Post Z sword training

[Insertclevername]

Was Gohan's Z-sword training really make him all that more powerful prior to releasing the blade? Apparently it was enough to make Kaioshin to comment on his power, so what do you guys think?

[DarkPrince_92]

Honestly, I didn't think it made too much of a difference. It was like weight training. I guess if he could barely swing at all then trained until he could swing effortlessly, then it must have given him a small boost in strength and speed. But not enough to make a difference against Super Buu at the time.

[Saiga]

The Z sword broke before Majin Boo had turned into Evil Boo, so Gohan should be compared to him instead. I think he got a fair increase if he went from not being able to budge the Z sword to wielding it easily in base.

[CatouttaHell]

He probably got an insane increase considering Son Goku implied that SSjin/SSjin 2 (whichever you think is his top power in the Boo arc) Gohan is about as powerful as Dai Kaioshin Boo, who is almost as powerful as SSjin 3 Goku.

Chapter: 479 (DBZ 285), P5.2-4
Context: after the Z Sword breaks
Gohan: “But…thanks to that, my arm strength has increased a lot. That Z Sword was incredibly heavy, after all…Perhaps this was what they meant by me obtaining the greatest power in the world.”
Kaioshin: “I-I get it…If he’s acquired that much power in his regular state, then if he becomes a Super Saiyan it will become an even more substantial power-up…! Ye-yeah! That’s it! That’s definitely the greatest power in the world…!”
Goku: “…But…Is he greater than Majin Boo?...I wonder…”

[Saiga]

He probably got an insane increase considering Son Goku implied that SSjin/SSjin 2 (whichever you think is his top power in the Boo arc) Gohan is about as powerful as Dai Kaioshin Boo, who is almost as powerful as SSjin 3 Goku.

Chapter: 479 (DBZ 285), P5.2-4
Context: after the Z Sword breaks
Gohan: “But…thanks to that, my arm strength has increased a lot. That Z Sword was incredibly heavy, after all…Perhaps this was what they meant by me obtaining the greatest power in the world.”
Kaioshin: “I-I get it…If he’s acquired that much power in his regular state, then if he becomes a Super Saiyan it will become an even more substantial power-up…! Ye-yeah! That’s it! That’s definitely the greatest power in the world…!”
Goku: “…But…Is he greater than Majin Boo?...I wonder…”

I think at that point Goku would have been planning to teach him to become a SS3. Doesn't he say something about showing the form to Gohan earlier?

[Bussani]

He probably got an insane increase considering Son Goku implied that SSjin/SSjin 2 (whichever you think is his top power in the Boo arc) Gohan is about as powerful as Dai Kaioshin Boo, who is almost as powerful as SSjin 3 Goku.

Chapter: 479 (DBZ 285), P5.2-4
Context: after the Z Sword breaks
Gohan: “But…thanks to that, my arm strength has increased a lot. That Z Sword was incredibly heavy, after all…Perhaps this was what they meant by me obtaining the greatest power in the world.”
Kaioshin: “I-I get it…If he’s acquired that much power in his regular state, then if he becomes a Super Saiyan it will become an even more substantial power-up…! Ye-yeah! That’s it! That’s definitely the greatest power in the world…!”
Goku: “…But…Is he greater than Majin Boo?...I wonder…”

Really? If anything Goku's comment makes it sound like he's doubtful to me. Compare to some other quotes:

Chapter 341 (DBZ 147), P6.2-4
Context: as Goku fights No.19
Tenshinhan: ”In-incredible…What strength…S-so that’s a Super Saiyan…He’s in a completely different dimension than we are…Too different…”
Piccolo: “…I wonder…”

Chapter: 391 (DBZ 197), P10.7
Context: after Goku displays his power to Karin
Gohan: “…I wonder…Has father really become so incredible?...”

Chapter: 437 (DBZ 243), P12.7-9
Context: after Goku and co. meet Kaioshin and Kibito
Piccolo: “…Wh-who are they?...”
Goku: “…I dunno…But there’s no doubt that it’s no longer just us who are gonna have easy wins…”
Kuririn: “Eh? I wonder…He didn’t seem that great…He just looked like a weird guy to me.”

Seems like a polite, Japanese way of saying, "I don't think so," to me.

[hleV]

Chapter: 391 (DBZ 197), P10.7
Context: after Goku displays his power to Karin
Gohan: “…I wonder…Has father really become so incredible?...”

I only realized it just now, but Gohan is kinda saying "Is this even incredible?", right? Something similar to what he later says about Goku not going all out against Cell, not yet realizing that he had surpassed his father in the ROSAT. So, if Goku wasn't that incredible in Gohan's eyes, Gohan should be much stronger than him?

[Fox666]

That power that "wasn't incredible" is only 50% of Goku's power, so Gohan is in fact a whole lot more stronger than only that.

[hleV]

That power that "wasn't incredible" is only 50% of Goku's power, so Gohan is in fact a whole lot more stronger than only that.

Gohan knew it was only half of Goku's power, yet still doubted in his incredibility.

[Bussani]

Chapter: 391 (DBZ 197), P10.7
Context: after Goku displays his power to Karin
Gohan: “…I wonder…Has father really become so incredible?...”

I only realized it just now, but Gohan is kinda saying "Is this even incredible?", right? Something similar to what he later says about Goku not going all out against Cell, not yet realizing that he had surpassed his father in the ROSAT. So, if Goku wasn't that incredible in Gohan's eyes, Gohan should be much stronger than him?

That's how I understood the line, personally. It looks like Viz translated it to a much more explicit, "That's weird, that can't be half of dad's power, can it?" But Mr. Simmons' subs are closer to Herms' translation.

[Saiga]

Yeah, I always thought Cell Games Gohan was substantially stronger than Goku.

[son veku]

He is not near as strong as Goku before 16 got killed cell beat the crap out of Gohan before 16's death, and before the cell jr's came along.
Goku could hold his own with Cell, but cell wasn't getting as out of breath and fatigued as Goku.
So he wasn't nearly as strong as Goku before his power up.

[Saiga]

He is not near as strong as Goku before 16 got killed cell beat the crap out of Gohan before 16's death, and before the cell jr's came along.
Goku could hold his own with Cell, but cell wasn't getting as out of breath and fatigued as Goku.
So he wasn't nearly as strong as Goku before his power up.

No, he definitely was. He was outright stated to be stronger before that.

[Bussani]

He is not near as strong as Goku before 16 got killed cell beat the crap out of Gohan before 16's death, and before the cell jr's came along.

I disagree. Goku made this big deal about Gohan being stronger than him; he asks Gohan if the battle seemed to tough for him, and because he was comparing it to himself, Gohan didn't even think Goku had been trying out there. No one can believe their ears, and then Gohan steps out there, releases his power, they call make their "!!!" faces, and Goku looks smug. It seems pretty clear to me that he was the stronger of the two. It's probably Gohan's reluctance to fight that really gives Cell and easier time.

[Super Vegetto]

Was Gohan's Z-sword training really make him all that more powerful prior to releasing the blade? Apparently it was enough to make Kaioshin to comment on his power, so what do you guys think?

I think that Z sword made him very powerful because of some kind of magic. Still not match for Fat boo imo, but above every SSJ2.

[Godo]

He is not near as strong as Goku before 16 got killed cell beat the crap out of Gohan before 16's death, and before the cell jr's came along.
Goku could hold his own with Cell, but cell wasn't getting as out of breath and fatigued as Goku.
So he wasn't nearly as strong as Goku before his power up.

No, he definitely was. He was outright stated to be stronger before that.

Yup, especially when we see Goku giving his all against Cell, then giving Cell a Senzu bean, and still expecting Gohan to be able to handle Cell.
I'd say that if Gohan's will was in the fight, he would have seriously pissed Cell off and given him a challenge.
But I believe that Cell's overall maximum was greater than Gohan's to such an extent that the SSJ2 ultimately was the only thing that was capable to defeat Cell.

[Bussani]

And let's not forget that Cell couldn't even hit Gohan at first. The kid just kept dodging him. He quickly got annoyed by this and did his, "Okay den check out my real speed!" I think he had to hold back a little less against Gohan than he did against Goku.

[Darkprince410]

He is not near as strong as Goku before 16 got killed cell beat the crap out of Gohan before 16's death, and before the cell jr's came along.

I disagree. Goku made this big deal about Gohan being stronger than him; he asks Gohan if the battle seemed to tough for him, and because he was comparing it to himself, Gohan didn't even think Goku had been trying out there. No one can believe their ears, and then Gohan steps out there, releases his power, they call make their "!!!" faces, and Goku looks smug. It seems pretty clear to me that he was the stronger of the two. It's probably Gohan's reluctance to fight that really gives Cell and easier time.

Not to mention Cell even admits (after Gohan first powers up) that there does seem to be truth in what Goku said about Gohan being stronger than him, but still didn't believe that Gohan would be able to beat him. It's one thing for Goku to believe that Gohan is stronger than he is, but for Cell to as well, that goes a long way to supporting that Gohan was indeed stronger.

[son veku]

No, Gohan was stronger than Goku if he got enraged otherwise he is not when they showed Gohan winning in the Rosat was because Gohan got enraged because he was tired of being weak.
Also JUST because Gohan thought Cell ,and Goku weren't fighting with full power does not mean he is stronger without being enraged, When he was basing them off of his own power he may have been thinking of when he was enraged which doesn't mean he was stronger than Goku without being enraged.
Cell was stronger than Gohan before 16's death and the Cell Jr's.
Goku could at least hold his own with Cell, Gohan was slowly losing before he got enraged

[Saiga]

No, Gohan was stronger than Goku if he got enraged otherwise he is not when they showed Gohan winning in the Rosat was because Gohan got enraged because he was tired of being weak.
Also JUST because Gohan thought Cell ,and Goku weren't fighting with full power does not mean he is stronger without being enraged, When he was basing them off of his own power he may have been thinking of when he was enraged which doesn't mean he was stronger than Goku without being enraged.
Cell was stronger than Gohan before 16's death and the Cell Jr's.
Goku could at least hold his own with Cell, Gohan was slowly losing before he got enraged

No, it's made pretty clear that Gohan is stronger. We get multiple statements saying/showing that he is before getting enraged. Cell also makes it clear he's holding back less against Gohan than he did with Goku. The reason Gohan started losing is because he didn't want to fight in the first place.