Holes In The Makaioshin Theory

[GodKaio-Ken]

First off I'm new so don't flame me too hard if I'm wrong on anything here, you guys all seem to be the experts and I'm just jumping in as a big fan of the Dragon Ball Universe

Also I know there is already a "Who is Black Goku" thread. If it is deemed this is too similar I apologize and this post should be moved into that parent thread. However it seems the Makaioshin theory is #1 right now and I'd like the opinions of others who wish to defend or debunk this theory alone. This thread in essence is about what Black -isn't- rather than speculation on what he is. I'd like to limit discussion to points and counterpoints on why he can't be a Makaioshin...not what else we think he is.

So here are the two points I'd like to start off with:

1) Why does it take a God with the body of Goku a year to sense Ki? We know that Vegeta couldn't at first because he didn't even know it was possible without a scanner. However a being on par with Gods should know this technique is possible without any special training....I mean Krillin can feel power levels but a Makaioshin can't?

2) If he can't sense Ki it throws away the entire "Entity Mad At Saiyans" idea. If he can't sense Ki how would he be able to jump dimensions to hunt down Saiyans he can't even find?

Please refute or add your own ideas on

[ChronoTwigger]

(in the world of Dragon Ball there's no experts, only scholars!)

1 - I think is not a problem of Black unable to perceive Ki at all, but the fact Black have recognized (sense) Trunks own specific Ki. "Now he can sense my Ki...", doesn't mean "now can sense Ki's". It's in reply to the fact Trunks was elsewhere for an entire year.
2- as above.

[GodKaio-Ken]

(in the world of Dragon Ball there's no experts, only scholars!)

1 - I think is not a problem of Black unable to perceive Ki at all, but the fact Black have recognized (sense) Trunks own specific Ki. "Now he can sense my Ki...", doesn't mean "now can sense Ki's". It's in reply to the fact Trunks was elsewhere for an entire year.
2- as above.

I think that is fair but you can also say no character has ever had any trouble picking up on specific Ki if they know a person. Also if you continue on Mai asks if Trunks can sense the Ki of Black. I have a hard time believing that the subject had never come up in an entire year or so of running. To me that implies before he COULD feel the Ki of Black.

That is why I find it implied Black has just learned about Ki.

[ChronoTwigger]

(in the world of Dragon Ball there's no experts, only scholars!)

1 - I think is not a problem of Black unable to perceive Ki at all, but the fact Black have recognized (sense) Trunks own specific Ki. "Now he can sense my Ki...", doesn't mean "now can sense Ki's". It's in reply to the fact Trunks was elsewhere for an entire year.
2- as above.

I think that is fair but you can also say no character has ever had any trouble picking up on specific Ki if they know a person. Also if you continue on Mai asks if Trunks can sense the Ki of Black. I have a hard time believing that the subject had never come up in an entire year or so of running. To me that implies before he COULD feel the Ki of Black.

That is why I find it implied Black has just learned about Ki.

Well, not entirely. I remember that, on DBZ, they could sense powerfull Ki, but with no name attached. Goku need to know the target of instant transmission, but I don't remember people could figure out people by Ki (while, maybe, they can judge the entity to get foreshadowing). Of course I can be wrong.

My horrible english ... I mean that: by coming back to the zone haunted by Black, now Black can sense clearly Trunks Ki if raised. Not a new skill, but a different situation.
Of course Trunks can somehow sense Black Ki, if raised: it's the strongest Ki left on Earth.
Ki can be controlled, from 0 to x. At 0, you're invisible to Ki perception.

Anyway... who knows? Black Goku it's so misterious anything can be. And Super tend to be lazy on technical explanations!

[Chiki]

I don't agree that Black just learned how to sense ki.

We can see in Ep 47 that Trunks was hiding his ki the best he could. He doesn't fly in Ep 47 and he runs like a normal person, meaning he was hiding his ki the best he could. Now, even normal people have ki (Goku can use Instant Transmission on Bulma). Trunks's ki while hidden is like a normal person's.

Black knew how to sense ki just like the other Z Fighters. What he DIDN'T know, was suppressed Trunks's ki. He learned how to sense suppressed Trunks's ki and distinguish it from another person's ki. That's all.

I am 100% sure that Black could easily sense Trunks's ki, without even needing to look for him, if he was using his full power.

[GodKaio-Ken]

I don't agree that Black just learned how to sense ki.

We can see in Ep 47 that Trunks was hiding his ki the best he could. He doesn't fly in Ep 47 and he runs like a normal person, meaning he was hiding his ki the best he could. Now, even normal people have ki (Goku can use Instant Transmission on Bulma). Trunks's ki while hidden is like a normal person's.

Black knew how to sense ki just like the other Z Fighters. What he DIDN'T know, was suppressed Trunks's ki. He learned how to sense suppressed Trunks's ki and distinguish it from another person's ki. That's all.

I am 100% sure that Black could easily sense Trunks's ki, without even needing to look for him, if he was using his full power.

I'm okay with 95% of this explanation. I still think its implied Trunks can usually feel his Ki yet now he can't. Eith Black is REALLY sadistic and never let him know he could mask it until final kill time or he just learned to supress.

[Chiki]

I don't agree that Black just learned how to sense ki.

We can see in Ep 47 that Trunks was hiding his ki the best he could. He doesn't fly in Ep 47 and he runs like a normal person, meaning he was hiding his ki the best he could. Now, even normal people have ki (Goku can use Instant Transmission on Bulma). Trunks's ki while hidden is like a normal person's.

Black knew how to sense ki just like the other Z Fighters. What he DIDN'T know, was suppressed Trunks's ki. He learned how to sense suppressed Trunks's ki and distinguish it from another person's ki. That's all.

I am 100% sure that Black could easily sense Trunks's ki, without even needing to look for him, if he was using his full power.

I'm okay with 95% of this explanation. I still think its implied Trunks can usually feel his Ki yet now he can't. Eith Black is REALLY sadistic and never let him know he could mask it until final kill time or he just learned to supress.

I'm talking about Black sensing Trunks's ki, not the other way around.

[GodKaio-Ken]

I don't agree that Black just learned how to sense ki.

We can see in Ep 47 that Trunks was hiding his ki the best he could. He doesn't fly in Ep 47 and he runs like a normal person, meaning he was hiding his ki the best he could. Now, even normal people have ki (Goku can use Instant Transmission on Bulma). Trunks's ki while hidden is like a normal person's.

Black knew how to sense ki just like the other Z Fighters. What he DIDN'T know, was suppressed Trunks's ki. He learned how to sense suppressed Trunks's ki and distinguish it from another person's ki. That's all.

I am 100% sure that Black could easily sense Trunks's ki, without even needing to look for him, if he was using his full power.

I'm okay with 95% of this explanation. I still think its implied Trunks can usually feel his Ki yet now he can't. Eith Black is REALLY sadistic and never let him know he could mask it until final kill time or he just learned to supress.

I'm talking about Black sensing Trunks's ki, not the other way around.

I know but it has to make sense both ways right? Not a shot at you because it was a damn good explanation.

[Chiki]

I actually don't understand why Trunks can sense Black's ki. Goku Black is a god so he should have godly ki.

Or maybe Goku Black is just sadistic and lets Trunks sense his ki to frighten him.

[GodKaio-Ken]

I actually don't understand why Trunks can sense Black's ki. Goku Black is a god so he should have godly ki.

Hahah that was my third point as to why I don't think he's a Makaioshin. If he is I have no issue with the introduction of Makaioshin but do wish they had written it with less "Huh that doesnt make sense to me =/" involved...but hey this is DB it doesnt have to make perfect sense I guess lol