I had no idea Pilaf was filler...

Tanooki Kuribo · Post by **Tanooki Kuribo** » Tue Jan 10, 2006 10:49 pm

Hi, I'am reading the Dragonball manga (not Z) for the first time and right now I only have Vol.1. It spans from the first episode up untill they meet The Ox King. There is no mention of Pilaf or his minions at all in the manga so far but in the Anime equivalent to these chapters every episode has had Pilaf, Shou and Mai. So how long is Pilaf filler?

Socar15 · Post by **Socar15** » Tue Jan 10, 2006 11:09 pm

If I'm not mistaken, Pilaf doesn't appear until the 7th Chapter of Volume 2, at which point they are trying to use the robot suits to steal the dragon balls from Goku, Bulma and Oolong.

Chaos Saiyajin · Post by **Chaos Saiyajin** » Tue Jan 10, 2006 11:14 pm

If I'm not mistaken, Pilaf doesn't appear until the 7th Chapter of Volume 2, at which point they are trying to use the robot suits to steal the dragon balls from Goku, Bulma and Oolong.

Bingo!

I hadn't realized it was filler untill I picked up Dragonball volume one either, so you're not alone...

Dayspring · Post by **Dayspring** » Tue Jan 10, 2006 11:19 pm

Chaos Saiyajin wrote:
If I'm not mistaken, Pilaf doesn't appear until the 7th Chapter of Volume 2, at which point they are trying to use the robot suits to steal the dragon balls from Goku, Bulma and Oolong.
Bingo! I hadn't realized it was filler untill I picked up Dragonball volume one either, so you're not alone...

No, he means Pilaf is NOT filler.

He's in it in volume 2, the end of the Red Ribbon saga, the Piccolo saga... Pilaf is a major character in Dragonball. Especially pre-23rd budokai.

Chaos Saiyajin · Post by **Chaos Saiyajin** » Tue Jan 10, 2006 11:40 pm

No, he means Pilaf is NOT filler.

He's in it in volume 2, the end of the Red Ribbon saga, the Piccolo saga... Pilaf is a major character in Dragonball. Especially pre-23rd budokai.

Oi, I thought he meant that the episodes with Pilaf up until this point where filler, my bad.

Dayspring · Post by **Dayspring** » Tue Jan 10, 2006 11:45 pm

Chaos Saiyajin wrote:
No, he means Pilaf is NOT filler.

He's in it in volume 2, the end of the Red Ribbon saga, the Piccolo saga... Pilaf is a major character in Dragonball. Especially pre-23rd budokai.
Oi, I thought he meant that the episodes with Pilaf up until this point where filler, my bad.

Oooooh... Now I'm not sure what was meant.

If that's the case, they are filler. Like Nami's thousand appearances before she's introduced in the One Peice anime.

Socar15 · Post by **Socar15** » Tue Jan 10, 2006 11:52 pm

Dayspring wrote:Oooooh... Now I'm not sure what was meant.

I'm not sure whether you're referring to my statement or Tanooki's, but in any case, what I was trying to say was that all of Pilaf's appearances in the anime UP UNTIL the appearance he makes in 7th Chapter of Volume 2 ARE filler. Hope this clears up any misunderstanding.

Victator Supreme · Post by **Victator Supreme** » Wed Jan 11, 2006 3:38 am

I don't think things that contribute to the story should ever be considered filler.

Socar15 · Post by **Socar15** » Wed Jan 11, 2006 3:42 am

Victator Supreme wrote:I don't think things that contribute to the story should ever be considered filler.

But that's what it is. Filler isn't a condescending term (despite what many use it as). It simply is used for things that the anime added that were not already in the manga. Whether or not it helped to contribute to the story (either in a positive or negative way) or not is somewhat beside the point.

Dayspring · Post by **Dayspring** » Wed Jan 11, 2006 7:44 am

Socar15 wrote:
Victator Supreme wrote:I don't think things that contribute to the story should ever be considered filler.
But that's what it is. Filler isn't a condescending term (despite what many use it as). It simply is used for things that the anime added that were not already in the manga. Whether or not it helped to contribute to the story (either in a positive or negative way) or not is somewhat beside the point.

Socar's right. Filler is litterally just added stuff to "fill up time" (hence the word) while more of the manga was being made. 1 chapter usually made 10 minutes of anime, so filler was often needed to slow down how quickly the anime would pass the manga. Completely filler episodes and sagas were only made because Toei had completely caught up with Toriyama.

Victator Supreme · Post by **Victator Supreme** » Wed Jan 11, 2006 4:10 pm

The definition of filler is something that serves no real purpose to the story. The Ginyu Force attacking Kaio Sama's planet is filler, it served no real purpose.

Duo · Post by **Duo** » Wed Jan 11, 2006 4:40 pm

No, Dayspring explained what Filler is. You can argue that it's something else all you want, but that doesn't change fact.

I can sit around all day and say VegettoEX's name isn't Mike and that he's really a Hindu who lives in Russia. That doesn't make it true.

Victator Supreme · Post by **Victator Supreme** » Wed Jan 11, 2006 7:26 pm

Not my fault you don't know what filler is.

fill·er1 ( P ) Pronunciation Key (flr)
Something, such as a news item, public-service message, or music, used to fill time in a radio or television presentation.

The Pilaf stuff in the first Dragonball storyarc does not match that definition.

Mike · Post by **Mike** » Wed Jan 11, 2006 9:09 pm

Victator Supreme wrote:Not my fault you don't know what filler is.

fill·er1 ( P ) Pronunciation Key (flr)
Something, such as a news item, public-service message, or music, used to fill time in a radio or television presentation.
The Pilaf stuff in the first Dragonball storyarc does not match that definition.

It seems you're the one who doesn't know what filler is. I don't want to sound like a jerk or anything, but your own definition works against you. The anime only scenes with Pilaf, Mai or Shu were added to make sure each manga story added up to a twenty two minute episode. They were created to fill in the space between events that also occurred in the manga.

ChaotixXero · Post by **ChaotixXero** » Wed Jan 11, 2006 9:21 pm

It even said it in the definition you put. "Something...used to fill time in a television presentation." In this case, the 'something' that is added is (how should I put this) animations(?). The News item, public-service message, and music are just examples.

Victator Supreme · Post by **Victator Supreme** » Wed Jan 11, 2006 10:00 pm

In the definition it said things such as PSA, Music, or news broadcast. That means things that are just their to fill time. The extra Pilaf stuff was added to further develop the storyline, that is the opposite of filler.

Post by **VegettoEX** » Wed Jan 11, 2006 10:11 pm

Folks, let's not be retarded.

"Filler", when talking about anime (and DB in particular), is simply material that was not present in the manga but appears in the TV series. What its purpose is (developing characters, creating new story arcs, etc.) is entirely irrelevant.

Movies are not filler. TV specials are not filler. Special animations are not filler. Video game openings are not filler. Parody manga are not filler.

Duo · Post by **Duo** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 6:11 am

And Filler is just one member of that group which is known as...

"Non-Canon"

Tsukento · Post by **Tsukento** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 6:54 pm

That's not the only time they did that in the show. Kuririn's shown quite a bit running through a forest and riding his boat until we see him clearly as he arrives at Roshi's island. Plus we also see how Bulma, Yamcha, Pu'ar and Oolong fair when trying to head back to the city without Goku. Neither of those bits were in the manga.

Xyex · Post by **Xyex** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 7:51 pm

Victator Supreme wrote:In the definition it said things such as PSA, Music, or news broadcast. That means things that are just their to fill time. The extra Pilaf stuff was added to further develop the storyline, that is the opposite of filler.

As others have said, the definition of Filler is just as you showed. Any item (the PSA, music, and news broadcast being examples) which exists to fill time. The question of if it adds to the story or not is irrelevant. If it was inserted into the anime between segments taken from the Manga then it is filler, as it's purpose is to fill time, extend the episode (or in some cases, the series itself, as somtimes entire episodes are filler). Thusly, it's all filler, good or bad.

Anyway, to try and get back onto topic here, I was a little suprised that Pilaf and his lackies didn't show up until later when I read the first frew chapters of the Manga too. It had been a while since I'd seen the early DB episodes but I had the feeling they'd shown up sooner in the anime.

How far in was the manga at that point, anyway? Anyone know?