJ2 Gohan's power, and yet being afraid of Yakon, Pui Pui and Dabra? Do I even need to mention those?

lol Godo

Kaioshin was stunned that heavily suppressed base Saiyans were able to easily dispatch of Babidi's goons, and without losing any energy(the ones he assumed were powerful). He never seriously thought Pui-Pui or Yakon was a through-and-through threat to them all.

And of course, there's the big thing, which is that Spopovich's ki was incapable of being sensed, and the same probably applies to Babidi's other Majin goons. He said it himself, "Babidi has strong fighters!", or whatever. He assumed they all were powerful.

He only questioned whether or not Gohan would be able to take Buu after transforming(post Z-Sword), which makes perfect sense given that Buu isn't SSj 3-tier and they frankly had no other option at that point. This of course, is ignoring the fact that it was a comedy panel, not dissimilar to Piccolo jumping the gun about base Gotenks possibly being able to defeat Super Buu.

[Godo]

lol Godo

Lol back at ya!

Kaioshin was stunned that heavily suppressed base Saiyans were able to easily dispatch of Babidi's goons, and without losing any energy(the ones he assumed were powerful).

Which further shows his shitty abilities to sense powers, which further puts him down at the dumb-scale. Even Dabra could sense that they were strong. Heck, even Kuririn was shown to have that ability.

He never seriously thought Pui-Pui or Yakon was a through-and-through threat to them all.

...
Obviously he did since he was scared of Goku and the others fighting them in base.

And of course, there's the big thing, which is that Spopovich's ki was incapable of being sensed, and the same probably applies to Babidi's other Majin goons. He said it himself, "Babidi has strong fighters!", or whatever. He assumed they all were powerful.

And yet Vegeta went into the fight in base, having already estimated that Pui Pui was weak, and so did Goku against Yakon.
And Goku estimated Dabra to be equal to Cell, which would clearly be odd if he couldn't sense his ki.

He only questioned whether or not Gohan would be able to take Buu after transforming(post Z-Sword), which makes perfect sense given that Buu isn't SSj 3-tier and they frankly had no other option at that point.

Even thinking that Gohan with some weight training would be horrendously stupid after seeing Vegeta fighting Buu.

This of course, is ignoring the fact that it was a comedy panel, not dissimilar to Piccolo jumping the gun about base Gotenks possibly being able to defeat Super Buu.

Even so, it counts, right? It's like saying that Vegeta wouldn't mind that Goku gave old Kaioshin nude pics of Bulma since it was only a comedy panel. Kaioshin said it, face it.

You are trying to make this into more than it is. The manga clearly shows on several occasions that Kaioshin is incompetent and dumb. You are just ignoring it.

[Savage68]

Lol back at ya!

ROFFLE!

Even Dabra could sense that they were strong.

Dabura senses who's stronger than who amongst beings that are all suppressed to 0. Then, 5 minutes later, he's surprised that base Goku was twice as strong as Yakon, who he thought would surely handle them. If you think Dabura can sense anything correctly, you'd have to be wrong.

Obviously he did since he was scared of Goku and the others fighting them in base.

You're not getting it. He didn't realize that they could kill Babidi's fighters without even powering up. Sorry, but 'them all' clearly didn't mean 'them all, if they went all-out'.

And yet Vegeta went into the fight in base, having already estimated that Pui Pui was weak, and so did Goku against Yakon.

...Yes, because like I said, they can't sense their ki. Why would that hold true for Spopovich and none of the others? Why would Goku & Vegeta go into fights and just presume that their opponents would warrant SSj or higher?

And Goku estimated Dabra to be equal to Cell, which would clearly be odd if he couldn't sense his ki.

He had to ask Kaioshin whether or not Dabura was strong. Not just how strong he was; he didn't have any kind of grasp on the guy's power. The closest thing he could've made to his loose estimation on Dabura's power was when he used his speed and power outside of the ship. He changed his mind about his initial peg once Dabura started fighting, so he obviously didn't have a good grasp on how strong Dabura was before that.

Even thinking that Gohan with some weight training would be horrendously stupid after seeing Vegeta fighting Buu.

This would be valid had Gohan's base been weaker than Vegeta's which it apparently wasn't, since it was even stronger than Goku's. Which means they came to the reasoning that his SSj 2 was also stronger.

Even so, it counts, right? It's like saying that Vegeta wouldn't mind that Goku gave old Kaioshin nude pics of Bulma since it was only a comedy panel. Kaioshin said it, face it.

I am facing it, br0seph. It was a comedy panel, and still wasn't outright wrong on top of that. I can understand how it feels when something you've been using as rule of thumb for the series is being challenged, but that's just too bad.