How close are Goku and Vegeta now?

[TheUltimateNinja]

But the thing is with Toriyama and the guides most of their mistakes are minor and understandable, whereas with Toei they do totally illogical things and are quite brazen about it, of course there's those rare few times they actually get something right like having Vegeta fire his distraction shot against Cell in SSJ rather than in Base, but for the most part they totally ruin powerscaling with their stupid crap. For example, Goku going toe to toe with Kid Buu in SSJ2 but then actually doing worse in SSJ3.
In fact, I bet the reason Super's powerscaling is such a mess is because of Toei because even though there may have been a lot of weirdness in the original manga at least most A > B > C relationships were kept consistent.

Because some people at Toei just doesn't care about power consistency ? I might not be one of those people, but I've seen and know a lot of people who doesn't care about them either. Especially if Toei writers are thinking that because the series is aimed at kids, they likely wouldn't care about power consistency. It's been the same case for them ever since way back then.

And Toei is not to blame about everything either. As Toriyama himself is very forgetful, which causes some plot holes/inconsistency. Like his original script in RoF where Bulma had met Freeza on Namek which thank god was removed.

It can also be attributed to the fact that Toei has several different writers writing each episodes. Which likely will cause some inconsistency between previous episodes written by other people.

I'm not even sure what Super's power scaling have anything to do with the main point of the thread. Since it's quite obvious where Goku and Vegeta stands each other right now.

Of course Toriyama's going to make mistakes every now and then, he's just one man who hasn't touched the series in over a decade, but Toei should at least have a couple of interns to fact check. Also, it's not like it's impossible for writers to communicate, they could easily update each other on plot points.

[Khin]

Of course Toriyama's going to make mistakes every now and then, he's just one man who hasn't touched the series in over a decade, but Toei should at least have a couple of interns to fact check. Also, it's not like it's impossible for writers to communicate, they could easily update each other on plot points.

Toriyama said he reread the manga back in 2013. So did touched the series again before. The main reason why such power inconsistencies happen is simply because most writers at Toei aren't hardcore fans like us who spend most of their time on the internet debating some minutia and checking every single strength-related statement in the series. There's lots of people who doesn't care about power consistency. I don't even cared about them until I browsed the internet.

And I said before, this argument has absolutely nothing to do with the main point of the thread at all. And we're being off-topic.

[miguelnuva1]

Not close at all, Vegeta gets one-shotted by Kaioken x10 Goku.

I personally don't think Black ever really surpassed SSJB that much. He had a transformation and blade attack Vegeta wasn't expecting and then Zamasu always ran interference. I'm going to say their both equal right now and Black is actually weaker because his other half can't help him.

He wrecked Goku pretty easily too before Zamasu showed up, in fact he was about to kill Goku and Goku already knew about SSRose and his blade.

Goku also gets angry and owns both Rose Black and Zamasu at the same time.

As for the second fight I thought Goku and Black was a little more even but Black simply gained the upper hand at that moment.

[TheUltimateNinja]

Not close at all, Vegeta gets one-shotted by Kaioken x10 Goku.

I personally don't think Black ever really surpassed SSJB that much. He had a transformation and blade attack Vegeta wasn't expecting and then Zamasu always ran interference. I'm going to say their both equal right now and Black is actually weaker because his other half can't help him.

He wrecked Goku pretty easily too before Zamasu showed up, in fact he was about to kill Goku and Goku already knew about SSRose and his blade.

Goku also gets angry and owns both Rose Black and Zamasu at the same time.

As for the second fight I thought Goku and Black was a little more even but Black simply gained the upper hand at that moment.

But when Goku was doing that he was rage boosted + he probably got a bit of a Zenkai too so you can't compare it to his initial power which lost to Black.