Cell as a SSG Ritual material

[Kamiccolo9]

And then, you could make the argument that Cell isn't even technically alive.

Cell has a body that consists of cells, lifeforms. His body is alive. Cell has a soul and the consciousness as an individual being. He is as alive as you and me. It does not matter at all if he was not born the natural way. If we really want to be technical, an actual being as a person does not even need a living body. Only a consciousness. Or then, for what it is worth, if we do not want to get specific into the "conscious lifeform" territory, just needs to be a living organism, such as cells themselves are. And Cell has all of that.

All of which is debatable, and I'm not taking a side one way or another. We don't know how Cell works, so I'm not making an argument either way.

[Cetra]

And then, you could make the argument that Cell isn't even technically alive.

Cell has a body that consists of cells, lifeforms. His body is alive. Cell has a soul and the consciousness as an individual being. He is as alive as you and me. It does not matter at all if he was not born the natural way. If we really want to be technical, an actual being as a person does not even need a living body. Only a consciousness. Or then, for what it is worth, if we do not want to get specific into the "conscious lifeform" territory, just needs to be a living organism, such as cells themselves are. And Cell has all of that.

All of which is debatable, and I'm not taking a side one way or another. We don't know how Cell works, so I'm not making an argument either way.

How is that debatable? We know he consists of cells and his soul is in hell. If you want to get so uber-specific then I can debate how alive (as people) we are as well because a) we don't know if something as spiritual as a soul exists (as pretty much everything is produced by the brain anyway and therefore what we call a soul could also be only a part of that and not have a spiritual element and our consciousness, guess what is also produced by our brain and we cannot prove how much of it is spiritual. We are also programs.

[Kamiccolo9]

How is that debatable? We know he consists of cells and his soul is in hell.

Because cells can be artificial, and we don't know that his soul is in Hell.

Again, I'm not doing this argument. I'm a historian, not a philosopher. I'm just saying that the argument can be made that Cell is not a living being. If it can be applied to clones in real life, it can be applied to Cell here.

[Faustus]

I'm won't argue it either way, but science is just about the furthest thing from my mind. My quibble is linguistic. By what definitional criteria is it that the ritual magically picks out Gohan and the tykes as "Saiyans" but excludes Cell? What makes a Saiyan a Saiyan? Gohan and the boys are about as "Saiyan" as a hinny is a stallion (which is to say not really), yet the ritual'll have 'em anyway. Is it because they identify as Saiyan that they qualify?

[Kamiccolo9]

I'm won't argue it either way, but science is just about the furthest thing from my mind. My quibble is linguistic. By what definitional criteria is it that the ritual magically picks out Gohan and the tykes as "Saiyans" but excludes Cell? What makes a Saiyan a Saiyan? Gohan and the boys are about as "Saiyan" as a hinny is a stallion (which is to say not really), yet the ritual'll have 'em anyway. Is it because they identify as Saiyan that they qualify?

Who knows? It's magic. I just don't think that Cell would qualify for the ritual, because the ritual wouldn't accept him.

[Cetra]

Because cells can be artificial, and we don't know that his soul is in Hell.

Yes, we do. It is shown in the anime and whether people want to count it or not does not matter. Things officially shown are more important than what fans think. Also Goku even talked to Kaioh about it. And that is just a bit of many things important.

If it can be applied to clones in real life, it can be applied to Cell here.

That is done by pseudo-philosophers. There are things which can be answered really.

[Kamiccolo9]

Because cells can be artificial, and we don't know that his soul is in Hell.

Yes, we do. It is shown in the anime and whether people want to count it or not does not matter. Things officially shown are more important than what fans think. Also Goku even talked to Kaioh about it.

If it can be applied to clones in real life, it can be applied to Cell here.

That is done by pseudo-philosophers. There are things which can be answered really.

Toriyama regularly ignores anime-only stuff in favor of his own work. Nobody else has to accept it if they don't want to. And Goku is no expert in metaphysics.

I think your bias is showing. I'm not even arguing that they are right. I'm just saying that it's debatable. And that's the end of this discussion, at least on my part. Good day.

[Cetra]

Toriyama regularly ignores anime-only stuff in favor of his own work. And Goku is no expert in metaphysics.

Toriyama-san is not the only one working on Dragon Ball. You should accept this after such a long time. Also Kaioh is looking for Cell's soul as well as does Cell consist of life energy (something even lifeforms can mask and stuff but if he has energy like this then we cannot really doubt it at all). Also when people are speaking of Cell's death in the Dragon Ball world it requires Cell living in the first place.

I think your bias is showing.

That has nothing to do with bias. But he have had enough of those discussions already, right? Discussions where I could say the same thing about you. So yes, it is over. Also, do you really think philosophers know the answer? I am a computer scientist. Even if Cell is a full AI, he would be a strong AI, something that we have yet to succeed in making. Why? Because they are alive. Actual beings.