Current state of the Toonami Asia English dub?

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Re: Current state of the Toonami Asia English dub?

Post by huzaifa_ahmed » Thu Dec 01, 2016 2:48 am

TheBlackPaladin wrote:
huzaifa_ahmed wrote:I figure promos pay way better. :thumbup:
They do. Like, not even close.
To dubbing or voicing a game? (Noticing it's the same, it's kinda unfair that anime doesnt get that but at least it shows J-games are a success)

I heard that for recording a JRPG dub, if often takes dozens of hours, & easily weeks of recording. Considering union wage is $825/day, you'd rack up low 10,000s easily, right? FF12 took eight weeks. Presuming the main actors (Nolan North, Keith Ferguson, Kari Wahlgren etc) came in 2-3 days a week, & Matt Mercer mentioned similar for Star Ocean 4 (dubbed non-union, but similar length is my point).

I know that even after/if PerformanceMatters goes through, any royalties will be very limited, but surely promos dont do that much? You know, it feels a tad unfair in that regard, seeing that Kevin Michael Richardson did a Pokémon WB commercial, but would laugh in anger if the actual show's audition got to him. Plus they took away the comercials from the main VA's. Different topic tho.

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Re: Current state of the Toonami Asia English dub?

Post by sangofe » Thu Dec 01, 2016 3:05 am

VejituhTheWarriorGuy wrote:Honestly, after listening to the FUNi dub clips, the Bang Zoom dub sounds amateurish and pretty meh in comparison. Can't wait for someone to lecture me on how I'm "wrong" but that's honestly how I feel
Can you say why you think it sounds amateurish and pretty "meh"?

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Re: Current state of the Toonami Asia English dub?

Post by Attitudefan » Thu Dec 01, 2016 5:56 am

sangofe wrote:
VejituhTheWarriorGuy wrote:Honestly, after listening to the FUNi dub clips, the Bang Zoom dub sounds amateurish and pretty meh in comparison. Can't wait for someone to lecture me on how I'm "wrong" but that's honestly how I feel
Can you say why you think it sounds amateurish and pretty "meh"?
Their mix is worse than Funimation's mix. If not the voice acting, it may very well be the sound mixing in the Bang-Zoom dub that sounds poor. Sound mixing is most of the battle in my opinion. A mixer can make something that initially sounds mediocre at best and make it sound fantastic. And honestly, that's the biggest difference I noticed, Funimation's sound mixing is vastly superior. It's kind of why the Pioneer/Saban era of dubbing also sounds great, the mix is fantastic and still holds up very well. Funi's uncut mix sounds flat (and so did Ocean's later attempt to finish up Z). However, Funimation's Kai dub mix sounds very dynamic and punchy. You can hear the difference in the way the gasping sounds in this clip; Bang-Zoom's is definitely flatter than Funimation's mix.

As they say, it's all in the mix.


Also, there should be an Ocean dub of Super. I just feel so torn and defeated about this dub, even if ends up being good.
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Re: Current state of the Toonami Asia English dub?

Post by VejituhTheWarriorGuy » Thu Dec 01, 2016 7:30 am

sangofe wrote:
VejituhTheWarriorGuy wrote:Honestly, after listening to the FUNi dub clips, the Bang Zoom dub sounds amateurish and pretty meh in comparison. Can't wait for someone to lecture me on how I'm "wrong" but that's honestly how I feel
Can you say why you think it sounds amateurish and pretty "meh"?
I feel like the Bang Zoom actors, while obviously really good actors, don't give that extra bit of finasse that FUNi's actors have. Everyone sounds so bland, straightforward and generic meanwhile FUNi's dub has actual character. Plus, as someone has already said, the sound mixing is pretty poor when compared to FUNi's. I mean, I have a problem with LA dubs in general as they feel too generic and straightforward for me meanwhile FUNi's are more exuberant and interesting to listen to. You want to talk about FUNi reusing a lot of voice actors? Bang Zoom reuses voice actors WAY more than FUNi does. You're always going to hear Erica Mendez, Matthew Mercer, Richard Epcar and Johnny Yong Bosch in every dub they do. Sure, Sabat does a lot of voices in Dragon Ball's dubs but he at least changes his voice up for every character to make them all stand out.
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Re: Current state of the Toonami Asia English dub?

Post by NitroEX » Thu Dec 01, 2016 8:24 am

Attitudefan wrote:Funi's uncut mix sounds flat (and so did Ocean's later attempt to finish up Z).
I totally agree with you on a sound mix being important although in the case of Ocean's later work I think it's important to keep in mind that the majority of it was recorded using old VHS tapes so what you're hearing from those TV rips isn't necessarily accurate to how the actual mix sounded. Much like how the original audio for the Japanese broadcast of Z sounded much clearer than what's provided on the DVDs I'd imagine the Ocean audio would have also sounded a lot better than the fan recordings we currently have.

Anyway from listening to the Super comparison the Funimation sound effect tracks seems to be a little louder there than the Bang Zoom dub but overall there isn't a big difference in sound quality that I can hear. At least not one that I would say makes it sound "meh".

In the case of the Pioneer dubs I'd say that was a big leap in sound quality especially considering Ocean added extra sound effects to the mix which complimented the visuals nicely and made it sound punchier.

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Re: Current state of the Toonami Asia English dub?

Post by 8000 Saiyan » Thu Dec 01, 2016 9:42 am

Attitudefan wrote:
sangofe wrote:
VejituhTheWarriorGuy wrote:Honestly, after listening to the FUNi dub clips, the Bang Zoom dub sounds amateurish and pretty meh in comparison. Can't wait for someone to lecture me on how I'm "wrong" but that's honestly how I feel
Can you say why you think it sounds amateurish and pretty "meh"?
Their mix is worse than Funimation's mix. If not the voice acting, it may very well be the sound mixing in the Bang-Zoom dub that sounds poor. Sound mixing is most of the battle in my opinion. A mixer can make something that initially sounds mediocre at best and make it sound fantastic. And honestly, that's the biggest difference I noticed, Funimation's sound mixing is vastly superior. It's kind of why the Pioneer/Saban era of dubbing also sounds great, the mix is fantastic and still holds up very well. Funi's uncut mix sounds flat (and so did Ocean's later attempt to finish up Z). However, Funimation's Kai dub mix sounds very dynamic and punchy. You can hear the difference in the way the gasping sounds in this clip; Bang-Zoom's is definitely flatter than Funimation's mix.

As they say, it's all in the mix.


Also, there should be an Ocean dub of Super. I just feel so torn and defeated about this dub, even if ends up being good.
I don't think Ocean will dub Super since Funimation's licensing of Super covers Canada. Pity because I'd love to see Drummond singing.
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Re: Current state of the Toonami Asia English dub?

Post by Baggie_Saiyan » Thu Dec 01, 2016 10:00 am

8000 Saiyan wrote:
Attitudefan wrote:
sangofe wrote:
Can you say why you think it sounds amateurish and pretty "meh"?
Their mix is worse than Funimation's mix. If not the voice acting, it may very well be the sound mixing in the Bang-Zoom dub that sounds poor. Sound mixing is most of the battle in my opinion. A mixer can make something that initially sounds mediocre at best and make it sound fantastic. And honestly, that's the biggest difference I noticed, Funimation's sound mixing is vastly superior. It's kind of why the Pioneer/Saban era of dubbing also sounds great, the mix is fantastic and still holds up very well. Funi's uncut mix sounds flat (and so did Ocean's later attempt to finish up Z). However, Funimation's Kai dub mix sounds very dynamic and punchy. You can hear the difference in the way the gasping sounds in this clip; Bang-Zoom's is definitely flatter than Funimation's mix.

As they say, it's all in the mix.


Also, there should be an Ocean dub of Super. I just feel so torn and defeated about this dub, even if ends up being good.
I don't think Ocean will dub Super since Funimation's licensing of Super covers Canada. Pity because I'd love to see Drummond singing.
Vegeta didn't sing in the Super retelling.

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Re: Current state of the Toonami Asia English dub?

Post by 8000 Saiyan » Thu Dec 01, 2016 10:06 am

Baggie_Saiyan wrote:
8000 Saiyan wrote:
Attitudefan wrote: Their mix is worse than Funimation's mix. If not the voice acting, it may very well be the sound mixing in the Bang-Zoom dub that sounds poor. Sound mixing is most of the battle in my opinion. A mixer can make something that initially sounds mediocre at best and make it sound fantastic. And honestly, that's the biggest difference I noticed, Funimation's sound mixing is vastly superior. It's kind of why the Pioneer/Saban era of dubbing also sounds great, the mix is fantastic and still holds up very well. Funi's uncut mix sounds flat (and so did Ocean's later attempt to finish up Z). However, Funimation's Kai dub mix sounds very dynamic and punchy. You can hear the difference in the way the gasping sounds in this clip; Bang-Zoom's is definitely flatter than Funimation's mix.

As they say, it's all in the mix.


Also, there should be an Ocean dub of Super. I just feel so torn and defeated about this dub, even if ends up being good.
I don't think Ocean will dub Super since Funimation's licensing of Super covers Canada. Pity because I'd love to see Drummond singing.
Vegeta didn't sing in the Super retelling.
Oh, right. I must have confused Super with BOG.
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Re: Current state of the Toonami Asia English dub?

Post by TheBlackPaladin » Thu Dec 01, 2016 12:56 pm

huzaifa_ahmed wrote:
TheBlackPaladin wrote:
huzaifa_ahmed wrote:I figure promos pay way better. :thumbup:
They do. Like, not even close.
To dubbing or voicing a game? (Noticing it's the same, it's kinda unfair that anime doesnt get that but at least it shows J-games are a success)

I heard that for recording a JRPG dub, if often takes dozens of hours, & easily weeks of recording. Considering union wage is $825/day, you'd rack up low 10,000s easily, right? FF12 took eight weeks. Presuming the main actors (Nolan North, Keith Ferguson, Kari Wahlgren etc) came in 2-3 days a week, & Matt Mercer mentioned similar for Star Ocean 4 (dubbed non-union, but similar length is my point).

I know that even after/if PerformanceMatters goes through, any royalties will be very limited, but surely promos dont do that much? You know, it feels a tad unfair in that regard, seeing that Kevin Michael Richardson did a Pokémon WB commercial, but would laugh in anger if the actual show's audition got to him. Plus they took away the comercials from the main VA's. Different topic tho.
Well, OK, allow me to rephrase ever-so-slightly. They almost always do. Like, almost always not even close.

The thing with promos is, while they have a lower base rate than video games do, the networks like to record a ton of them so they have different options, and actors get paid even for the promos that don't end up airing. On top of that, union rules are that if previously-recorded promo VO is attached to a promo with even the slightest difference in visuals, the voice actor has to get paid as though they voiced new promos. As such, while video games have a higher base rate, the money earned from promos adds up far, far more quickly the vast majority of the time. A promo voice actor could end up recording just one promo script and a few different tags ("tag" meaning the one-liner that's said at the very end, like, "Coming up next," or, "Tonight at 8," etc.), but if that one script and the few different tags are attached to multiple promos with different visual clips--even if those promos aren't necessarily aired--the voice actor could theoretically walk out of a booth they were in for only eight minutes...having just earned a $5,500 paycheck. If the network decides to re-use all those promos with different visuals, they'd get an additional $5,500 paycheck for no additional time in the booth.

For that matter, that's just a day's work...during the height of the production for the promos, they're working five days a week. Not every day is a $5,500-day, sometimes the networks will just want one quick new promo that earns the actor only a few hundred bucks, but they're usually making about $1-2K a day, five days a week, for just one show. Even a show that gets cancelled in its first season could easily net a voice actor something in the $50K range. As such, you can imagine how financially well off the voice actors doing promos for multiple shows are. That's just for specific shows, too...if the voice actor is the "imaging voice" (the official voice of the network itself, not just a specific show), that's a multi-year, multi-million dollar contract. For this reason, promos are some of the most coveted jobs in the whole VO biz.

To make the same amount of money from video games, even if the Performance Matters movement succeeds, would take much longer. Never mind that video games are also vocally stressful, whereas promos are not, so voice actors don't have to worry about being unable to work after a promo session (which is why sometimes a voice actor can only do one video game session a week and--if their agent is good--on a Friday so they have the weekend to recover their voice). Big difference from promo voice actors who often end up working 3-5 days a week for just one show. The only way an actor would make more voicing a game than doing promos for a show would be if the show in question was cancelled very, very quickly, and the video game in question had piles and piles of dialogue.
A "rather haggard" translation of a line from Future Gohan in DBZ, provided to FUNimation by Toei:
"To think of fighting that is this fun...so, it was pleasant fight, as many as, therefore is a feeling which is good the fight where."

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Re: Current state of the Toonami Asia English dub?

Post by huzaifa_ahmed » Thu Dec 01, 2016 2:30 pm

TheBlackPaladin wrote:
huzaifa_ahmed wrote:
TheBlackPaladin wrote:
They do. Like, not even close.
To dubbing or voicing a game? (Noticing it's the same, it's kinda unfair that anime doesnt get that but at least it shows J-games are a success)

I heard that for recording a JRPG dub, if often takes dozens of hours, & easily weeks of recording. Considering union wage is $825/day, you'd rack up low 10,000s easily, right? FF12 took eight weeks. Presuming the main actors (Nolan North, Keith Ferguson, Kari Wahlgren etc) came in 2-3 days a week, & Matt Mercer mentioned similar for Star Ocean 4 (dubbed non-union, but similar length is my point).

I know that even after/if PerformanceMatters goes through, any royalties will be very limited, but surely promos dont do that much? You know, it feels a tad unfair in that regard, seeing that Kevin Michael Richardson did a Pokémon WB commercial, but would laugh in anger if the actual show's audition got to him. Plus they took away the comercials from the main VA's. Different topic tho.
Well, OK, allow me to rephrase ever-so-slightly. They almost always do. Like, almost always not even close.

The thing with promos is, while they have a lower base rate than video games do, the networks like to record a ton of them so they have different options, and actors get paid even for the promos that don't end up airing. On top of that, union rules are that if previously-recorded promo VO is attached to a promo with even the slightest difference in visuals, the voice actor has to get paid as though they voiced new promos. As such, while video games have a higher base rate, the money earned from promos adds up far, far more quickly the vast majority of the time. A promo voice actor could end up recording just one promo script and a few different tags ("tag" meaning the one-liner that's said at the very end, like, "Coming up next," or, "Tonight at 8," etc.), but if that one script and the few different tags are attached to multiple promos with different visual clips--even if those promos aren't necessarily aired--the voice actor could theoretically walk out of a booth they were in for only eight minutes...having just earned a $5,500 paycheck. If the network decides to re-use all those promos with different visuals, they'd get an additional $5,500 paycheck for no additional time in the booth.

For that matter, that's just a day's work...during the height of the production for the promos, they're working five days a week. Not every day is a $5,500-day, sometimes the networks will just want one quick new promo that earns the actor only a few hundred bucks, but they're usually making about $1-2K a day, five days a week, for just one show. Even a show that gets cancelled in its first season could easily net a voice actor something in the $50K range. As such, you can imagine how financially well off the voice actors doing promos for multiple shows are. That's just for specific shows, too...if the voice actor is the "imaging voice" (the official voice of the network itself, not just a specific show), that's a multi-year, multi-million dollar contract. For this reason, promos are some of the most coveted jobs in the whole VO biz.

To make the same amount of money from video games, even if the Performance Matters movement succeeds, would take much longer. Never mind that video games are also vocally stressful, whereas promos are not, so voice actors don't have to worry about being unable to work after a promo session (which is why sometimes a voice actor can only do one video game session a week and--if their agent is good--on a Friday so they have the weekend to recover their voice). Big difference from promo voice actors who often end up working 3-5 days a week for just one show. The only way an actor would make more voicing a game than doing promos for a show would be if the show in question was cancelled very, very quickly, and the video game in question had piles and piles of dialogue.
I've always thought that (versus 99% of anyone outside of BTVA) I knew my share, but the way that promos work...has always escaped me, & I'm pretty sure it still does, even as I read this. Your amazingly comprehensive scope...never ceases to amaze me, Mr. BlackPaladin.

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Re: Current state of the Toonami Asia English dub?

Post by TheBlackPaladin » Sat Dec 03, 2016 6:49 pm

New clip up, featuring a bit of dialogue from Goku.

I can't tell who the actor is. However, I've heard some suggesting it's Lex Lang...which would be interesting, considering that, if that's true, this isn't the first time he has played a member of Goku's family.
A "rather haggard" translation of a line from Future Gohan in DBZ, provided to FUNimation by Toei:
"To think of fighting that is this fun...so, it was pleasant fight, as many as, therefore is a feeling which is good the fight where."

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Re: Current state of the Toonami Asia English dub?

Post by Theophrastus » Sat Dec 03, 2016 8:37 pm

My first guess based on that clip would be Lex Lang, yeah.

Sounded a little Schemmel-impression-y at the very beginning, but that kinda faded once the training started.

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Re: Current state of the Toonami Asia English dub?

Post by Vorige Waffe » Sun Dec 04, 2016 4:42 am

Yeah that's definitely Lang. That baritone and enunciation is a dead giveaway: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rip9gnjRjFg&t=1m51s

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Re: Current state of the Toonami Asia English dub?

Post by ParkerAL » Sun Dec 04, 2016 7:08 am

First impression: not enough energy in that performance for a character like Goku. The voice isn't bad, but it doesn't sound like what you'd expect for a main hero. Too nondescript.

Goten sounds cute.
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Re: Current state of the Toonami Asia English dub?

Post by simtek34 » Sun Dec 11, 2016 10:35 pm

I'm actually exited for this dub now. But the people in Asia will be confused by the voices. They had Z Ocean, Z Faulcouner, and Kai. Cant they just use the FUNimation Super backup censored dub?

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