I miss when the cast had agency

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Yuji
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I miss when the cast had agency

Post by Yuji » Wed Dec 18, 2024 7:37 am

Pilaf into the 21st Budokai into the Red Ribbon.
Saiyan into Namek.

What these arcs have in common is that the characters proactively created the plot.

Timeskips have been used way too often in the modern era as a crutch to avoid commitment in storytelling and planning. Resetting things to the status quo every arc is easier than thinking about how the consequences of the events that just transpired influence the actions of the characters. And having a villain show up to threaten things and cause mischief is easier than thinking more deeply about what kind of goals, wants and needs our cast has.

This isn't necessarily to say that arcs aren't interconnected. Of course, the ToP follows directly from the promise made in the U6 arc, and some of the events in Superhero follow from the ones in Broly. And Daima too is obviously very connected to the Boo arc.

What I mean is that I miss when arcs directly followed into the next ones, because the events that were written were so important, profound and caused such a massive impact on the world and its characters, that it caused our cast to seek out change and action by themselves. Rather than letting the events happen to them, they instead take actions to shape the world and its story.

No more of the seemingly always reactive Dragon Team, please!

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SupremeKai25
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Re: I miss when the cast had agency

Post by SupremeKai25 » Wed Dec 18, 2024 8:12 am

Goku has been training non-stop with the Gods since BoG because his battle with Beerus and Beerus' mercy and respect touched him so much that he wants to improve himself and eventually prove to Beerus that his faith in him was well-placed.

And people here never stop bringing up how Goku caused the Tournament of Power to happen (which was a good thing btw).

The characters in Super are proactive enough.
At his core Zamasu is good like Shin, though I guess you could say he was so fastidious that it backfired. But you know, for this "Future Trunks Arc" you had to depict Zamasu and Trunks' inner conflict, right? If this was back when I was drawing the manga myself then I doubt if I could have done it. I mean, I'm not very good at depicting the characters' psychology on the page. So this all came together because now I only have to think up the story. [...] On my own, I doubt I would have been able to express Zamasu's fall to the dark side.
Akira Toriyama, DBS vol.4 joint interview with Toyotaro

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OhHiRenan
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Re: I miss when the cast had agency

Post by OhHiRenan » Wed Dec 18, 2024 3:56 pm

I don't know if I'd call it the cast having agency necessarily, but I do miss that feeling of arcs naturally spilling into each other. Like you say, there's the thread starting with the Hunt for the Dragon Balls and going into the 21st Tenkaichi Budokai, and then Red Ribbon Army arc, but you also see this with the 22nd Tenkaichi Budokai, Piccolo Daimao, and 23rd Tenkaichi Budokai all building off one-another – same with the Saiyan, Freeza, Cell arcs. There are time skips within the story, but narratively the original manga can be divided into almost four acts:

Act 1: Hunt for the Dragon Balls, 21st TB, Red Ribbon Army

Act 2: 22nd TB, Piccolo Daimao, 23rd TB

Act 3: Saiyan, Freeza, Cell

Act 4: Buu

At least that's how I see it these days. Super just doesn't have that same flow. At most, we'll get something from the last arc softly inspiring the next (Zamasu watching Goku vs Hit on GodTube, the Heeters going after Seven-Three).

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super michael
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Re: I miss when the cast had agency

Post by super michael » Thu Dec 19, 2024 8:47 am

For the ToP recruitment, they had to keep reminding Goku to take it seriously to find strong fighters.
There was no guarantee Zeno would have erased the present time line, without the ToP. Future Trunks time line didn't get erased no matter how bad it got, it only got erased thanks to Goku getting Zeno involved.
If Zeno can forget the tournament, he can forget about erasing the universe.

Remember it was Goku fault that Future Trunks time line got erased, due to him being forgetful and getting Zeno involved. Master Roshi went to get the tag, but Goku left without it.

DBS Goku lost many growth, maturity and wisdom that he gained from DB/DBZ. In DBS Super Hero he doesn't look like a expert at all, he looks like a bossy amateur, who has no idea about anything.

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