Making the Goten = Gohan Daizenshuu Entry Work

[Hero]

So the Daizenshuu entry that states that Goten is equal to Gohan is one of the more... unpopular entries in it but I never had a problem with it. The way I made it work is by taking the statement to be true for the Gohan that hadn't trained for the 25th WMAT yet. Goten is equal to that Gohan. Because of the 7 year layoff his strength has depleted to such an amount that he's now no better than his little brother but after even moderate sparring and training for the tournament he gets stronger fast since he's regaining lost strength rather than building new one.

To put it in numbers (to make it easier to visualize):
Gohan (Cell Games)- 100
Goten/ Gohan (Pre-25th WMAT)- 60
Gohan (25th WMAT)- 80

This in my opinion also helps the whole "Gohan doesn't even know if he can go SSJ in RoF" thing. The Gohan there is like the Pre-25th WMAT one. Extremely rusty, but give him just a few weeks to get back into the swing of things though and suddenly he's so much stronger 'cuz all that strength that he lost is waiting to come back to him.

So what do you all think of this theory?

[Doctor.]

The Daizenshuu also says that Gohan's power didn't decrease.

[SSJ2FutureGohan]

It could just be referring to post-RoSaT Goten.

[Galan007]

Can someone post the exact line?

[SSJ2FutureGohan]

By virtue of being Goku's son, Goten posses battle power not the least bit inferior to even Gohan. On top of being able to unleash a startling amount of power in even his normal state, he can easily transform into a Super Saiyan. Furthermore, he merges with Trunks through a technique known as Fusion.

http://web.archive.org/web/201203082300 ... ow_up#link

[Hugo Boss]

I think this entry is based on Gohan wondering about the powers of Goten and Trunks. He said something along the lines of "If I don't start training those kids will be soon ahead of me".

[nickzambuto]

I think it makes perfect sense that the kids were both equal to Gohan, and then maybe 70% of both their father's. Then when they fuse, 70% + 70% = 140%. So in equal forms Gotenks is considerably more powerful than Goku and Vegeta, but not to the absurd degrees that some people claim. Maybe the kids were as much as 75% or 80% of their fathers if you still think Gotenks needs to be way ahead of Goku and Vegeta. The reason Gotenks was able to compete with Super/Evil Boo is not because fusion adds some random extra boost, but because fusion adds the two powers together, then at that point Gotenks was able to go Super Saiyan 3.

[h0kuten]

I think they are comparing an 'Enraged Gohan' to Teen Gohan Ssj2.

My numbers:

Perfect Cell
~Full Power 7,500

Super Perfect Cell
~Full Power 15,000

Kid Gohan (Cell Games)
~Ssj 5,000
~Ssj2 10,000
~Enraged 20,000

Teen Gohan (Majin Boo Saga)
~Ssj 5,000
~Ssj2 10,000

Goten Pre-ROST
~Ssj 5,000

Goten Post-ROST
~Ssj 10,000

[Polyphase Avatron]

Maybe the Daizenshuu was just wrong and Gohan was stronger.

[Kamiccolo9]

Maybe the Daizenshuu was just wrong and Gohan was stronger.

Or maybe people are being to strict with their meaning of "power."

I mean, Anakin Skywalker in The Phantom Menace had a higher "battle power" than Yoda, yet he was nowhere near as "strong" as him.

[Pantalones]

Or maybe people are being to strict with their meaning of "power."

I mean, Anakin Skywalker in The Phantom Menace had a higher "battle power" than Yoda, yet he was nowhere near as "strong" as him.

If the Daizenshuu entry had specified "Goten's potential is no less than Gohan's" or "Goten's dormant power is no less than Gohan's," then this would be a pretty accurate comparison -- both your amount of dormant power in Dragonball and your midichlorian count in the Star Wars prequels are "how powerful you could possibly become if you figure out how to use what you have to its fullest extent" sorts of things, not necessarily "how powerful are you right now." And being a half-Saiyan son of Goku and Chi-Chi (just like "Mr. Dormant Potential" Gohan himself) who already got absurdly strong just from play-fighting with Trunks for a few years, Goten having super-high potential is a pretty reasonable guess to make.

If it really is intended to be referring to Goten's dormant power in comparison to Gohan's, then yeah, the Daizenshuu statement can work. Otherwise, nah.

[Kamiccolo9]

Or maybe people are being to strict with their meaning of "power."

I mean, Anakin Skywalker in The Phantom Menace had a higher "battle power" than Yoda, yet he was nowhere near as "strong" as him.

If the Daizenshuu entry had specified "Goten's potential is no less than Gohan's" or "Goten's dormant power is no less than Gohan's," then this would be a pretty accurate comparison -- both your amount of dormant power in Dragonball and your midichlorian count in the Star Wars prequels are "how powerful you could possibly become if you figure out how to use what you have to its fullest extent" sorts of things, not necessarily "how powerful are you right now." And being a half-Saiyan son of Goku and Chi-Chi (just like "Mr. Dormant Potential" Gohan himself) who already got absurdly strong just from play-fighting with Trunks for a few years, Goten having super-high potential is a pretty reasonable guess to make.

If it really is intended to be referring to Goten's dormant power in comparison to Gohan's, then yeah, the Daizenshuu statement can work. Otherwise, nah.

I don't see why it couldn't. Broly was born with a power level of 10,000. Bardock in his special had roughly the same level. Obviously, Broly could not fight on an even level with Bardock.

"Battle Power" just shows how much power a person has, not what they are capable of doing with it. Roshi has much more power than Videl, yet he can't fly. Same with Goten at the beginning of the Buu Arc compared to any of the Earthlings. It's an entirely reasonable assumption to think that the Daizenshuu's use of "Battle Power" is referring to the full depths of both Gohan and Goten's power.

In my opinion, it's the only one that really makes sense, because otherwise, you have Trunks being stronger than Gohan, and I don't see anyone seriously arguing that.