I think everyone wants a more serious shift in tone. But some people are straight up emos with the whole "dying for the sake dying" stuff.Nekis13 wrote:Now I'm entirely fine with the "light-hearted" stuff Super has done. But it's nice to have some sort of balance between the two. I think most people can agree on that.
Well said. There needs to be a reason for the audience to get drawn into the story, usually something on an emotional level. You can sort of see them doing that here already with what they've shown with Trunks in the preview - his situation is one the audience is supposed to care about.dbzfan7 wrote:I'll make it clear that I doubt anyone wants FOTNS dark. I don't need blood, gore, and tons of deaths. I also don't need bleak worlds without some optimism and light hearted stuff. I want things to be taken more seriously, and mean something. I want experiences that I won't soon forget. I want experiences that the characters will let help shape them. The Boo arc literally had everyone die, and leave the earth barren for a big chunk of it. Yet it still kept some light hearted charm. I want a lasting effect of this arc, which doesn't have to mean permanent death. It means lessons learned, and new perspectives given.
Most of the Z sagas were like that though, and did have blood, gore and genocide. Those elements though aren't what makes the arc though, they just create the tension and urgency, but there's a line between dark, being unanimously grim. Bleak and Grim would just be Trunk's Timeline, considering nothing actually gets fixed or resolved for him, because the theme has just been the setting of its relevance. Rather in the main timeline, things are usually always resolved somehow, even if its just by a thread of luck. Super however has failed to bring back that feeling to the series, and made things too comfortable for the characters, but I don't think just teasing us with the Trunks timeline really improves on anything, because we already know its grim and will stay grim. Again, still lacking balance. Though the series would improve if it could just go back to how it can do both simultaneously, not in a gaping parallel.dbzfan7 wrote:I'll make it clear that I doubt anyone wants FOTNS dark. I don't need blood, gore, and tons of deaths..
Zephyr wrote:The fandom's collective fetishizing of "moments" is also ridiculous to me. No, not everyone needs a fucking "shine" moment. If that's all you want, then all you want is fanservice, rather than an actual coherent story. And of course those aren't mutually exclusive; you could have a coherent story with "shine" moments! But if a story is perfectly coherent (and I'm really not seeing any compelling arguments that this one is anything but, despite constantly recurring, really poorly reasoned, attempts to argue otherwise), and you're bemoaning the lack of "shine" moments as a reason for the story's poor quality, then you're letting your thirst for "shine" moments obfuscate your ability to detect basic storytelling when it's right in front of you.
While it's still my least favorite arc in the series' original run, I believe, the Android/Cell arc does manage to include several great character moments. It also has a great sense of mystery for a bit. Those things aren't the problem so much as the last third of the arc relying purely on strength one-upsmanship is (and without the dire, do-or-die tone the end of the Namek arc earned or the breakneck pace and mix of levity and horror the Boo arc provides).Lord Beerus wrote:I don't mind the tone shifting to becoming more serious, or "dark", as others would call it. I'm first and foremost worried about the the quality of the narrative and whether, there will be any evolution in characters of the current cast or the soon to be new introduced characters in the arc. Having a change in the tone of the story won't matter one bit if I don't care for the characters during the tonally contrasting story or I'm not intrigued by the narrative itself. It'll basically the Android/Cell arc all over again for me. And I sure as hell don't want that.
I was so disappointed about the bait and switch with that arc, now that you mention it. Buu and Piccolo were promoted for pretty much... nothing.Chuquita wrote:I prefer lighter stuff, but I was so disappointed in the Champa arc's bait-that-goes-nowhere that as long as this arc actually has follow through I probably will be ok with it.
She/Her 
Totally agree. I really like that arc. I hope we have Gohan back in this new arc with Trunks. The two of them fighting together would be awesome.Vados_chan wrote:Buu Saga is the best example of balance.
You had funny stuff like Fat Buu, Gotenks, Vegito but also dark shit like Human Extinction Attack, Majin Vegeta blowing up a crowd of people, Kid Buu blowing up the Earth.
I have to disagree.Neon Z wrote:My biggest disappointment with the Universe 6 tournament is that it seemed almost as pointless as the Revival Freeza arc in the end. There was some world building through dialogue, but the series has shown no interest in exploring it so far, which hurts its value. I just hope this story does change something in the end. Maybe Trunks gets stuck in the past, or some secondary cast members power up, something!
Kanassa wrote:Goku barely took a backseat in the Buu saga, at best he took a leisurely stroll round back while everyone else cried for him to come back.precita wrote:Goku will still be around but take a Buu saga approach backseat.
Buu Saga was the worst saga in DBZ. Apart from Majin Vegeta, it was terrible. No coherency, just one brainfart leading to another brainfart, that somehow ends with Genki Dama.Vados_chan wrote:Buu Saga is the best example of balance.
You had funny stuff like Fat Buu, Gotenks, Vegito but also dark shit like Human Extinction Attack, Majin Vegeta blowing up a crowd of people, Kid Buu blowing up the Earth.
Love the Buu Saga. My least favorite saga was the Cell Saga. I would have been find with just the androids.DragonHermit wrote:Ditto. The U6 arc served as the gateway to the 12 universes.
Buu Saga was the worst saga in DBZ. Apart from Majin Vegeta, it was terrible. No coherency, just one brainfart leading to another brainfart, that somehow ends with Genki Dama.Vados_chan wrote:Buu Saga is the best example of balance.
You had funny stuff like Fat Buu, Gotenks, Vegito but also dark shit like Human Extinction Attack, Majin Vegeta blowing up a crowd of people, Kid Buu blowing up the Earth.
Kanassa wrote:Goku barely took a backseat in the Buu saga, at best he took a leisurely stroll round back while everyone else cried for him to come back.precita wrote:Goku will still be around but take a Buu saga approach backseat.
I don't see how there was any character development for Beerus though. We had already learned that he had a good side considering how he lied and spared Earth even though the SSJ God couldn't match him. The issue with Cabba's and Hit's development is what I said before - the show has shown no intention of exploring Universe 6 so far, so it makes it all feel pointless.HeroR wrote:I have to disagree.
The U6 tournament opened the door to an even bigger tournament in the future with all 12 universes. We also got to see character development from Beerus and Vegeta, along with development from Cabba and Hit. As Champa himself said, this tournament was just the warm-up for bigger things, so it's hardly pointless.
The 21st tournament wasn't pointless because through its build up we got Kuririn's introduction and eventually befriending Goku, alongside both training under Roshi and eventually facing him. We also get Yamcha and Bulma meeting the new characters during the tournament itself, which quickly ties into their appearances in the Red Ribbon arc and later stories. Maybe I'm wrong and the Universe 6 characters will return for the upcoming story, but so far it all feels like it came and went with little effect on anything.If it is, then the 21st Martial Arts Tournament in Dragon Ball was also pointless since literally nothing was at stake.
