Times when Vegeta is stronger than Goku

[Cootie]

Can anyone tell me every point in the series when Vegeta is stronger than Goku? It can include times when Goku has been weakened via heart virus and what not as well. Was Vegeta stronger than Goku at any time other than when they first met?

I know that Vegeta was a fair bit stronger than Goku in the Saiyan Saga. It seemed as though doing the Kaio-Ken required to injure Vegeta was doing more damage on Goku's own body than it was doing to Vegeta. I am also wondering that if early in the Android arc if Vegeta in SSJ form is stronger than Goku in SSJ form even when Goku is cured of the heart virus.

[Rocketman]

Vegeta is stronger than Goku from Goku's birth up to some point in Goku's training on the way to Namek.

When Goku gives Vegeta a Senzu as he arrives to fight the Ginyu Force, Vegeta is again stronger, and remains so until Goku finishes healing in the tank.

Due to Super Saiyan, Goku is stronger until some point during the training for the Androids. Super Saiyan Vegeta is stronger than Super Saiyan Goku from that point until Goku exits the Time Chamber with Gohan.

Goku remains slightly ahead in SS1 and 2 due to the benefits of afterlife training, but SS3 completely leaves Vegeta behind for the rest of the series.

[Cootie]

Due to Super Saiyan, Goku is stronger until some point during the training for the Androids. Super Saiyan Vegeta is stronger than Super Saiyan Goku from that point until Goku exits the Time Chamber with Gohan.

I always though during the early Android arc that Vegeta was stronger than Goku once he reached SSJ even when Goku was cured of the heart virus. Some people argued with me on that, but I still think that Vegeta's training was well beyond what Goku was doing.

[Piccolo Daimao]

Due to Super Saiyan, Goku is stronger until some point during the training for the Androids. Super Saiyan Vegeta is stronger than Super Saiyan Goku from that point until Goku exits the Time Chamber with Gohan.

I always though during the early Android arc that Vegeta was stronger than Goku once he reached SSJ even when Goku was cured of the heart virus. Some people argued with me on that, but I still think that Vegeta's training was well beyond what Goku was doing.

Isn't that exactly what Rocketman's saying, though?

[Nazi Cola]

Due to Super Saiyan, Goku is stronger until some point during the training for the Androids. Super Saiyan Vegeta is stronger than Super Saiyan Goku from that point until Goku exits the Time Chamber with Gohan.

I always though during the early Android arc that Vegeta was stronger than Goku once he reached SSJ even when Goku was cured of the heart virus. Some people argued with me on that, but I still think that Vegeta's training was well beyond what Goku was doing.

I think Vegeta was stronger. But you'll always have the people that think Goku was stronger nonetheless.

[Piccolo Daimao]

Due to Super Saiyan, Goku is stronger until some point during the training for the Androids. Super Saiyan Vegeta is stronger than Super Saiyan Goku from that point until Goku exits the Time Chamber with Gohan.

I always though during the early Android arc that Vegeta was stronger than Goku once he reached SSJ even when Goku was cured of the heart virus. Some people argued with me on that, but I still think that Vegeta's training was well beyond what Goku was doing.

I think Vegeta was stronger. But you'll always have the people that think Goku was stronger nonetheless.

Piccolo says that Vegeta may have surpassed Goku, and then later says that he has seemed stronger than Goku since he became a Super Saiyan. Nothing suggests that Goku is any stronger than Vegeta post-3 years training, and only that the two are at least equal.

[Afr0Blu3]

I feel Vegeta was stronger at that point for the fact that Vegeta was pushing himself to the limits day in and day out to breaking point while Goku went out and trained with Gohan and Piccolo, training which while effective probably wasn't as intensive, and was home for dinner to keep Chi-Chi happy.

[Cootie]

I always though during the early Android arc that Vegeta was stronger than Goku once he reached SSJ even when Goku was cured of the heart virus. Some people argued with me on that, but I still think that Vegeta's training was well beyond what Goku was doing.

Isn't that exactly what Rocketman's saying, though?

Yes, and I was agreeing with him while adding in a little of my own thoughts.

[Nazi Cola]

Piccolo says that Vegeta may have surpassed Goku, and then later says that he has seemed stronger than Goku since he became a Super Saiyan. Nothing suggests that Goku is any stronger than Vegeta post-3 years training, and only that the two are at least equal.

That's what I'm saying. But you'll still have those people that insist Piccolo doesn't know what he's talking about and that Goku was still stronger, or he got a magical zenkai after healing from the heart virus and was stronger again.

[Piccolo Daimao]

Piccolo says that Vegeta may have surpassed Goku, and then later says that he has seemed stronger than Goku since he became a Super Saiyan. Nothing suggests that Goku is any stronger than Vegeta post-3 years training, and only that the two are at least equal.

That's what I'm saying. But you'll still have those people that insist Piccolo doesn't know what he's talking about and that Goku was still stronger, or he got a magical zenkai after healing from the heart virus and was stronger again.

My argument would be that there's nothing to suggest that Piccolo is wrong, since he's been training with Goku for the past three years and would have a fairly good grasp on his power. When SSj Goku is fighting with #19, only him and Gohan (the two that have been training with him for 3 years) notice that his power should be much stronger than what he was displaying. But whatever, they can think what they want.

[SSJ4_Zankuto]

Rocketman totally nailed everything there is need to know on Vegeta being stronger then Goku throughout the series.

[Suupaa Gohan 2]

I don't like being 'that person' who replies to a thread with something totally irrelevant to the question at hand, but I couldn't resist. When I was scrolling the forum, I read the title as 'Times when Vegeta is shorter than Gokou', and assumed it had to do with how his height gradually and mysteriously increased over the course of the series

Also it looks like other people are tackling the actual question well enough, and power levels have never really been my interest, so my irrelevant post shouldn't do too much damage.

[Cootie]

I don't like being 'that person' who replies to a thread with something totally irrelevant to the question at hand, but I couldn't resist. When I was scrolling the forum, I read the title as 'Times when Vegeta is shorter than Goku', and assumed it had to do with how his height gradually and mysteriously increased over the course of the series

Also it looks like other people are tackling the actual question well enough, and power levels have never really been my interest, so my irrelevant post shouldn't do too much damage.

No damage at all. I am about to get off-topic as well. Not only did Vegeta grow taller as the series went on his body type changed as well. He was more stocky and and built with a wider muscle frame at first. When he became taller he also became more slender to make his body type seem more like Goku's. I always liked my short and bulky Vegeta better ):

[cpd12589]

Vegeta is stronger than Goku from Goku's birth up to some point in Goku's training on the way to Namek.

When Goku gives Vegeta a Senzu as he arrives to fight the Ginyu Force, Vegeta is again stronger, and remains so until Goku finishes healing in the tank.

Due to Super Saiyan, Goku is stronger until some point during the training for the Androids. Super Saiyan Vegeta is stronger than Super Saiyan Goku from that point until Goku exits the Time Chamber with Gohan.

Goku remains slightly ahead in SS1 and 2 due to the benefits of afterlife training, but SS3 completely leaves Vegeta behind for the rest of the series.

^ That's pretty much hitting it dead on. Only I'd say while Vegeta was "Majin Vegeta" his SSJ1 and SSJ2 forms were just as strong if not more(and for that matter base form too I guess?).

I was just wondering if you also think Vegeta was stronger than Goku during DBZ movie 7 since that is supposed to take place during the Android Saga and SSJ Vegeta > SSJ Goku during that time. I know the movies usually don't coincide with the main timeline and basically take place in an alternate DBZ timeline but just was curious what you think?

Also I guess movie 6 would fall under that category too since they are both SSJ in that and it's before the androids.

[Rocketman]

I was just wondering if you also think Vegeta was stronger than Goku during DBZ movie 7 since that is supposed to take place during the Android Saga and SSJ Vegeta > SSJ Goku during that time. I know the movies usually don't coincide with the main timeline and basically take place in an alternate DBZ timeline but just was curious what you think?

Also I guess movie 6 would fall under that category too since they are both SSJ in that and it's before the androids.

Vegeta should be stronger than Goku in movies 6, 7 and 8. He's not because Toei.

[Fox666]

I would say after they reached the limit of their bodies (which coicide with the time they became SSJs) Vegeta was always ahead of Goku whenever they are in the same form.

I would say this include the Babidi saga

Goku: “Un-unbelievable…I thought I trained considerably in the afterlife…But we’re completely even…You trained more than me…”
Vegeta: “…No, that’s not it…I think I did perform more special training than you, but you’re a greater genius than I am…No matter how much time passed, this gap wouldn’t change…I realized this, when yo-you fought with that monster Babidi sent…It was a shock…That’s why I secretly resolved myself…”
Vegeta: “Yeah…At the tournament, the people who knew that pair who Babidi made into his underlings said that they had become far stronger than before…I remembered that, and I thought…That if I were taken over by him too, then the gap between you and me would vanish…And I was right…”

You see, Goku and Vegeta talk about training, and Vegeta says that Goku is a genius, he don't specifically refer to power.

Goku is the best fighter out there. He vaporized Cell's upper side, despite their difference in power. And this is Cell, who has everybody else techniques! Even if Vegeta still has a superior Ki, Goku is ahead of him in technique.

Of course Goku most of time has a transformation beyond Vegeta, surprassing him also in power.

[dbgtFO]

I would say after they reached the limit of their bodies (which coicide with the time they became SSJs) Vegeta was always ahead of Goku whenever they are in the same form.

I would say this include the Babidi saga

Goku: “Un-unbelievable…I thought I trained considerably in the afterlife…But we’re completely even…You trained more than me…”
Vegeta: “…No, that’s not it…I think I did perform more special training than you, but you’re a greater genius than I am…No matter how much time passed, this gap wouldn’t change…I realized this, when yo-you fought with that monster Babidi sent…It was a shock…That’s why I secretly resolved myself…”
Vegeta: “Yeah…At the tournament, the people who knew that pair who Babidi made into his underlings said that they had become far stronger than before…I remembered that, and I thought…That if I were taken over by him too, then the gap between you and me would vanish…And I was right…”

You see, Goku and Vegeta talk about training, and Vegeta says that Goku is a genius, he don't specifically refer to power.

Goku is the best fighter out there. He vaporized Cell's upper side, despite their difference in power. And this is Cell, who has everybody else techniques! Even if Vegeta still has a superior Ki, Goku is ahead of him in technique.

Of course Goku most of time has a transformation beyond Vegeta, surprassing him also in power.

SSJ 2 Goku was stated, as being just as strong as SSJ 2 Majin Vegeta and since we know, that there was a considerable gap between their powers beforehand(chek out the post you quoted), SSJ 2 Vegeta would have been destroyed against Goku, if he wasn't brought past his limits.
It's not about technique or skill in a fight, it's about which training method is most efficient for gaining power. Vegeta's training was worse, than Goku's(Earthly Training<<<<<Afterlife training) and his potential is also less, so naturally Goku is stronger.

[Rocketman]

SSJ 2 Vegeta would have been destroyed against Goku

As in "weaker but able to put up a good fight until he burns himself out" or "can't touch this"?

[dbgtFO]

SSJ 2 Vegeta would have been destroyed against Goku

As in "weaker but able to put up a good fight until he burns himself out" or "can't touch this"?

Imagine Vegeta vs. initial Perfect Cell and replace Goku with Perfect Cell... That's how I feel.

[Rocketman]

Imagine Vegeta vs. initial Perfect Cell and replace Goku with Perfect Cell... That's how I feel. :D

Vegeta blasts half of Goku's torso off? Works for me.