The Saiyan Tail?

[Revolution]

What has happened to this Saiyan Tail? It’s conspicuously vanished amongst the new generation of Saiyans. I would have put it down to them being half Saiyans however Gohan had a Tail so that’s out.. If I remember correctly Krillin asked Bulma about Trunks' tail at the beginning of the Android saga, but was ignored.

Maybe an evolutionary thing? Unlikely in my book considering the timeframe. Are they removed at birth now to avoid moon related incidents?

Does anyone actually know? Or more interestingly have theories??

[omegalucas]

I think Toriyama said in an interview that tails are recessive traits and that's why Goten and Trunks lack them.
However, if we go by real world science, that makes Gohan's tail impossible to happen, as recessive traits need to have two gene copies present to manifest: one from the mother and one from the father. With Chichi being human there's no way she'd have one copy of the tail gene herself (and she's even less likely to have two copies or she'd have a tail herself) unless she (or Gohan) happened to develop a mutation in that specific gene (or genes) that made them compatible with Goku's tail gene(s).
The other hypothesis is that Chichi's mother was actually a Saiyan and we never knew

Then again these are two different species from separate planets that happen to be able to mate and produce viable and fertile offsprings, so who knows...

[GodKaio-Ken]

I think Toriyama said in an interview that tails are recessive traits and that's why Goten and Trunks lack them.
However, if we go by real world science, that makes Gohan's tail impossible to happen, as recessive traits need to have two gene copies present to manifest: one from the mother and one from the father. With Chichi being human there's no way she'd have one copy of the tail gene herself (and she's even less likely to have two copies or she'd have a tail herself) unless she (or Gohan) happened to develop a mutation in that specific gene (or genes) that made them compatible with Goku's tail gene(s).
The other hypothesis is that Chichi's mother was actually a Saiyan and we never knew

Then again these are two different species from separate planets that happen to be able to mate and produce viable and fertile offsprings, so who knows...

Some humans are born with tails. Not Saiyan tails but still. We do have a gene for it.

[PerhapsTheOtherOne]

Out-of-universe, Toriyama just didn't want to draw tails anymore, if I recall correctly.

[Revolution]

That is probably the sad truth in reality.

However in universe I can barely see a valid reason. I think Gohans tail definitely set a precedant, the only thing I can think is that it was precautionary from the parents point of view (more likely the mothers) so as to stop a Giant Ape rampage.

I got sneaking suspicion that if Goku was alive he would have insisted the tail be kept out of curiousity of its potential with super Saiyan in the future.

[TheDragonBallGuy75]

I read somewhere that Toriyama pretty much forgot Saiyans had tails somewhere in the Namek saga, he was probably so focused on the Super Saiyan arc that by the time he finally remembered he probably didn't see a reason for Saiyans to retain their tails. Given how the majority of great ape transformations are highly unstable, and they have access to a more powerful form anyway.

It was interesting to see Salagir's combination of the two transformations for Kakarrot in DBM, it looked a lot like the golden great ape in the Baby saga.

[Anonymous Friend]

So, around this time the Toriyama "forgot" that saiyans had tails, did he also forget why everyone would refer to saiyans as "monkeys"?

[PerhapsTheOtherOne]

So, around this time the Toriyama "forgot" that saiyans had tails, did he also forget why everyone would refer to saiyans as "monkeys"?

I don't know, I call regular humans "monkeys" all the time

[Darkprince410]

I read somewhere that Toriyama pretty much forgot Saiyans had tails somewhere in the Namek saga, he was probably so focused on the Super Saiyan arc that by the time he finally remembered he probably didn't see a reason for Saiyans to retain their tails. Given how the majority of great ape transformations are highly unstable, and they have access to a more powerful form anyway.

That's one of those fan rumors that has no real truth to it at all. He indicated that the reason we saw tails disappearing so much for Goku is cause he just hated drawing them, so he'd come up with scenarios as to why it'd be lost (cut off with scissors, pulled off by Grandpa Gohan, etc). That's the only out-of-universe reason that's ever been given, not that he forgot about them.

There's no denying the man is forgetful, as he's said so about himself in the past. He's just not as forgetful as people make him out to be.

[TheDragonBallGuy75]

I read somewhere that Toriyama pretty much forgot Saiyans had tails somewhere in the Namek saga, he was probably so focused on the Super Saiyan arc that by the time he finally remembered he probably didn't see a reason for Saiyans to retain their tails. Given how the majority of great ape transformations are highly unstable, and they have access to a more powerful form anyway.

That's one of those fan rumors that has no real truth to it at all. He indicated that the reason we saw tails disappearing so much for Goku is cause he just hated drawing them, so he'd come up with scenarios as to why it'd be lost (cut off with scissors, pulled off by Grandpa Gohan, etc). That's the only out-of-universe reason that's ever been given, not that he forgot about them.

There's no denying the man is forgetful, as he's said so about himself in the past. He's just not as forgetful as people make him out to be.

Thank you for the explanation. Its just that immediately after Vegeta healed on Namek he said to a healing pod attendant that his tail would grow back (and it never did).
Since the SSJ transformation seemed to coincide with the lose of saiyan tails I just assumed that as my headcannon explanation while deducing he just forgot they had tailes. Thanks for clearing that up.

[TheBigBoy]

I just assumed that after Gohan that the tails of the Saiyans were removed at birth. They don't seem to need them for anything and they risk turning into a mindless monster at every full moon. Too much hassle!

[BlueBasilisk]

Out of universe, he said he hated drawing them because he would wonder about things like how Goku put his pants on.
From the Super History Book:

Interviewer: Did the tail get in the way of the fighting?

Toriyama: No, it’s just that I’m always thinking about how things are supposed to work, so it was a real pain to figure out how he’d put his pants on or stuff like that. That’s what always bugged me most. Is there a hole in the pants? Does he put his tail through first, then put the pants on? So that made me want to just get rid of the darn thing… which I did, in the end. (laughs)

In-universe there's this quote from a Weekly Shonen Jump Q&A:

(12) What happened to Vegeta's tail after he was defeated on Earth?
- Marc LaCroix, Nova Scotia, Canada

T: The tail lets you gain tremendous strength instantly by transforming into a giant ape, but the risks are equally great--you'll lose your strength if it's squeezed. Once you're as powerful as Vegeta and Goku, the tail just gets in the way. It is thought that the bodies of Saiyans, who are a fighting species, decided that their tails are unnecessary appendages.

Which matches up with what we're told about the U6 Saiyans losing their tails a long time ago. All the surviving U7 Saiyans have power levels much higher than Namek Vegeta, so...no tails!

[Meshack]

Goku's tail was permanently removed by God. Vegeta's and Gohan's tails did not grow back because the body, after reaching a certain battle power, thinks of the tail as an appendage (though Toriyama hated drawing tails.) Goten, Trunks, and Bra were born without tails because Toriyama said it is a recessive trait. The only Saiyan left with a tail is Tarble.

[PerhapsTheOtherOne]

Goku's tail was permanently removed by God. Vegeta's and Gohan's tails did not grow back because the body, after reaching a certain battle power, thinks of the tail as an appendage (though Toriyama hated drawing tails.) Goten, Trunks, and Bra were born without tails because Toriyama said it is a recessive trait. The only Saiyan left with a tail is Tarble.

And Tarble was considered a weak-ass Saiyan with no backbone and too many nice bones who didn't seem to fight much even as he was pursued by Freeza-level members of the old tyrant's empire. Thus, a tail.

[Meshack]

Goku's tail was permanently removed by God. Vegeta's and Gohan's tails did not grow back because the body, after reaching a certain battle power, thinks of the tail as an appendage (though Toriyama hated drawing tails.) Goten, Trunks, and Bra were born without tails because Toriyama said it is a recessive trait. The only Saiyan left with a tail is Tarble.

And Tarble was considered a weak-ass Saiyan with no backbone and too many nice bones who didn't seem to fight much even as he was pursued by Freeza-level members of the old tyrant's empire. Thus, a tail.

We don't know Tarble's full power. He probably could have taken one of them but since there're two of them, he was unable to do so. I hope Tarble appears in Super in the future and probably see more of him or just a cameo. It would be cool to see him train with Vegeta and achieve Super Saiyan.