Overuse of the Dragonballs

Anonymous Friend · Post by **Anonymous Friend** » Thu Sep 21, 2006 1:09 am

At some point or another I started losing some of the suspense whenever a character would die. So many people had been brought back to life by the Dragonballs that when someone was in mortal danger, the first thing that would pop in my head was:"Well, I guess they'll find the Dragonballs and wish them back to life. No biggie."

Did anyone else start to think like this??

Deus ex Machina · Post by **Deus ex Machina** » Thu Sep 21, 2006 1:39 am

That was one of the biggest problem's of having a story where you can basically undo any major event, because when something catastrophic happens it doesn't have the same impact.

But Toriyama was very clever when the story started becoming more serious, because he always had a reason why the DragonBalls weren't going to bail them out of trouble.

In the 23rd Tenkaichi tournament, they couldn't use them to bring Kami back because they would dissapear if he died. In the Saiyan saga they were incapable of killing Vegeta, and they dissapeared after Piccolo died. In the Cell saga they dissapeared again when Piccolo fuse with Kami, etc.

So over all, I think Toriyama did a good job of keeping the dragon balls in the story while still keeping thing suspenseful.

Conan the SSJ · Post by **Conan the SSJ** » Thu Sep 21, 2006 4:51 am

Deus ex Machina wrote:So over all, I think Toriyama did a good job of keeping the dragon balls in the story while still keeping thing suspenseful.

An almost humorous example, though, of the characters taking the Dragonballs for granted is in the Buu arc when Buu and Babidi are on their mass murder rampage. Goku's just "Hey hey, no worries, we can just wish them all back with the Dragonballs. Don't worry about your parents dying, Bulma." Well, news-flash, that comes back to bite him in the ass much later on in GT. While not executed nearly as strongly as it could've been, the Shadow Dragon arc definitely delivers a strong message that you mustn't take anything for granted, in this case being Goku and the Z Warriors always relying on the Dragonballs to fix their messes. Of course, that ended up into the ambiguous ending where Goku departs with Shenlong following the final wish, that being Goku's one true sacrifice (from my point of view); never seeing his family again in the living world or the next (though seeing Goku Jr. seems to be an exception).

GI_Judd2287 · Post by **GI_Judd2287** » Fri Sep 22, 2006 4:40 pm

The adventure aspects had been pretty much removed. Getting the Dragon Balls was always a simple task, and the fact that you could see Goku as a spirit and he could talk to his friends took a lot of the importance of him dying. However as you mentioned, Toriyama was able to make them effective in the story, and the Dragon Balls were even integral in destroying Majin Buu.

On an interesting note, in the original ending of the Dragon Ball comic, Toriyama says "There'll surely be more trouble along they way, but somehow they'll get through... and the Dragon Balls will be there for them!" The Kazenban edition eliminates that last bit about the Dragon Balls.

In the words of Ii Shen Long in DBZ Budokai 3: "You use the Dragon Balls too much!'

Godo · Post by **Godo** » Fri Sep 22, 2006 4:49 pm

^ Which Li Shenlong also says in DBGT.

I think that DBGT pretty much bashed the overuse of the Dragonballs.

GI_Judd2287 · Post by **GI_Judd2287** » Fri Sep 22, 2006 9:33 pm

Does he actually say that line in GT? I know what his story is and all that (I've seen every episode of the Japanese version), but I always assumed it was some stupid thing they needed him to say before he fights.

Godo · Post by **Godo** » Sat Sep 23, 2006 6:10 am

GI_Judd2287 wrote:Does he actually say that line in GT? I know what his story is and all that (I've seen every episode of the Japanese version), but I always assumed it was some stupid thing they needed him to say before he fights.

I'm pretty sure, but now you have awaken doubts...I think he says that the only reasons for him to be there is because of their overuse. But I could possibly have mixed him up with another character.
Still, it could be a line of his in the dub?

Casual Matt · Post by **Casual Matt** » Sat Sep 23, 2006 7:03 am

Godo wrote:
GI_Judd2287 wrote:Does he actually say that line in GT? I know what his story is and all that (I've seen every episode of the Japanese version), but I always assumed it was some stupid thing they needed him to say before he fights.
I'm pretty sure, but now you have awaken doubts...I think he says that the only reasons for him to be there is because of their overuse. But I could possibly have mixed him up with another character.
Still, it could be a line of his in the dub?

Well, he might not have said the exact line, but that was certainly his point.

Mystic Jack · Post by **Mystic Jack** » Sat Sep 23, 2006 8:25 am

Well I sorta lost the enthusiasm for the dragon balls and such when Goten and Trunks started searching for them wanting to make ridiculous wishes for candy and stuff like that. Although, in a pinch I'd probably wish for something as (or more so) materialistic.

Mr.Piccolo · Post by **Mr.Piccolo** » Sat Sep 23, 2006 9:38 am

I remember thinking towards the Cell Games that almost every fighter has no use for the earth's dragonballs.

Goku- Raditz killed him
Vegeta-Freeza killed him
Trunks- OK
Piccolo- OK
Gohan-OK
Yamcha-OK
(ok not every but, most)
Tenshinhan-OK
Krillin/Kuririn-Killed in DB

Let me restate that, most of the major fighters had been revived by Shenron. If you think about it, the dragonballs don't really have real reason to be used besides restoring things. The first wish seen was for a pair of panties. After that I'm sure the wishes were ligit, I'm not looking at a list now or anything.

Majin Buu · Post by **Majin Buu** » Sat Sep 23, 2006 11:59 am

The Lecherous Muten Roshi wrote:
Godo wrote:
GI_Judd2287 wrote:Does he actually say that line in GT? I know what his story is and all that (I've seen every episode of the Japanese version), but I always assumed it was some stupid thing they needed him to say before he fights.
I'm pretty sure, but now you have awaken doubts...I think he says that the only reasons for him to be there is because of their overuse. But I could possibly have mixed him up with another character.
Still, it could be a line of his in the dub?
Well, he might not have said the exact line, but that was certainly his point.

I think the line was: The Dragonballs can help you, but you can't abuse their power" (but this is comming off of a fansub).

Sun_Wukong · Post by **Sun_Wukong** » Sat Sep 23, 2006 3:24 pm

Mr.Piccolo wrote: Goku- Raditz killed him
Vegeta-Freeza killed him
Trunks- OK
Piccolo- OK
Gohan-OK
Yamcha-OK
(ok not every but, most)
Tenshinhan-OK
Krillin/Kuririn-Killed in DB

Wow, you missed a big portion, unless I read it wrong

Goku - Technically it was Piccolo
Trunks - Cell during the Cell games
Kuririn - Tambourine

Yamucha, Tenshinhan, Piccolo, Chiaotzu, and Vegeta were all wished back using the Namek dragonballs.

Li'l Lemmy · Post by **Li'l Lemmy** » Sat Sep 23, 2006 5:57 pm

Mystic Jack wrote:Well I sorta lost the enthusiasm for the dragon balls and such when Goten and Trunks started searching for them wanting to make ridiculous wishes for candy and stuff like that. Although, in a pinch I'd probably wish for something as (or more so) materialistic.

I actually enjoyed hearing that the kids' wishes were so selfish and ridiculous. By that point in the timeline, the Dragonballs had been used so many times to revive the dead and restore the planet that I wanted someone to say something like that!

Well . . . that, and it was just so in-character for Goten and Trunks.

Conan the SSJ · Post by **Conan the SSJ** » Sat Sep 23, 2006 7:12 pm

Mr.Piccolo wrote:Let me restate that, most of the major fighters had been revived by Shenron. If you think about it, the dragonballs don't really have real reason to be used besides restoring things. The first wish seen was for a pair of panties. After that I'm sure the wishes were ligit, I'm not looking at a list now or anything.

Allow me:

1st Wish - Granted by Shenlong: Oolong wishes for the most comfortable, ultra-soft pair of underwear in form of panties off a hot babe.
2nd Wish - Granted by Shenlong: Upa wishes for his Father, Bora, to be brought back to life.
3rd Wish - Granted by Shenlong: Piccolo Daimao wishes for eternal youth so that he may never grow old.
4th Wish - Granted by Shenlong: Bulma, Yamcha, and Oolong together wish for all those who were killed by Piccolo Daimao and his kin (as well as Roshi) to be brought back to life.
5th Wish - Granted by Shenlong: Garlic Jr. wishes for immortality, in effect giving him eternal life. (Yes, some may argue that this movie is non-canon, however I'm someone who believes it is [in the anime only] due to the forcible occurrences in the latter Garlic Jr. saga)
6th Wish - Granted by Shenlong: Roshi wishes for Goku to be brought back to life, however since he kept his body, the Dragon doesn't transport Goku to Earth.
7th Wish - Granted by Porunga: Dende wishes for Piccolo to be brought back to life, returning him his physical body on Kaio's planet.
8th Wish - Granted by Porunga: Dende wishes, albeit not specifically enough, for Piccolo to be transported to Planet Namek.
9th Wish - Granted by Shenlong: Mr. Popo wishes for all those killed by Freeza and his henchmen to be brought back to life, effectively reviving all those who died within a year's time.
10th Wish - Granted by Porunga: Dende wishes for all those on Namek, except for Goku and Freeza, to be transported from Namek to Earth.
11th Wish - Granted by Porunga: Dende wishes for Kuririn's molecule remains to be transported to the Earth, or depending on the version you're watching, his essence to be transported to Enma's check-in station.
12th Wish - Granted by Porunga: Dende wishes for Kuririn to be brought back to life.
13th Wish - Granted by Porunga: Dende wishes for Yamcha to be brought back to life.
14th Wish - Granted by Porunga: Dende wishes for Chaozu to be brought back to life.
15th Wish - Granted by Porunga: Dende wishes for Tien to be brought back to life.
16th Wish - Granted by Porunga: Dende wishes for all Namekians on Earth, with the exception of Piccolo, to be relocated to a new Planet Namek.
17th Wish - Granted by Shenlong: Yamcha wishes for all those who were killed by Cell to be brought back to life.
18th Wish - Granted by Shenlong: Kuririn wishes for the bombs/explosives in #17 and #18's bodies be removed.
19th Wish - Granted by Shenlong: Yamcha wishes for all those who died on the day Goku returned, up to this point of the wish being made, to be brought back to life, exceptions being the really bad people.
20th Wish - Granted by Porunga: Dende wishes for Earth to be restored, bringing it back exactly as it was before the conflict with Babidi began.
21st Wish - Granted by Porunga: Dende wishes for everyone who died on Earth since Babidi's arrival to be brought back to life, except for the most evil ones.
22nd Wish - Granted by Porunga: Dende wishes for Goku's power, which can only support bukujutsu at this point, to be restored to normal.
23rd Wish - Granted by Shenlong: Goku wishes for the memories of Majin Buu to be erased from all minds of the normal Earthlings, evidently all those who aren't very close with the Z Warriors and such.
24th Wish - Granted by Shenlong: Hoi wishes for Tapion's music box to be unsealed and hence opened, freeing Tapion from his self-imposed exile. (I'm pretty sure everyone will agree this movie is canon in the anime)
(Presumed Off-Screen) 25th Wish - Granted by Shenlong: The Z Warriors wish for all those who died at Hildegarn's power to be brought back to life.
26th Wish - Granted by Black-Star Shenlong: Emperor Pilaf, through a fluked accident, wishes for Goku to be restored to his child form, in effect nullifying his Instantaneous Movement and severely limiting his SSJ3.
27th Wish - Granted by Black-Star Shenlong: Bebi-Vegeta wishes for the original Planet Plant, before the Saiyans converted it to Vegeta, to be restored in Earth's orbit.
28th Wish - Granted by Porunga: Moori wishes for the Earth to be restored, reviving it to exactly as it was before Bebi-Vegeta's stranglehold on the human race began.
29th Wish - Granted by Qi Xinglong: Presumably through his thoughts, Goku wishes to see his absorbed Granddaughter, Pan, one last time before accepting defeat from the Dark Dragons.
30th Wish - Granted by Shenlong: Goku wishes for all those who've died on Earth, due to the plague of the Dragonballs' minus energy, to be brought back to life; this in effect reviving Kuririn too.

Super Sonic · Post by **Super Sonic** » Sat Sep 23, 2006 8:11 pm

Conan the SSJ wrote:
Mr.Piccolo wrote: 4th Wish - Granted by Shenlong: Bulma, Yamcha, and Oolong together wish for all those who were killed by Piccolo Daimao and his kin (as well as Roshi) to be brought back to life.

If you go by the manga, Shenlong himself grants it without them asking.

Mr.Piccolo · Post by **Mr.Piccolo** » Sun Sep 24, 2006 6:51 pm

Thank you Conan!

Kanzenshuu

Overuse of the Dragonballs

Overuse of the Dragonballs

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