How strong is King Cold really?

[OWmyDragonBallz]

Ok I can not get this off my mind, during the series it is stated that Mecha Freeza is stronger than he was before, and that when the Z warriors are sensing him out, they also sense an even stronger ki (which we know is King Cold). When we read in Daizenshuu 7, it is stated that King Cold is somewhat "inferior" to Freeza. Am I missing something?

[Saiga]

Ok I can not get this off my mind, during the series it is stated that Mecha Freeza is stronger than he was before, and that when the Z warriors are sensing him out, they also sense an even stronger ki (which we know is King Cold). When we read in Daizenshuu 7, it is stated that King Cold is somewhat "inferior" to Freeza. Am I missing something?

Yeah, you're missing an accurate translation.

Heroically liberated from Herms' Strength Checker:

Chapter: 329 (DBZ 135), P11.5
Kuririn: “Did you feel it, Gohan!? That absolutely incredible ki!”

Chapter: 329 (DBZ 135), P12.3
Tenshinhan: “It…it’s not just one…There’s another absurdly large ki…”

[OWmyDragonBallz]

Ok I can not get this off my mind, during the series it is stated that Mecha Freeza is stronger than he was before, and that when the Z warriors are sensing him out, they also sense an even stronger ki (which we know is King Cold). When we read in Daizenshuu 7, it is stated that King Cold is somewhat "inferior" to Freeza. Am I missing something?

Yeah, you're missing an accurate translation.

Heroically liberated from Herms' Strength Checker:

Chapter: 329 (DBZ 135), P11.5
Kuririn: “Did you feel it, Gohan!? That absolutely incredible ki!”

Chapter: 329 (DBZ 135), P12.3
Tenshinhan: “It…it’s not just one…There’s another absurdly large ki…”

Oh, I was using the Subtitles on my Dragon boxes. I could have sworn they said that King Cold was stronger than Mecha Freeza.

[TheDevilsCorpse]

Oh, I was using the Subtitles on my Dragon boxes. I could have sworn they said that King Cold was stronger than Mecha Freeza.

I'm pretty sure the anime as a whole changes that line. Though, while you can assume that means Cold is stronger than Freeza, it's only at that point in time. Gohan later says that Freeza's ki right now is nothing, and that he gets much, much stronger:

Chapter: 330 (DBZ 136), P9.7
Yamcha: “So this guy called ‘Fr…Freeza’ has such terrible…ab…absurdly large ki…?”
Gohan: “This isn’t it…he gets much, much stronger…!”

[OWmyDragonBallz]

Oh, I was using the Subtitles on my Dragon boxes. I could have sworn they said that King Cold was stronger than Mecha Freeza.

I'm pretty sure the anime as a whole changes that line. Though, while you can assume that means Cold is stronger than Freeza, it's only at that point in time. Gohan later says that Freeza's ki right now is nothing, and that he gets much, much stronger:

Chapter: 330 (DBZ 136), P9.7
Yamcha: “So this guy called ‘Fr…Freeza’ has such terrible…ab…absurdly large ki…?”
Gohan: “This isn’t it…he gets much, much stronger…!”

OH ok I see, the anime version doesn't technically change it, they just make it more suspensful thinking King Cold was originally stronger, but then notice that Freeza was stronger than they imagined.

[DarkPrince_92]

If King Cold is as strong as they claim, why was he so outclassed? Goku and Frieza was a long struggle, but Goku had him beat. Frieza couldn't have gotten weaker while being repaired, also a year went by. AND King Cold is apparently stronger, but what form was HE in? It resembles Frieza's second form, so what if that wasn't his limit? Why he was still completely inferior to Trunks? Then again, Trunks has been fuckin around with the Androids, so it kinda makes sense I guess.

[Kaboom]

I suppose we're meant to assume that, whether the form we saw Cold in was his true form or a suppression one, that even at his absolute best he wouldn't quite measure up to Freeza.

[DarkPrince_92]

I suppose we're meant to assume that, whether the form we saw Cold in was his true form or a suppression one, that even at his absolute best he wouldn't quite measure up to Freeza.

I see. Can't Question it. Just the thought of someone outdoing their father is weird, but then again that's been common throughout the series.

[Saiga]

I suppose we're meant to assume that, whether the form we saw Cold in was his true form or a suppression one, that even at his absolute best he wouldn't quite measure up to Freeza.

I see. Can't Question it. Just the thought of someone outdoing their father is weird, but then again that's been common throughout the series.

Somebody not out-doing their father is a lot rarer in Dragon Ball. I can really only think of Future Trunks (if you count Gotenks as outdoing Goku/Vegeta).

[OzzyApu]

Somebody not out-doing their father is a lot rarer in Dragon Ball. I can really only think of Future Trunks (if you count Gotenks as outdoing Goku/Vegeta).

Throw Gohan in there surpassing his dad when he was at his SSJ2 and Mystic peaks (basically when he attained them).

As for Cold, he had to have another form. Freeza did, and if you want to count Cooler then throw him in, too. Cold was only going to Earth in the first place because of curiosity and mainly because Freeza wanted to get revenge. He was probably confident enough with his power when Trunks killed Freeza, otherwise he would have transformed as a precaution. Then again, he thought it was all in the sword, which makes practically no sense considering Cold's own power and the fact that it was a sword (though you could argue being caught off-guard and all that).

[Saiga]

Somebody not out-doing their father is a lot rarer in Dragon Ball. I can really only think of Future Trunks (if you count Gotenks as outdoing Goku/Vegeta).

Throw Gohan in there surpassing his dad when he was at his SSJ2 and Mystic peaks (basically when he attained them).

I meant that Future Trunks is the only son I can think of that didn't surpass their father. Gohan did, Goten/Trunks did if you count Gotenks, Goku did, Vegeta did, etc.

Oh, if you take the Bardock special as canon then Raditz didn't surpass Bardock.

[Bussani]

Just the thought of someone outdoing their father is weird

Is it? If none of us outdid our fathers, wouldn't humanity be getting worse and worse each generation?

[Fox666]

If King Cold is as strong as they claim, why was he so outclassed? Goku and Freeza was a long struggle, but Goku had him beat. Freeza couldn't have gotten weaker while being repaired, also a year went by. AND King Cold is apparently stronger, but what form was HE in? It resembles Freeza's second form, so what if that wasn't his limit? Why he was still completely inferior to Trunks? Then again, Trunks has been fuckin around with the Androids, so it kinda makes sense I guess.

In the manga, the battle beetween Super Saiyan Goku and Freeza is very short. And if anything, both of them have been injured at the point. When Freeza returned, Goku got much stronger training in Yadrat, and we can't tell how strong was Trunks at this point.

Cold resembles Freeza's second form, but he is also somewhat different. We can't tell for sure if he can transform at all.

[OWmyDragonBallz]

Somebody not out-doing their father is a lot rarer in Dragon Ball. I can really only think of Future Trunks (if you count Gotenks as outdoing Goku/Vegeta).

Throw Gohan in there surpassing his dad when he was at his SSJ2 and Mystic peaks (basically when he attained them).

As for Cold, he had to have another form. Freeza did, and if you want to count Cooler then throw him in, too. Cold was only going to Earth in the first place because of curiosity and mainly because Freeza wanted to get revenge. He was probably confident enough with his power when Trunks killed Freeza, otherwise he would have transformed as a precaution. Then again, he thought it was all in the sword, which makes practically no sense considering Cold's own power and the fact that it was a sword (though you could argue being caught off-guard and all that).

Um, Gotenks only outdid Majin Vegeta, unless you believe that Gotenks as a ssj1 is stronger than ssj3 Goku, (I believe that Ssj1 Goku > Ssj1 Gotenks). then you are entitled to your perspective, but referring to Daizenshuu 7 "Gotenks hurriedly trained in the room of spirit and time and leveled up so much, as a result, his strength surpassed Vegeta and the others". This is Ssj3 Gotenks it's referring to and it makes sense as Goku was taking Gotenks as a huge gamble with Piccolo confessing to not having real faith in him until he turned ssj3. Also unless you are the one to believe that Gohan as "mystic" surpassed Goku, then refer to Daizenshuu 2 "he has power surpassing Gotenks" (no mention of Son). We have to remember that Goku was holding back to let the newer Generation handle Boo whereas Vegeta admits that Goku was #1 which is why he said he was the only one capable of fighting Kid boo. Whereas inside Super boo he couldn't win because Super Boo admits he can't beat him when he is "far far smaller than a flea".

The only time I believe Gohan only surpassed Goku was during the cell games. Gohan didn't train over the 7 years, so hence Ssj2 Goku (Boo arc) >>> Ssj2 Gohan (cell arc). So therefore his ssj3 multipliers would naturally skyrocket being as his Ssj2 was Uber powerful. People under power Ssj2 Goku, he was very much powerful. But in the end, Goku, Gotenks and Gohan were all Ssj3 Tiers with Goku obviously coming out as #1, Gohan as #2 and Gotenks as #3.

[Saiga]

SS3 Goku being stronger than SS3 Gotenks or U. Gohan is wrong going by the manga.

[DarkPrince_92]

SS3 Goku being stronger than SS3 Gotenks or U. Gohan is wrong going by the manga.

Second that. Although the thought of Gohan being the best is repulsive.

[Bussani]

Um, Gotenks only outdid Majin Vegeta, unless you believe that Gotenks as a ssj1 is stronger than ssj3 Goku, (I believe that Ssj1 Goku > Ssj1 Gotenks). then you are entitled to your perspective, but referring to Daizenshuu 7 "Gotenks hurriedly trained in the room of spirit and time and leveled up so much, as a result, his strength surpassed Vegeta and the others". This is Ssj3 Gotenks it's referring to and it makes sense as Goku was taking Gotenks as a huge gamble with Piccolo confessing to not having real faith in him until he turned ssj3. Also unless you are the one to believe that Gohan as "mystic" surpassed Goku, then refer to Daizenshuu 2 "he has power surpassing Gotenks" (no mention of Son). We have to remember that Goku was holding back to let the newer Generation handle Boo whereas Vegeta admits that Goku was #1 which is why he said he was the only one capable of fighting Kid boo. Whereas inside Super boo he couldn't win because Super Boo admits he can't beat him when he is "far far smaller than a flea".

Buu only mentions them being smaller than fleas when he tells them they won't be able to blast their way out of his body. Goku's response to that is, "So all we have to do is find an exit," which seems to indicate that he knows they'll go back to normal if they can get outside. Goku said that they were no match for Buu's strength earlier than that, saying they'd need fusion to win, which doesn't seem to have anything to do with them being small.

As for Vegeta admitting Goku was the only one who could fight Buu, everyone else was dead at that point. Even if Gohan and Gotenks were stronger, they weren't an option when he said it. I mean, Vegetto would also have been able to fight Buu, technically, but obviously Vegeta wasn't including him since they broke another pair of earrings.

[Fox666]

Chapter: 506 (DBZ 312), P12.4-5
Context: after Goku and Vegeta revert Boo back to regular evil Boo
Goku: “Hehhe~~eh! With this, Boo’s power should have fallen significantly! We’re almost there! See, see: the size of his ki is completely different than before!”
Vegeta: “Alright! Let’s blast out of here and escape!”
Goku: “Wait! Even though Boo has returned to normal a whole lot, we’re still simply no match for his strength! If we go outside like this, we’ll definitely be done in…!”

Based on what Goku says next, by "like this" he meant not being Vegetto like when they entered.

Chapter: 507 (DBZ 313), P2.4-5
Context: after evil Boo appears inside his own body
Vegeta: “Da…damn it…! Th-this could be bad…”
Goku: “Di-didn’t I tell your to wear your Potara?! Th-this is why! If we could just go outside and merge, then this kind of guy would be an easy victory!”

[Bussani]

Yeah, exactly. And both of those quotes are before they realize they can't blast their way out of Buu at their current size, so it doesn't seem like they have anything to do with them being small; nor does it seem like they don't think they'll turn back to normal once they're outside, since Goku thinks they'll be fine if they can get out and fuse.

[FNF]

Somebody not out-doing their father is a lot rarer in Dragon Ball. I can really only think of Future Trunks (if you count Gotenks as outdoing Goku/Vegeta).

Throw Gohan in there surpassing his dad when he was at his SSJ2 and Mystic peaks (basically when he attained them).

As for Cold, he had to have another form. Freeza did, and if you want to count Cooler then throw him in, too. Cold was only going to Earth in the first place because of curiosity and mainly because Freeza wanted to get revenge. He was probably confident enough with his power when Trunks killed Freeza, otherwise he would have transformed as a precaution. Then again, he thought it was all in the sword, which makes practically no sense considering Cold's own power and the fact that it was a sword (though you could argue being caught off-guard and all that).

Um, Gotenks only outdid Majin Vegeta, unless you believe that Gotenks as a ssj1 is stronger than ssj3 Goku, (I believe that Ssj1 Goku > Ssj1 Gotenks). then you are entitled to your perspective, but referring to Daizenshuu 7 "Gotenks hurriedly trained in the room of spirit and time and leveled up so much, as a result, his strength surpassed Vegeta and the others". This is Ssj3 Gotenks it's referring to and it makes sense as Goku was taking Gotenks as a huge gamble with Piccolo confessing to not having real faith in him until he turned ssj3. Also unless you are the one to believe that Gohan as "mystic" surpassed Goku, then refer to Daizenshuu 2 "he has power surpassing Gotenks" (no mention of Son). We have to remember that Goku was holding back to let the newer Generation handle Boo whereas Vegeta admits that Goku was #1 which is why he said he was the only one capable of fighting Kid boo. Whereas inside Super boo he couldn't win because Super Boo admits he can't beat him when he is "far far smaller than a flea".

The only time I believe Gohan only surpassed Goku was during the cell games. Gohan didn't train over the 7 years, so hence Ssj2 Goku (Boo arc) >>> Ssj2 Gohan (cell arc). So therefore his ssj3 multipliers would naturally skyrocket being as his Ssj2 was Uber powerful. People under power Ssj2 Goku, he was very much powerful. But in the end, Goku, Gotenks and Gohan were all Ssj3 Tiers with Goku obviously coming out as #1, Gohan as #2 and Gotenks as #3.

*Cringe*...