Why did Toriyama change Yajirobe's character so much in DBZ?

[DBZAOTA482]

He was never such a sniveling lazy coward in Dragon Ball. I mean, he was still belligerent glutton but he was a great fighter, an experienced swordsman, and pretty badass when you think about it.

Then come DBZ, he wants nothing to do with the Z-Warriors. He refused to train to fight the Saiyans... he had to be forced by Korin to join the others and in the one panel that shows him training he was sitting on the floor praying implying he wasn't taking the training anywhere near as seriously as the others. He never bothers even showing up to the battlefield... he just hides in the mountains.

Now before you say he was scared shitless of Piccolo Daimao... but his fear was pretty normal. To him, Piccolo Daimao was like the boogeyman to him. Not to mention he was far more willing to help out during the whole situation than he was of the Saiyans... he even climbed Korin's tower with Goku on his back. DBZ Yajirobe would only help out at the last second.

Yajirobe was also willing to participate at the 23rd Budokai despite the odds being against him.

Why did Toriyama change him like this? Did he realize he made Yajirobe too powerful and made him into comic relief so he wouldn't have to write him?

[VegettoEX]

Can I ask what your reasoning/agenda/goal is in making the exact same topic in various different locations online with all of your thread contributions?

[Zephyr]

If Piccolo Daimao was like the boogeyman to him, why would the Saiyans not be ten times worse than the boogyeman to him? Seems completely understandable to me.

[DBZAOTA482]

If Piccolo Daimao was like the boogeyman to him, why would the Saiyans not be ten times worse than the boogyeman to him? Seems completely understandable to me.

Because he heard about old stories of Daimao... the way he says it makes it sound like childhood trauma to him.

[Polyphase Avatron]

Can I ask what your reasoning/agenda/goal is in making the exact same topic in various different locations online with all of your thread contributions?

Maybe he wants opinions from multiple different sites?

[VegettoEX]

Maybe he wants opinions from multiple different sites?

While I appreciate your thoughts, I'm interested in a response from the original topic creator above all else.

[DBZAOTA482]

Can I ask what your reasoning/agenda/goal is in making the exact same topic in various different locations online with all of your thread contributions?

Maybe he wants opinions from multiple different sites?

This is it.

[Zephyr]

If Piccolo Daimao was like the boogeyman to him, why would the Saiyans not be ten times worse than the boogyeman to him? Seems completely understandable to me.

Because he heard about old stories of Daimao... the way he says it makes it sound like childhood trauma to him.

How does it not make sense then that these super powerful aliens who completely dwarf the team of said boogeyman's more powerful reincarnation and the most powerful man on earth would be even further frightening to him?

[precita]

Can I ask what your reasoning/agenda/goal is in making the exact same topic in various different locations online with all of your thread contributions?

Out of curiosity how did you even know he posted the same thing on all those sites?

[DBZAOTA482]

If Piccolo Daimao was like the boogeyman to him, why would the Saiyans not be ten times worse than the boogyeman to him? Seems completely understandable to me.

Because he heard about old stories of Daimao... the way he says it makes it sound like childhood trauma to him.

How does it not make sense then that these super powerful aliens who completely dwarf the team of said boogeyman's more powerful reincarnation and the most powerful man on earth would be even further frightening to him?

Well, it's not like he heard the complete story and besides the point of their training I'd so they can fight the Saiyans off.

I'm not faulting him simply for being scared. I'm faulting him for not at least trying to apply himself.

[TheAmericanDream]

I don't agree with this at all. I would almost argue Yajirobe participating in the 23rd Budokai as more out of character than Z Yajirobe.

All the badass moments or less lazy moments you mention from the Demon King Piccolo arc he had to be harassed or begged to help out. Yajirobe only ever helps when he HAS to, he is a good person but also incredibly selfish and lazy. He always has been.

Anger lead him to fighting Goku
Anger lead him to tagging along with Goku, plus Goku wouldn't leave him alone.
Same reasons for him fighting Cymbal. He didn't want to be bothered because he's a laid back loner who doesn't want trouble. This uncompromising nature is what I like about Yajirobe.

He berates Goku for trying to fight Piccolo because it goes against his nature, then he helps anyway because he does care deep down. Still he needs the promise of food to help out. The promise of food is the only reason he drove to Karin, climbed Karin Tower and stuck with it.

He saves Goku at the end because he cares about him by this point, then is so lazy he literally stays with Karin for the rest of the series.
Yajirobe only helps train for the Saiyans because he's being pressured into it once again (Karin probably threatened to kick him out).
Then he shows up to the fight out of sheer curiosity (probably the same reason he came to the Budokai)
Then yet again he does help because he does care about Goku...but ideally would rather stay out of the way instead of risk his life. I don't see any real character inconsistency, this thread could almost be compared to "Why did Toriyama change Gohan's character in the Buu Arc?" Though I see Yajirobe as being more consistently written than Gohan.

I have a friend that I introduced to the series and he sites Yajirobe as the biggest disappointment, because he loved him early on and he just willingly fades into the background. While I felt bad for him not getting to see more utilized Yajirobe, I roll my eyes at him calling him a waste of a character. Because when I analyze Yajirobe, unlike Tenshinhan or Yamcha I felt like he WANTED to fade away and live a simple life. Yajirobe reminds me a lot actually of Iggy from JoJo's Bizarre Adventure: Lazy/Crude/Cowardly character that when backed into a corner, will fight to the bitter end for justice when shit hits the fan. "fight to the bitter" end though I wouldn't go that far with Yajirobe, still I think its a cool character type.

[Zephyr]

I personally can't fault him for it. This is a million times worse than his boogeyman, so I can empathize with having an absolutely paralyzing fear getting in the way of being able to will oneself to focus on something. Granted, on the flip-side I can also understand that motivating someone to push themselves to their limit, but, eh, people are different, and it's perfectly understandable for them to react in different ways from one another to the same stimulus.

I do also have to commend the guy for dealing an absolutely critical blow to the final boss.

[DBZAOTA482]

I don't agree with this at all. I would almost argue Yajirobe participating in the 23rd Budokai as more out of character than Z Yajirobe.

All the badass moments or less lazy moments you mention from the Demon King Piccolo arc he had to be harassed or begged to help out. Yajirobe only ever helps when he HAS to, he is a good person but also incredibly selfish and lazy. He always has been.

Anger lead him to fighting Goku
Anger lead him to tagging along with Goku, plus Goku wouldn't leave him alone.
Same reasons for him fighting Cymbal. He didn't want to be bothered because he's a laid back loner who doesn't want trouble. This uncompromising nature is what I like about Yajirobe.

He berates Goku for trying to fight Piccolo because it goes against his nature, then he helps anyway because he does care deep down. Still he needs the promise of food to help out. The promise of food is the only reason he drove to Karin, climbed Karin Tower and stuck with it.

He saves Goku at the end because he cares about him by this point, then is so lazy he literally stays with Karin for the rest of the series.
Yajirobe only helps train for the Saiyans because he's being pressured into it once again (Karin probably threatened to kick him out).
Then he shows up to the fight out of sheer curiosity (probably the same reason he came to the Budokai)
Then yet again he does help because he does care about Goku...but ideally would rather stay out of the way instead of risk his life. I don't see any real character inconsistency, this thread could almost be compared to "Why did Toriyama change Gohan's character in the Buu Arc?" Though I see Yajirobe as being more consistently written than Gohan.

I have a friend that I introduced to the series and he sites Yajirobe as the biggest disappointment, because he loved him early on and he just willingly fades into the background. While I felt bad for him not getting to see more utilized Yajirobe, I roll my eyes at him calling him a waste of a character. Because when I analyze Yajirobe, unlike Tenshinhan or Yamcha I felt like he WANTED to fade away and live a simple life. Yajirobe reminds me a lot actually of Iggy from JoJo's Bizarre Adventure: Lazy/Crude/Cowardly character that when backed into a corner, will fight to the bitter end for justice when shit hits the fan. "fight to the bitter" end though I wouldn't go that far with Yajirobe, still I think its a cool character type.

Ya know, I just checked and he did kinda have to pushed in order to climb Korin's Tower. Still a shame he ended up being a lazy coward (not that I seriously mind that).

He easily coulda been the strongest human if he had applied himself.

[TheAmericanDream]

Yajirobe is still awesome to me, but yea. He is a bit of a disappointment! I just don't think a colossal one some fans see him as. I've recently just assumed Yajirobe is like this naturally strong brute, like a cave man or a mutant, just one of the strongest earthlings naturally but he's never cared about training or fighting for great justice. He wants what is his, and likes to keep things simple, which I can respect honestly.

Goku is able to bring out the best in the people around him and is even able to get someone like Yajirobe to help out multiple times but those are things he would have never done on his own. Which is something I love about their friendship and Goku in general. But unlike Kuririn, Yajirobe doesn't "Soften up" or "get serious", because there's always someone stronger to do it for him basically. Still when the chips are down Yajirobe comes out of nowhere and messes Vegeta up, it's a pretty cool moment from the Saiyan vs Earthling department. He works really well as a wild card. So here is a fun question

How would you make him relevant post Saiyan arc (assuming he was stronger)?
I'm not sure how interesting he would be on Namek (though I like that we get to sort of see it in Movie 6)
If he cut off Cell's tail mid absorbing an android I think that would have been pretty funny. But ultimately useless, the later arcs just didn't have much room for unique fighters like Yajirobe who are pretty situational.

[precita]

Yajirobe is fine for what he is. Considering he would be just another Yamcha and Tien and tossed to the sidelines anyway if he was a serious fighter, I don't see the difference.

[Lord Beerus]

Yajirobe was always a lazy, uncooperative, fat bastard, but that was the charm in the character. He would seemingly hightail it when shit is rough, but when you least expect it, he arrives in the nick of time to do something awesome, most of the time. Ironically, his laziness would play a part in his downfall in regards to contributing to the plot after the Saiyan arc.

[Kid Buu]

He was a badass fighter in the Saiyan Arc too. Dude had the best performance of any human Z-Fighter there by playing it smart an not recklessly jumping the gun like the others did.

[omaro34]

Yajirobe was always a coward. His character never changed in DBZ. He was still selfish, loved food, didn't even bother to help Goku when the poor kid nearly died against King Piccolo. He wasn't that badass either. His main accomplishments are killing Cymbal, participating in the 23rd tournament, and cutting Vegeta's tail.

He became a delivery boy for the Z fighters afterwards for senzu beans.

He hasn't even made an appearance in Super. He's becoming almost as forgotten about as Launch.

[ABED]

I think he could've been a fun addition to the hunt for the DB's on Namek.

[TheZFighter]

I don't agree with this at all. I would almost argue Yajirobe participating in the 23rd Budokai as more out of character than Z Yajirobe.

All the badass moments or less lazy moments you mention from the Demon King Piccolo arc he had to be harassed or begged to help out. Yajirobe only ever helps when he HAS to, he is a good person but also incredibly selfish and lazy. He always has been.

Anger lead him to fighting Goku
Anger lead him to tagging along with Goku, plus Goku wouldn't leave him alone.
Same reasons for him fighting Cymbal. He didn't want to be bothered because he's a laid back loner who doesn't want trouble. This uncompromising nature is what I like about Yajirobe.

He berates Goku for trying to fight Piccolo because it goes against his nature, then he helps anyway because he does care deep down. Still he needs the promise of food to help out. The promise of food is the only reason he drove to Karin, climbed Karin Tower and stuck with it.

He saves Goku at the end because he cares about him by this point, then is so lazy he literally stays with Karin for the rest of the series.
Yajirobe only helps train for the Saiyans because he's being pressured into it once again (Karin probably threatened to kick him out).
Then he shows up to the fight out of sheer curiosity (probably the same reason he came to the Budokai)
Then yet again he does help because he does care about Goku...but ideally would rather stay out of the way instead of risk his life. I don't see any real character inconsistency, this thread could almost be compared to "Why did Toriyama change Gohan's character in the Buu Arc?" Though I see Yajirobe as being more consistently written than Gohan.

I have a friend that I introduced to the series and he sites Yajirobe as the biggest disappointment, because he loved him early on and he just willingly fades into the background. While I felt bad for him not getting to see more utilized Yajirobe, I roll my eyes at him calling him a waste of a character. Because when I analyze Yajirobe, unlike Tenshinhan or Yamcha I felt like he WANTED to fade away and live a simple life. Yajirobe reminds me a lot actually of Iggy from JoJo's Bizarre Adventure: Lazy/Crude/Cowardly character that when backed into a corner, will fight to the bitter end for justice when shit hits the fan. "fight to the bitter" end though I wouldn't go that far with Yajirobe, still I think its a cool character type.

Yeah I agree with all of this. Yajirobe is a naturally lazy guy who longs for nothing more than the easy life. He is content to laze about above Earth all day in Korin Tower. I'd bet, off screen, he really takes some convincing just to deliver Senzu Beans. His character didn't change. He could've been a good character if used more, though.