Can our next arc villian be a woman?

[ryou766]

I'm really holding unto the theory that Black is actually some female corrupted goddess or something. I'd applaud Toriyama if he were to make such a decision.

[Shin]

There's a female saiyan in Dragon Ball Fusions with Gokû hair, so it's not impossible. If video games count it means saiyan hair styles aren't specific to a sex.
[snip]

What Black should've been!

If they were to just genderbend Goku that'd be pointless, mostly because things look to be playing out to where Zamasu just clones Goku with the Super DBs. Although, if it happens to be Zamasu just trying to create his own version of Goku or something through his own means then I think a female version would've been a nice twist.

it was a joke, I'm fine with how Black is shaping to be currently.

[fadeddreams5]

Maybe, if you could get one out of the kitch--*stares at Bullza's post and subsequent responses*

Ahem... yeah, a woman should totally be the main villain of the next arc! I hope she breaks Vegeta's arm too! n_n;

[ryou766]

I hope she breaks Vegeta's arm too! n_n;

I can hear the outrage now.

[Cipher]

"Utsukushii" isn't typically used to refer to men, is it? Isn't Gokû Black calling himself that kind of similar to if he were calling himself beautiful/lovely/pretty/gorgeous?

"Utsukushii" represents a platonic ideal of beauty that could be used by anyone.

It's about as gendered a description as "beautiful" in English, I suppose, which doesn't put it at all out of reach of an idealistic megalomaniac like Black, regardless of his notions of masculinity.

[Mazingerdestro]

Ehhhhh no......That would be a terrible idea.....a show that struggles with blood would have female abuse....yeah have goku punching a girl!!! That would be fun. Have kids learning that hurting girls is mondo cool....lol

[Majin Jator]

It would be a nice change ( technically, none of the main villains in DBZ had genre, but they were males); but Toriyama said in an interview that he wasn't very comfortable with the idea of a woman getting punched, or something like that. C-18 only fought when he was clearly supperior to his opponent, so he didn't got harmed.
Sure, we got Videl getting beated in the Buu saga, but that was the exception.

They still could have a female villain pulling the strings, but seems unlikely. Let's face it, Toriyama is a sixty years old japanese man, and he's not very concerned about diversity issues.

[A Man named RJ]

While I'm all for "muh diversity" in this series, I cannot help but feel like the second somebody does make a female villain the world will call it Misogynist (By the people who dont even watch the series or remotely care otherwise, mind you). You're walking on eggshells with the concept.

ALSO if you make a female main villain do NOT make her to appeal to feminists or try to make some "LOOK KIDS THIS HERE IS A FEMINIST ICON, PLEASE IDENTIFY WITH HER" - that's how we get shitty characters. Make her a GOOD CHARACTER!

[ryou766]

It would be a nice change ( technically, none of the main villains in DBZ had genre, but they were males); but Toriyama said in an interview that he wasn't very comfortable with the idea of a woman getting punched, or something like that. C-18 only fought when he was clearly supperior to his opponent, so he didn't got harmed.
Sure, we got Videl getting beated in the Buu saga, but that was the exception.

They still could have a female villain pulling the strings, but seems unlikely. Let's face it, Toriyama is a sixty years old japanese man, and he's not very concerned about diversity issues.

But that could be why Black (if the person behind the body is a woman) is using the body of Goku (a male) to fight, so it isn't technically wrong. It's something I can see Toriyama doing.

[Nejishiki]

It would be a nice change ( technically, none of the main villains in DBZ had genre, but they were males); but Toriyama said in an interview that he wasn't very comfortable with the idea of a woman getting punched, or something like that. C-18 only fought when he was clearly supperior to his opponent, so he didn't got harmed.
Sure, we got Videl getting beated in the Buu saga, but that was the exception.

They still could have a female villain pulling the strings, but seems unlikely. Let's face it, Toriyama is a sixty years old japanese man, and he's not very concerned about diversity issues.

Did he say that? Goku kicked Lunch right in the face in his early chapters, not counting the goofy violence in Dr. Slump. I know that he said he can only draw one type of face for women (a Dr. Slump panel references this) and that he tends to give all of his women the same personality, but never what you cited. If you could find it, that would be awesome!

[Marco Polo]

I can see his true form being something like Towa, and also personality wise.
[spoiler][/spoiler]

If so, I hope she just keeps the gi... I love Towa but the underboob design is dumb.

I thought it was just part of her outfit, not a boob window? The black line descending on her navel wouldn't make much sense otherwise.

[ryou766]

I thought it was just part of her outfit, not a boob window? The black line descending on her navel wouldn't make much sense otherwise.

Now that you mention it, it does look like it's just some design on her outfit even though I initially saw it as a mini-breast reveal.

[HeroR]

And by "own identity" you mean what, exactly? As far as I know/I've heard out there/I've seen, from the color of Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan to the plot of Future Trunks saga come from fanfics (including evil Kaioshin that is not treated/called as Makaio or Makaioshin). I'd say it's better to take elements from games (specifically Dragon Ball Online, for some obvious reasons) than take from fanfics.

You have no proof that Toriyama have been taking from fanfics other than broad, popular ideas like Trunks returning, a rouge Kai, colors on the new Super Saiyan form.

[Kanassa]

Ehhhhh no......That would be a terrible idea.....a show that struggles with blood would have female abuse....yeah have goku punching a girl!!! That would be fun. Have kids learning that hurting girls is mondo cool....lol

That's how it always goes in fiction, when you give those people screaming for reprisentation a character one of two things will happen most of the time (Not saying that the OP is like that). The character will fall flat because in the creator's quest to satisfy the screamers, they've taken away everything that makes the character interesting; or the screamers will look at everything the character does as a representation of the creator's thoguhts on that group (Give a woman an actual flaw? THAT MEANS YOU HATE WOMEN!).

Now, this is not to say that making a character who is of a certain group is bad (Because somone will say I am), no. Do it. Just don't have pandering throw a bias into how you make em. Their gender and such should be a side-note.

Though maybe it's just because I don't really care about the gender of the characters that much (Though, side note: Am I the only one who thought Whis was a woman for most of the movies?)

[Grimlock]

You have no proof that Toriyama have been taking from fanfics other than broad, popular ideas like Trunks returning, a rouge Kai, colors on the new Super Saiyan form.

What part of "As far as I know/I've heard out there/I've seen" you don't get it?

And obviously he isn't searching for fanfics to create his story, but obviously none of this is new. Super Saiyan with blue hair exist for decades now.

[Viewtiful Jess]

Ehhhhh no......That would be a terrible idea.....a show that struggles with blood would have female abuse....yeah have goku punching a girl!!! That would be fun. Have kids learning that hurting girls is mondo cool....lol

Has fighting in manga between a man and a woman ever been considered abuse?

While I'm all for "muh diversity" in this series, I cannot help but feel like the second somebody does make a female villain the world will call it Misogynist (By the people who dont even watch the series or remotely care otherwise, mind you). You're walking on eggshells with the concept.

ALSO if you make a female main villain do NOT make her to appeal to feminists or try to make some "LOOK KIDS THIS HERE IS A FEMINIST ICON, PLEASE IDENTIFY WITH HER" - that's how we get shitty characters. Make her a GOOD CHARACTER!

The show is already called misogynistic for the total sausage fest it is and how takes strong female characters and demotes the to the small of being "the mom (TM)" by both viewer and non-viewers. I don't think Japan or Akira Toriyama are the posterpeople for feminism. What is with this whole no feminism thing? I don't get it. You can have both in a character. I don't think Dragon Ball is quite there yet but if they could they can and it's not a bad thing.

I just want a good villian, as I see others do too. A good villian who is powerfu, and a woman or woman-like. Effeminate men do not count, they are still men unless stated otherwise.

[omaro34]

Of course it can be a woman, why the hell not?

Gender shouldn't matter. Its the character development, motives behind her actions, and overall personality as a villain that I'm more concerned about.

[GodKaio-Ken]

I don't want to sound like an ass but it would be VERY difficult to believe a top female fighter to be physically stronger than Goku/Vegeta. Its not sexism its just how biology generally works in humans and how its generally depicted in humanoids.


Now I'd believe a female villain pulling the strings but thats not the type of series DB is or has been.

[Majin Jator]

Did he say that? Goku kicked Lunch right in the face in his early chapters, not counting the goofy violence in Dr. Slump. I know that he said he can only draw one type of face for women (a Dr. Slump panel references this) and that he tends to give all of his women the same personality, but never what you cited. If you could find it, that would be awesome!

I didn't have luck finding that interview. I found this, though, which opens the possibility for strong women now:

Koyama:
Er, there’s something I’d like to ask you: does the Saiyan race have any women? There are no female Saiyans drawn in the original work.

Toriyama:
I didn’t draw any.

Koyama:
Are there no women, then? I’m often asked by Dragon Ball fans.

Toriyama:
Actually, I’m sure they at least exist.

Koyama:
Well, children are born, so they wouldn’t be there without women, is what you’re saying?

Toriyama:
That’s right. If I remember correctly, in an anime special (A Final, Solitary Battle), a female Saiyan also appeared.

Koyama:
Plus, Vegeta married Bulma and had a child with her, so there would have to have been women.

Toriyama:
I hadn’t thought about it too deeply… but since they’re a warrior race, I think I simply didn’t draw any women. If it were this day and age, I might have drawn strong women, as well.

Koyama:
It was a time when there were hardly any anime with women who fought, wasn’t it?

Toriyama:
Well, it’d be hard to defeat a woman.

http://www.kanzenshuu.com/translations/ ... ma-nozawa/

[Boo Machine]

I don't want to sound like an ass but it would be VERY difficult to believe a top female fighter to be physically stronger than Goku/Vegeta. Its not sexism its just how biology generally works in humans and how its generally depicted in humanoids.


Now I'd believe a female villain pulling the strings but thats not the type of series DB is or has been.

As hard to believe as a 2 foot toddler that wiped out 6 universes? Or a cat person that destroys planets? I don't think proper biology applies to a lot of these characters.

Also it doesn't necessarily have to be about strength. This Hypothetical Female character could have a techniqe that they can use to their advantage. Much like how hit uses time skip to his.