Who has done the most damage to Dragonball?

Anonymous Friend · Post by **Anonymous Friend** » Thu Mar 01, 2007 1:58 am

In your own opinion, who has done the most damage to the franshise?

Is it Toei with their at times aweful original ideas such as certain movies and the GT fiasco?

Maybe the fans of the series whose antics cause shame and heartache on others?

Possibly FUNimation, with their not so steller handing of the dub and it releases?

Perhaps, (and I know people are gonna wanna rip off my legs and impale me with them) Mr. Toriyama with his writing certain character out, his forgetfulness of some past events, or just the details in his world?

Or is it some entity that I've missed?

laserkid · Post by **laserkid** » Thu Mar 01, 2007 2:08 am

I don't consider Dragon Ball damaged but if I had to pick, FUNimations strange release schedule (schedule? Whats a schedule?), and the widescreen debacle (Its still fun to watch but its turned off enough people to call it a debacle), its do0ne more damage then any of the others listed if you can even say DB/Z's been damaged.

SatoSky · Post by **SatoSky** » Thu Mar 01, 2007 2:08 am

I'm thinking that it's a combination of all those things. Without going into any detail, everyone just completely dropped the ball. (No pun intended.)

Toriyama - Forgot a crap load of things he himself wrote.
(How old is he?)
Toei - Outright refusing to give FUNimation decent masters to work from.
Though you can't blame them because:

FUNimation - Can't pull a decent release with the materials given if their future as a company depended on it.

The fans - Because a lot of us eat all of this shit up without even thinking about it.

That rant/blabber came out of absolutely no where.

Castor Troy · Post by **Castor Troy** » Thu Mar 01, 2007 2:30 am

All the above, but if I had to narrow it down to one, it would be FUNimation for obvious reasons.

Super Sonic · Post by **Super Sonic** » Thu Mar 01, 2007 2:36 am

SatoSky wrote: FUNimation - Can't pull a decent release with the materials given if their future as a company depended on it.

That depends on the view one has. Though some may view the dub as not stellar, you still have to acknowledge that it was what started Funimation on the path to how it is now as one of the biggest dubbing companies in the US. Another example you could say is 4Kids' treatment of Yu-Gi-Oh. Though many fansdidn't like how it was done, the show was still a hit and made a crap load of money. That and though a lot of guys didn't like the dub's censorship, many I've heard stated they can't picture anyone other than Dan Green and Eric Stuart as Yugi and Kaiba.

Sebastian (SB) · Post by **Sebastian (SB)** » Thu Mar 01, 2007 2:56 am

I think you're misunderstanding him Super Sonic. I believe he's referring the treatment of Dragon Ball Z in terms of DVD releases. They have yet to release a good quality Dragon Ball Z product that both dub & sub fans can be happy with. At least that's what I think.

SatoSky · Post by **SatoSky** » Thu Mar 01, 2007 5:08 am

Sebastian (SB) wrote:I think you're misunderstanding him Super Sonic. I believe he's referring the treatment of Dragon Ball Z in terms of DVD releases. They have yet to release a good quality Dragon Ball Z product that both dub & sub fans can be happy with. At least that's what I think.

That is what I meant. My bad, should have been more clear.
::Smacks himself::

More from me tomorrow, I'm tired.

Vegard Aune · Post by **Vegard Aune** » Thu Mar 01, 2007 5:23 am

Sebastian (SB) wrote:They have yet to release a good quality Dragon Ball Z product that both dub & sub fans can be happy with. At least that's what I think.

Maybe, but they did do a fair job with DB and DBGT. (If one ignores the fact that the first 13 episodes are missing, but that's not FUNI's fault, and people can always just import them from Australia.)

On-topic: I'm not quite sure, but I guess I'll say FUNI due to their awful Z-and GT-dubs. (The DB one wasn't very good either, but at least the original music was intact.)

Mystic Jack · Post by **Mystic Jack** » Thu Mar 01, 2007 7:47 am

When you think about it Dragon Ball's dub is not terrific but it's decent. (Unlike a certain 4kids dub about pirates

) I do believe Funimation fucked up majorly with the Saiyan Saga, but I'm going to have to say Toei, the excruciating filler saga's and Dragon Ball GT makes me hate the bastard so much...

Pedro The Hutt · Post by **Pedro The Hutt** » Thu Mar 01, 2007 8:18 am

You're forgetting Shounen Jump and it's editors of doom. For pushing the manga into directions didn't originally intend and for prolonging the series further than originally intended. ;D

MajinVejitaXV · Post by **MajinVejitaXV** » Thu Mar 01, 2007 9:08 am

The fans, first and foremost. Their antics have allowed everything that FUNimation has done to the series.

FUNimation comes in a close second, however.

-Corey

Rocketman · Post by **Rocketman** » Thu Mar 01, 2007 10:10 am

Toei for adding the shitty filler that distorts the series into "lol five minutes" and staring contests.

Mr.Piccolo · Post by **Mr.Piccolo** » Thu Mar 01, 2007 12:58 pm

Wow, you listed just about everything that I would mention. I’d just like to point out that, yes, the fans both help and hurt the series. Not much left to add, could we blame it on Ted Turner?

-Rick

Jodaku · Post by **Jodaku** » Thu Mar 01, 2007 2:04 pm

A toss up between Toei and the Shonen Jump editors. Reasons already stated by others.

Sebastian (SB) · Post by **Sebastian (SB)** » Thu Mar 01, 2007 2:12 pm

Pedro The Hutt wrote:You're forgetting Shounen Jump and it's editors of doom. For pushing the manga into directions didn't originally intend and for prolonging the series further than originally intended. ;D

To be frank, I'm glad they did. Viz's edits, however, are unforgivable.

Tsukento · Post by **Tsukento** » Fri Mar 02, 2007 2:30 am

FUNimation's the worst offender.

Toei had to fill up segments for DB and DBZ to keep themselves from catching up too closely with the manga. Some filler was decent. GT is best left as "Didn't happen" status. Toei at least gave us the ability to get the original shows in nicely remastered, DVD footage. Whether it be the Dragon Boxes or their single DVDs. At least the footage is consistant and well worth the prices.

Viz's edits are retarded, though they're much more minimal compared to FUNimation.

FUNimation has been doing the franchise since 1995. 12 years later, and they STILL can't get the entire series on DVD. 12 years later and they STILL can't please both sides of the fanbase. 12 years later and they STILL can't properly fix any errors they've made. They confused "ki" with "power level." They felt it was necessary to turn serious scenes into comedic acts with unnecessary puns, jokes, and gags. They can't seem to decide whether they want to use new music or Japanese music. Their actors act very well on other shows, but seem to instantly forget how to act once Dragon Ball recordings start up (minus a few, such as Eric Vale). Dialogue has not only been fudged by puns and jokes, but also inaccurate statements ("It's over 9,000" being carried over or how Kid Boo is supposedly the strongest Boo) and mispronounciations (K-eye-oh-ken, NOT Kay-oh-ken dammit).

It's also quite insulting to be told what I like or having ridiculous lies thrown my way regarding a DVD boxset's remastering as well as hearing them say "A nine-year old is born every minute" as if every DB fan is of the age of a child.

Let's not forget, very important scenes being screwed over. I fear what remastered Gohan Super Saiyan 2 explosion is gonna be like. Silence in the background, Gohan talking too damned much, bird flying for no reason because #16 didn't tell Gohan to protect the animals and nature that he cared for in the dub.

Oy..

Deus ex Machina · Post by **Deus ex Machina** » Fri Mar 02, 2007 2:51 am

Tsukento wrote:FUNimation has been doing the franchise since 1995. 12 years later, and they STILL can't get the entire series on DVD. 12 years later and they STILL can't please both sides of the fanbase. 12 years later and they STILL can't properly fix any errors they've made. They confused "ki" with "power level." They felt it was necessary to turn serious scenes into comedic acts with unnecessary puns, jokes, and gags. They can't seem to decide whether they want to use new music or Japanese music. Their actors act very well on other shows, but seem to instantly forget how to act once Dragon Ball recordings start up (minus a few, such as Eric Vale). Dialogue has not only been fudged by puns and jokes, but also inaccurate statements ("It's over 9,000" being carried over or how Kid Boo is supposedly the strongest Boo) and mispronounciations (K-eye-oh-ken, NOT Kay-oh-ken dammit)...

I love everything you wrote here, you took the words right out of my mouth. But you can't blame Funimation for the Kid Boo battle power thing, that was Toei's filler. Funimation just went with it.

Tsukento · Post by **Tsukento** » Fri Mar 02, 2007 3:58 am

Deus ex Machina wrote:I love everything you wrote here, you took the words right out of my mouth. But you can't blame Funimation for the Kid Boo battle power thing, that was Toei's filler. Funimation just went with it.

Filler or not, they clearly stated that Kid Boo was the strongest form of the Boos. The original simply stated it was the most uncontrolable, or something to that effect.

Duo · Post by **Duo** » Fri Mar 02, 2007 3:58 am

Mr.Piccolo wrote:Wow, you listed just about everything that I would mention. I’d just like to point out that, yes, the fans both help and hurt the series. Not much left to add, could we blame it on Ted Turner?
-Rick

ABSOLUTELY YES!!

Toei made some irritating mistakes, but most differences are sadly justified. Funi...is a joke. And the fans? Why, I do believe I hate them the most. That is why I rarely talk of Dragonball outside this haven of ownage.

Mr.Piccolo · Post by **Mr.Piccolo** » Fri Mar 02, 2007 11:11 am

Duo wrote:
Mr.Piccolo wrote:Wow, you listed just about everything that I would mention. I’d just like to point out that, yes, the fans both help and hurt the series. Not much left to add, could we blame it on Ted Turner?
-Rick
ABSOLUTELY YES!!

Haha, I mentioned Satan, er, Turner because I caught that the other day. Anyway, I’d also like to point the finger at Toei or whoever does the animation and stuff. I mean, I know its 2007 and anime wasn’t exactly what it is now but couldn’t they pace the show so more of the episodes would be done to look like the GOOD episode (Good example: When Buu is killed by the spirit bomb)?

Does the weekly serialization of a manga, hurt an anime in this way? By the way Bleach, which I know is animated differently, has a consistent flow of near amazing animation for every episode I’ve seen so far (in the 70s) now. I think this rings true for Naruto as well, which is done by the same studio I believe..

Duo wrote:Toei made some irritating mistakes, but most differences are sadly justified. Funi...is a joke. And the fans? Why, I do believe I hate them the most. That is why I rarely talk of Dragonball outside this haven of ownage.

I have a ring of like less than twenty that I can honestly talk about DragonBall without getting annoyed and/or disgusted over the typical rants and vs. questions. My cousins, who find it funny that I watch the Japanese version, can still comprehend the Funi’s VAs aren’t on the same level. In fact, one of my cousins made a list of things that weren’t "dope" on his Myspace and on top of the list was “Krillin from DragonBall Z”. I kid you not.
-Rick