Gohan was a SSJ2 when he pulled out the Z sword?

[Angelus]

Clarifying. So you will need SSJ2 level power to pull out the Z sword?

[Steven Bloodriver]

Clarifying. So you will need SSJ2 level power to pull out the Z sword?

Perhaps not. The Z Sword might only weigh heavy to it's wielder as a test of more than just strength.

[Angelus]

Well yeah, he can swing it around while in base form. But to actually pull out the sword, did he go SSJ2?

[Darkprince410]

His aura exhibited no lightning when he transformed to pull it out, and Toriyama was consistent with lightning in the aura for Ssj2 and Ssj3, so it's safe to say he was in his regular Ssj form.

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[/spoiler]

[Angelus]

I see. Strangely enough, there was lightning in DBZ Kai. That's what made me ask

[sintzu]

Like Darkprince410 said, there's a clear difference between Ssj1 and Ssj2 in the manga so he was clearly a Ssj1 when he pulled out the sword and when he fought Dabura and Buu.

I see. Strangely enough, there was lightning in DBZ Kai. That's what made me ask

The anime had Vegeta and Trunks in their Assj forms during the Cell games while they were normal Ssj1 in the manga so maybe in the anime Gohan was written as a Ssj2 during those scenes.

[Angelus]

What the heck? Gohan was only a SSJ when he fought Fat Buu in the manga? He couldn't go SSJ2 unless he was really pissed off? Like in the 25th WMAT he was really pissed off at Spopovich and I suppose that anger lingered on when he was in front of Kibito

[rereboy]

His aura exhibited no lightning when he transformed to pull it out, and Toriyama was consistent with lightning in the aura for Ssj2 and Ssj3, so it's safe to say he was in his regular Ssj form.

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It's not so simple.

Gohan had SSJ2 in the tournament, which was seen by Kaioshin and Kibito. And yet later Kaioshin still states to Kibito that he hasn't seen how strong Gohan is, despite the fact that Gohan apparently only used SSj1 against Dabura and Buu.

Also, Vegeta clearly states that Goku has surpassed Super Saiyan after he defeated Yakon, despite the fact that Goku never exhibited sparks while deafening him.

Furthermore, strangely enough, Vegeta and Goku, while commenting on Gohan's performance, never mention that he's only using regular Super Saiyan, only that he is taking too long and that he has indeed gotten weaker. The most logical scenario would be for them to wonder why Gohan isn't going to the level beyond if he is having trouble, since he clearly can because he had done it in the tournament shortly before.

Finally, South Kaioshin is stated to be the strongest Kaioshin and he apparently gives a big boost in power to Kid Buu, enough for him to be higher in power than plain Super Buu, which makes us wonder how strange it is that a simple SSJ could remove the sword while no Kaioshin ever could.

In short, it's basically a mess and it's no wonder it's an issue with a lot of controversy and discussion.

[Saturnine]

It's not just the aura and the sparks, it's also about the way Gohan's hair looks. And I'm not just talking about the two bangs vs one bang of hair. Regular SSj Gohan also had just 1 bang of hair after a certain point in time. It's about how in regular SSj his hair generally stands upright in one direction, the bangs are a bit shorter and they don't flare outwards as much.

Demonstrated and explained in a thread from this very forum, a recent one at that:

viewtopic.php?t=34837

Finally, South Kaioshin is stated to be the strongest Kaioshin and he apparently gives a big boost in power to Kid Buu, enough for him to be higher in power than plain Super Buu, which makes us wonder how strange it is that a simple SSJ could remove the sword while no Kaioshin ever could.

As for this thing, it can be explained reasonably well by assuming that Kid Buu's absorptions weren't additive like Super Buu's were. Super Buu was a fused entity, and quite a stable one at that, so his absorptions were simply additive, but notice how drastically Kid Buu changed when absorbing his victims. It's either about the nature of Kid Buu, or about the nature of the Kaioshin. It's either or, really.

[rereboy]

It's not just the aura and the sparks, it's also about the way Gohan's hair looks. And I'm not just talking about the two bangs vs one bang of hair. Regular SSj Gohan also had just 1 bang of hair after a certain point in time. It's about how in regular SSj his hair generally stands upright in one direction, the bangs are a bit shorter and they don't flare outwards as much.

Demonstrated and explained in a thread from this very forum, a recent one at that:

viewtopic.php?t=34837

The hair is inconsistent. Before the tournament, SSJ Gohan's hair is different than his hair in the tournament, for example:

[spoiler]

[/spoiler]

As for this thing, it can be explained reasonably well by assuming that Kid Buu's absorptions weren't additive like Super Buu's were. Super Buu was a fused entity, and quite a stable one at that, so his absorptions were simply additive, but notice how drastically Kid Buu changed when absorbing his victims. It's either about the nature of Kid Buu, or about the nature of the Kaioshin. It's either or, really.

If we are willing to go far enough, we are always able to find a rationalization or explanation, it's just a matter of how much we want to assume. That doesn't mean that the issue is not a mess, though.

[Desassina]

A fully powered SSJ is at the tipping point of becoming a SSJ2 and enjoying a strength boost, but Gohan was not going to waste more energy than he had, and so he kept it at a level that he could control. I guess that the same was true for Vegetto upon leaving the transformation sparks, but since the manga cut to Gohan and Dabura's fight so quickly, you could say that he started as a SSJ2 before getting tired. The same could be said for Gotenks: if SSJ2 doesn't get the job done quickly, then he had rather jump straight into SSJ3, or keep himself leveled with SSJ at full power. Remember that, even with Goku and the others jumping straight into other forms - against Yakon, against Gotenks Boo - the forms can improve slowly, and lower their power with strain. I'll try to escape the nitpicking, but I'll leave this much: Gohan was most likely a SSJ with all of his might when trying to pull the sword.

[Grimlock]

The only time teen Gohan transformed into Super Saiyan 2 was against Kibito (and in Movie 10). Everywhere else was his Super Saiyan form.