Does it seem like Toriyama is making the Saiyans more heroic?

[WittyUsername]

This has been something I've noticed for a while, and I think it's something worth bringing up. As we all know, the Saiyans were initially presented as this irredeemable race of pure savages who lived for the sole purpose of killing and conquering. Ever since the series was revived though, there seems to have been more of an effort from Toriyama to try and put a more positive and romanticized spin on the race. First there was the 2008 Jump special, which established that Vegeta has a younger brother named Tarble, who by all accounts was a pretty peaceful and friendly person.

After the above, we had the backstory for the Super Saiyan God ritual, which established that a bunch of pure-hearted Saiyans first used the ritual to defeat some evil Saiyans in the past. Also, wasn't the initial concept for Beerus as a character this idea that he was the reason that the Saiyans were evil in the first place, by means of brainwashing?

Most controversially, we had Minus, which completely ignored the events of the TV special, in favor of making Bardock seem like less of a scumbag. Granted, while Bardock there was still established as being a space pirate, he was overall portrayed as being a loving husband and father who cared deeply for his family, wheat was the Bardock of the TV special didn't care one bit about Goku, right up until his death when he learned that his son was the key to defeating Freeza. This example probably isn't too drastic, given that as I mentioned earlier, Bardock was still shown to be a space pirate who killed people, but it still seemed like an attempt to paint the Saiyan race in a more positive light.

Finally, we most recently have had the thing with Cabba and Universe 6, where the Saiyans are apparently established as a heroic peace-keeping race without the influence of someone like Freeza.

Does anyone else get that impression that Toriyama is trying to retroactively make the Saiyans seem like less of an evil race?

[DBZAOTA482]

Not really... Saiyan race were always a naturally aggressive race of people with a natural knack for combat but it's kinda obvious Freeza influenced them and encouraged their bad tendencies.

Also Bardock was willing to die for his people... including his son.

[nickzambuto]

Each of those examples are explicitly exceptions to the rule. Tarble was outright cast from the planet for being a freak, Bardock and Gine were also considered weirdos, and the five goodhearted saiyans existed specifically to fight all the other saiyans, who were evil.

[WittyUsername]

Not really... Saiyan race were always a naturally aggressive race of people with a natural knack for combat but it's kinda obvious Freeza influenced them and encouraged their bad tendencies.

I don't think there was ever any indication that Freeza was the reason that the Saiyan race was the way they were. The implication seemed to be that the Saiyans were always a naturally bloodthirsty race of psychopaths, and that Freeza simply decided to use their love of killing to his advantage.

[DBZAOTA482]

Not really... Saiyan race were always a naturally aggressive race of people with a natural knack for combat but it's kinda obvious Freeza influenced them and encouraged their bad tendencies.

I don't think there was ever any indication that Freeza was the reason that the Saiyan race was the way they were. The implication seemed to be that the Saiyans were always a naturally bloodthirsty race of psychopaths, and that Freeza simply decided to use their love of killing to his advantage.

Saiyan became violent because of the Tsufus oppressing them. Freeza made things worse by encouraging their behavior.

The Saiyans became evil basically because they sold their souls

[sintzu]

Yes, it seems like Toriyama is trying to reboot the Saiyans because he wants kids to see Goku and Vegeta in a more positive light and not part of a race of killers which is probably due to his age.

In terms of Tarble, I'd have him be a lot stronger than he is and out for Vegeta's head for stealing everything from him.

[Adrian Malacoda]

I didn't get that impression. Rather, it seems like he's introducing exceptions to the rule to show that good Saiyans could or did exist. As nickzambuto said, at least during King Vegeta's reign the good Saiyans were very few in number and considered freaks. Also, IIRC the good Saiyans of the Super Saiyan God legend ultimately failed. Perhaps back in that era there were more good Saiyans, and the failure of the Super Saiyan God heralded the dominance of the evil Saiyans over the race.

This might all be leading up to universe 6 and Freeza/Frost's race. Remember that Freeza and his father had an abnormal amount of cruelty and battle power due to a mutation, implying that the ordinary members of their race were different. Perhaps the evil Saiyans came about due to a similar circumstance, far in the past, and due to the defeat of the Super Saiyan God, the evil Saiyans survived all the way to the King Vegeta era. The Saiyans of Universe 6 either never had this mutation, or successfully fought against it, so they don't exhibit the same traits as their Universe 7 counterparts.

[Ki Breaker]

Yeah, seems like it, with new Saiyan and being heros and what not..
Not really a fan of this but I guess I will roll with it

[sintzu]

Not really a fan of this but I guess I will roll with it.

I'd be fine with U6's Saiyans being good if it turns out they have a lot to hide and they're not as good as Cabba thought they were.

[The Awful Truth]

This has been something I've noticed for a while, and I think it's something worth bringing up. As we all know, the Saiyans were initially presented as this irredeemable race of pure savages who lived for the sole purpose of killing and conquering. Ever since the series was revived though, there seems to have been more of an effort from Toriyama to try and put a more positive and romanticized spin on the race. First there was the 2008 Jump special, which established that Vegeta has a younger brother named Tarble, who by all accounts was a pretty peaceful and friendly person.

After the above, we had the backstory for the Super Saiyan God ritual, which established that a bunch of pure-hearted Saiyans first used the ritual to defeat some evil Saiyans in the past. Also, wasn't the initial concept for Beerus as a character this idea that he was the reason that the Saiyans were evil in the first place, by means of brainwashing?

Most controversially, we had Minus, which completely ignored the events of the TV special, in favor of making Bardock seem like less of a scumbag. Granted, while Bardock there was still established as being a space pirate, he was overall portrayed as being a loving husband and father who cared deeply for his family, wheat was the Bardock of the TV special didn't care one bit about Goku, right up until his death when he learned that his son was the key to defeating Freeza. This example probably isn't too drastic, given that as I mentioned earlier, Bardock was still shown to be a space pirate who killed people, but it still seemed like an attempt to paint the Saiyan race in a more positive light.

Finally, we most recently have had the thing with Cabba and Universe 6, where the Saiyans are apparently established as a heroic peace-keeping race without the influence of someone like Freeza.

Does anyone else get that impression that Toriyama is trying to retroactively make the Saiyans seem like less of an evil race?

Yes, Akira Toriyama has done some serious backpedaling and whitewashing about the saiyans and especially about Goku's parents. All these new retcons and revelations completely undermined what Goku said to Vegeta and later to Freeza.

Didn't Goku tell Vegeta that he was glad that he was sent to Earth because he was "low-class trash" and that it was the best thing that ever happened to him?

Didn't Goku basically tell Freeza that he wanted nothing to do with the saiyans and that they got punished for their evil deeds? Goku even tried to spare Freeza's life because he had no intention to avenge a bunch of villains. But now we know that Goku's mother was one of the gentle, peaceful saiyans and that Goku's father is literally responsible for Goku surviving the destruction of their homeworld.

It was a terrible retcon. It turns out that all this time Goku believed something that wasn't true. Even worse this new revelation doesn't work at all with the already existing continuity. Think about it. Why didn't Fortuneteller Baba bring Bardock and Gine back to life for a day when Goku was still a kid? It's not like they would be angry, violent, and hostile the way Raditz was. They loved Goku and cared about him. They wanted him to live peacefully on Earth, they even warned him not to look at the full moon. It is so obvious that this is not what Toriyama had in mind back when he introduced Goku's brother Raditz and Goku's saiyan origin, history, and culture. In 1990 Toriyama did character designs for the Bardock TV Special. He knew what the story would be about and he did not correct or change anything. He didn't tell the scriptwriters at Toei Animation "no, Goku's father wasn't like that, he actually loved his wife and cared a lot about Goku." In 1990 Toriyama didn't even bother to reveal who Goku's mother was, but that's when it should have been done.

As for the saiyans in Universe 6 somehow evolving without tails... it's just stupid. It tells me that Akira Toriyama is completely out of touch and doesn't know what he is doing anymore. I don't think he understands very well why the saiyans became popular in the first place. Hint: it's the same reason why pirates, outlaw bikers, and characters like Tony Montana and Darth Vader are popular. Because they are not nice, good, peaceful, or gentle.

[sintzu]

In 1990 Toriyama did character designs for the Bardock TV Special. He knew what the story would be about and he did not correct or change anything.

As for the saiyans in Universe 6 somehow evolving without tails... it's just stupid. It tells me that Akira Toriyama is completely out of touch and doesn't know what he is doing anymore.

Not only that but he said out of all the movies, it was his favorite one. (I know it's not a movie but that was the question.)

I don't think it's that, I think he just doesn't want his main character to be associated with such evil but he's 20+ years too late.

[Ki Breaker]

Not really a fan of this but I guess I will roll with it.

I'd be fine with U6's Saiyans being good if it turns out they have a lot to hide and they're not as good as Cabba thought they were.

Yeah! Now that's much better

[dbgtFO]

Each of those examples are explicitly exceptions to the rule. Tarble was outright cast from the planet for being a freak, Bardock and Gine were also considered weirdos, and the five goodhearted saiyans existed specifically to fight all the other saiyans, who were evil.

Yes, but all we ever get now are exceptions to the rule. The repeated claims of Saiyan brutality and evil loses its meaning, when the modern franchise show none of it and only features good Saiyans. They simply stop being exceptions after a while and start being the established version of the race.

And to OP, I completely agree. Toriyama has got old and he has mellowed out, because he's rich and satisfied with life. No wonder that he starts removing darkness from his stories and has gone towards a more positive approach or with the supposed danger drowned out by an even more whimsical nature than before.
Just look at those creatures Bardock and his fellow Saiyan comrade kill; they look like dumb monsters who probably had it coming anyway. By making them so different from how us humans look like, he makes it more acceptable to us that Bardock kills them, rather than have us be rooting against this merciless killer.
It is indeed whitewashing.

[TheGreatness25]

The only one that bugs me is how Burdock has been reworked as just one swell guy. He was never a hero, but with decades of the fans' romanticism of his character, I feel like we got what "we" asked for -- and some stuff we didn't, like Dragon Ball Minus. Now, Goku's mom has always been an intrigue for the fans, but wow...

[Totamo]

This has been something I've noticed for a while, and I think it's something worth bringing up. As we all know, the Saiyans were initially presented as this irredeemable race of pure savages who lived for the sole purpose of killing and conquering. Ever since the series was revived though, there seems to have been more of an effort from Toriyama to try and put a more positive and romanticized spin on the race. First there was the 2008 Jump special, which established that Vegeta has a younger brother named Tarble, who by all accounts was a pretty peaceful and friendly person.

After the above, we had the backstory for the Super Saiyan God ritual, which established that a bunch of pure-hearted Saiyans first used the ritual to defeat some evil Saiyans in the past. Also, wasn't the initial concept for Beerus as a character this idea that he was the reason that the Saiyans were evil in the first place, by means of brainwashing?

Most controversially, we had Minus, which completely ignored the events of the TV special, in favor of making Bardock seem like less of a scumbag. Granted, while Bardock there was still established as being a space pirate, he was overall portrayed as being a loving husband and father who cared deeply for his family, wheat was the Bardock of the TV special didn't care one bit about Goku, right up until his death when he learned that his son was the key to defeating Freeza. This example probably isn't too drastic, given that as I mentioned earlier, Bardock was still shown to be a space pirate who killed people, but it still seemed like an attempt to paint the Saiyan race in a more positive light.

Finally, we most recently have had the thing with Cabba and Universe 6, where the Saiyans are apparently established as a heroic peace-keeping race without the influence of someone like Freeza.

Does anyone else get that impression that Toriyama is trying to retroactively make the Saiyans seem like less of an evil race?

Yes, Akira Toriyama has done some serious backpedaling and whitewashing about the saiyans and especially about Goku's parents. All these new retcons and revelations completely undermined what Goku said to Vegeta and later to Freeza.

Didn't Goku tell Vegeta that he was glad that he was sent to Earth because he was "low-class trash" and that it was the best thing that ever happened to him?

Didn't Goku basically tell Freeza that he wanted nothing to do with the saiyans and that they got punished for their evil deeds? Goku even tried to spare Freeza's life because he had no intention to avenge a bunch of villains. But now we know that Goku's mother was one of the gentle, peaceful saiyans and that Goku's father is literally responsible for Goku surviving the destruction of their homeworld[/i].

It was a terrible retcon. It turns out that all this time Goku believed something that wasn't true. Even worse this new revelation doesn't work at all with the already existing continuity. Think about it. Why didn't Fortuneteller Baba bring Bardock and Gine back to life for a day when Goku was still a kid? It's not like they would be angry, violent, and hostile the way Raditz was. They loved Goku and cared about him. They wanted him to live peacefully on Earth, they even warned him not to look at the full moon. It is so obvious that this is not what Toriyama had in mind back when he introduced Goku's brother Raditz and Goku's saiyan origin, history, and culture. In 1990 Toriyama did character designs for the Bardock TV Special. He knew what the story would be about and he did not correct or change anything. He didn't tell the scriptwriters at Toei Animation "no, Goku's father wasn't like that, he actually loved his wife and cared a lot about Goku." In 1990 Toriyama didn't even bother to reveal who Goku's mother was, but that's when it should have been done.

As for the saiyans in Universe 6 somehow evolving without tails... it's just stupid. It tells me that Akira Toriyama is completely out of touch and doesn't know what he is doing anymore. I don't think he understands very well why the saiyans became popular in the first place. Hint: it's the same reason why pirates, outlaw bikers, and characters like Tony Montana and Darth Vader are popular. Because they are not nice, good, peaceful, or gentle.

both of these are false.
goku told vegeta he was glad he was sent to earth because that's what made him as strong as he is. however had goku been accepted like his brother he would have been stronger.

goku actually accepted he was a saiyan in that arc and he didn't kill frieza because he was bored with him and already proved his point.
here is the best thing he ever said about them
"For you to cry... For you to beg of me, must have been awfully difficult, I bet. I understand. It wasn't that your fellow Saiyans had been killed that was rough on you- Having to do as he told you must have been worse than anything you could stand. I hated you so much... but you had your Saiyan pride. And now I too will share in some of that pride of yours. I am a Saiyan raised on Earth! For all the Saiyans who were killed by you... as well as for all the Namekians here... I am going to beat you"

[The Awful Truth]

This has been something I've noticed for a while, and I think it's something worth bringing up. As we all know, the Saiyans were initially presented as this irredeemable race of pure savages who lived for the sole purpose of killing and conquering. Ever since the series was revived though, there seems to have been more of an effort from Toriyama to try and put a more positive and romanticized spin on the race. First there was the 2008 Jump special, which established that Vegeta has a younger brother named Tarble, who by all accounts was a pretty peaceful and friendly person.

After the above, we had the backstory for the Super Saiyan God ritual, which established that a bunch of pure-hearted Saiyans first used the ritual to defeat some evil Saiyans in the past. Also, wasn't the initial concept for Beerus as a character this idea that he was the reason that the Saiyans were evil in the first place, by means of brainwashing?

Most controversially, we had Minus, which completely ignored the events of the TV special, in favor of making Bardock seem like less of a scumbag. Granted, while Bardock there was still established as being a space pirate, he was overall portrayed as being a loving husband and father who cared deeply for his family, wheat was the Bardock of the TV special didn't care one bit about Goku, right up until his death when he learned that his son was the key to defeating Freeza. This example probably isn't too drastic, given that as I mentioned earlier, Bardock was still shown to be a space pirate who killed people, but it still seemed like an attempt to paint the Saiyan race in a more positive light.

Finally, we most recently have had the thing with Cabba and Universe 6, where the Saiyans are apparently established as a heroic peace-keeping race without the influence of someone like Freeza.

Does anyone else get that impression that Toriyama is trying to retroactively make the Saiyans seem like less of an evil race?

Yes, Akira Toriyama has done some serious backpedaling and whitewashing about the saiyans and especially about Goku's parents. All these new retcons and revelations completely undermined what Goku said to Vegeta and later to Freeza.

Didn't Goku tell Vegeta that he was glad that he was sent to Earth because he was "low-class trash" and that it was the best thing that ever happened to him?

Didn't Goku basically tell Freeza that he wanted nothing to do with the saiyans and that they got punished for their evil deeds? Goku even tried to spare Freeza's life because he had no intention to avenge a bunch of villains. But now we know that Goku's mother was one of the gentle, peaceful saiyans and that Goku's father is literally responsible for Goku surviving the destruction of their homeworld[/i].

It was a terrible retcon. It turns out that all this time Goku believed something that wasn't true. Even worse this new revelation doesn't work at all with the already existing continuity. Think about it. Why didn't Fortuneteller Baba bring Bardock and Gine back to life for a day when Goku was still a kid? It's not like they would be angry, violent, and hostile the way Raditz was. They loved Goku and cared about him. They wanted him to live peacefully on Earth, they even warned him not to look at the full moon. It is so obvious that this is not what Toriyama had in mind back when he introduced Goku's brother Raditz and Goku's saiyan origin, history, and culture. In 1990 Toriyama did character designs for the Bardock TV Special. He knew what the story would be about and he did not correct or change anything. He didn't tell the scriptwriters at Toei Animation "no, Goku's father wasn't like that, he actually loved his wife and cared a lot about Goku." In 1990 Toriyama didn't even bother to reveal who Goku's mother was, but that's when it should have been done.

As for the saiyans in Universe 6 somehow evolving without tails... it's just stupid. It tells me that Akira Toriyama is completely out of touch and doesn't know what he is doing anymore. I don't think he understands very well why the saiyans became popular in the first place. Hint: it's the same reason why pirates, outlaw bikers, and characters like Tony Montana and Darth Vader are popular. Because they are not nice, good, peaceful, or gentle.

both of these are false.
goku told vegeta he was glad he was sent to earth because that's what made him as strong as he is. however had goku been accepted like his brother he would have been stronger.

That's not what I saw in DBZ or in the new DB Super series.

If Goku was raised by his big brother Raditz or even by his parents he would at best become Nappa 2.0 which is nothing compared to what Goku actually accomplished in DBZ and in DB Super. What held the saiyans back was their own arrogance and stupidity. They were not martial artists, their mentality was basically "we are already stronger than 99.9% of the people in the universe and if we encounter someone stronger than us we will just use our ozaru forms to end the battle quickly... and if you are low-class you will always be low-class". This is why Freeza was able to enslave them in the first place. This is why Raditz was so weak compared to Nappa and Vegeta despite a lifetime of combat.

Consider this. Vegeta was able to become a super saiyan after just 3 years of hard training. I think it's safe to assume that SSJ Vegeta could have easily defeated Freeza. But he was able to become a SSJ only after he trained hard for 3 years... which is something that he never did before. Goku inspired Vegeta to learn how to sense ki, and to change his mentality, which led Vegeta to a level of power that his people couldn't even dream of.

Goku is actually incredibly lucky that he wasn't raised by his people, and Vegeta is very lucky that he met Goku.

goku actually accepted he was a saiyan in that arc and he didn't kill frieza because he was bored with him and already proved his point.
here is the best thing he ever said about them
"For you to cry... For you to beg of me, must have been awfully difficult, I bet. I understand. It wasn't that your fellow Saiyans had been killed that was rough on you- Having to do as he told you must have been worse than anything you could stand. I hated you so much... but you had your Saiyan pride. And now I too will share in some of that pride of yours. I am a Saiyan raised on Earth! For all the Saiyans who were killed by you... as well as for all the Namekians here... I am going to beat you"

Goku's decision to spare Freeza's life, giving Freeza some of his ki to keep him alive, looks even more stupid now than it already was. Goku not only did not avenge Krillin's death but he even failed to avenge his nice, gentle saiyan mother who wasn't even a villain. I know that Goku didn't know anything about his parents and probably assumed that they were evil scum like Raditz but it still looks really bad.

[Totamo]

Yes, Akira Toriyama has done some serious backpedaling and whitewashing about the saiyans and especially about Goku's parents. All these new retcons and revelations completely undermined what Goku said to Vegeta and later to Freeza.

Didn't Goku tell Vegeta that he was glad that he was sent to Earth because he was "low-class trash" and that it was the best thing that ever happened to him?

Didn't Goku basically tell Freeza that he wanted nothing to do with the saiyans and that they got punished for their evil deeds? Goku even tried to spare Freeza's life because he had no intention to avenge a bunch of villains. But now we know that Goku's mother was one of the gentle, peaceful saiyans and that Goku's father is literally responsible for Goku surviving the destruction of their homeworld[/i].

It was a terrible retcon. It turns out that all this time Goku believed something that wasn't true. Even worse this new revelation doesn't work at all with the already existing continuity. Think about it. Why didn't Fortuneteller Baba bring Bardock and Gine back to life for a day when Goku was still a kid? It's not like they would be angry, violent, and hostile the way Raditz was. They loved Goku and cared about him. They wanted him to live peacefully on Earth, they even warned him not to look at the full moon. It is so obvious that this is not what Toriyama had in mind back when he introduced Goku's brother Raditz and Goku's saiyan origin, history, and culture. In 1990 Toriyama did character designs for the Bardock TV Special. He knew what the story would be about and he did not correct or change anything. He didn't tell the scriptwriters at Toei Animation "no, Goku's father wasn't like that, he actually loved his wife and cared a lot about Goku." In 1990 Toriyama didn't even bother to reveal who Goku's mother was, but that's when it should have been done.

As for the saiyans in Universe 6 somehow evolving without tails... it's just stupid. It tells me that Akira Toriyama is completely out of touch and doesn't know what he is doing anymore. I don't think he understands very well why the saiyans became popular in the first place. Hint: it's the same reason why pirates, outlaw bikers, and characters like Tony Montana and Darth Vader are popular. Because they are not nice, good, peaceful, or gentle.

both of these are false.
goku told vegeta he was glad he was sent to earth because that's what made him as strong as he is. however had goku been accepted like his brother he would have been stronger.

That's not what I saw in DBZ or in the new DB Super series.

If Goku was raised by his big brother Raditz or even by his parents he would at best become Nappa 2.0 which is nothing compared to what Goku actually accomplished in DBZ and in DB Super. What held the saiyans back was their own arrogance and stupidity. They were not martial artists, their mentality was basically "we are already stronger than 99.9% of the people in the universe and if we encounter someone stronger than us we will just use our ozaru forms to end the battle quickly... and if you are low-class you will always be low-class". This is why Freeza was able to enslave them in the first place. This is why Raditz was so weak compared to Nappa and Vegeta despite a lifetime of combat.

Consider this. Vegeta was able to become a super saiyan after just 3 years of hard training. I think it's safe to assume that SSJ Vegeta could have easily defeated Freeza. But he was able to become a SSJ only after he trained hard for 3 years... which is something that he never did before. Goku inspired Vegeta to learn how to sense ki, and to change his mentality, which led Vegeta to a level of power that his people couldn't even dream of.

Goku is actually incredibly lucky that he wasn't raised by his people, and Vegeta is very lucky that he met Goku.

goku actually accepted he was a saiyan in that arc and he didn't kill frieza because he was bored with him and already proved his point.
here is the best thing he ever said about them
"For you to cry... For you to beg of me, must have been awfully difficult, I bet. I understand. It wasn't that your fellow Saiyans had been killed that was rough on you- Having to do as he told you must have been worse than anything you could stand. I hated you so much... but you had your Saiyan pride. And now I too will share in some of that pride of yours. I am a Saiyan raised on Earth! For all the Saiyans who were killed by you... as well as for all the Namekians here... I am going to beat you"

Goku's decision to spare Freeza's life, giving Freeza some of his ki to keep him alive, looks even more stupid now than it already was. Goku not only did not avenge Krillin's death but he even failed to avenge his nice, gentle saiyan mother who wasn't even a villain. I know that Goku didn't know anything about his parents and probably assumed that they were evil scum like Raditz but it still looks really bad.

But goku was much weaker than nappa and only got that strong because his brother killed him. raditz was a planet buster something goku wasn't until he died and met king kai. Also goku is still a saiyan who has those same traits. goku is arrogant, why do you think he always holds back?

regardless, with frieza. goku did try to finish him off when frieza tried to kill him, also I just told you goku is selfish and only wanted a good fight out of frieza. once he got that, there was no need.

[Totamo]

Each of those examples are explicitly exceptions to the rule. Tarble was outright cast from the planet for being a freak, Bardock and Gine were also considered weirdos, and the five goodhearted saiyans existed specifically to fight all the other saiyans, who were evil.

Yes, but all we ever get now are exceptions to the rule. The repeated claims of Saiyan brutality and evil loses its meaning, when the modern franchise show none of it and only features good Saiyans. They simply stop being exceptions after a while and start being the established version of the race.

And to OP, I completely agree. Toriyama has got old and he has mellowed out, because he's rich and satisfied with life. No wonder that he starts removing darkness from his stories and has gone towards a more positive approach or with the supposed danger drowned out by an even more whimsical nature than before.
Just look at those creatures Bardock and his fellow Saiyan comrade kill; they look like dumb monsters who probably had it coming anyway. By making them so different from how us humans look like, he makes it more acceptable to us that Bardock kills them, rather than have us be rooting against this merciless killer.
It is indeed whitewashing.

but the thing is: they were. you can't ignore history, they were several thousand saiyans all who were evil and brutal like vegeta. just because we have 8 saiyans in our universe who are good define what you mean by good when goku and vegeta have constantly risked planet life over a fight and a twin universe that have a completely different set of saiyans which vegeta brings up doesn't mean saiyans are more heroic.

this is like saying they are the most powerful race just because we only have strong ones

[TheMikado]

I'm really not a fan of modern Saiyan treatment. I really liked the concept that everything that pretty much kept happening to them was their own faults and that they would be continuously be paying the price for their saiyan heritage and power no matter how strong they became. The whole righteous pure saiyan thing was awful. I prefer the GT route of painting them as ruthless killers and the enemy feeling justified in wiping that threat from the universe.

[ABED]

I'm really not a fan of modern Saiyan treatment. I really liked the concept that everything that pretty much kept happening to them was their own faults and that they would be continuously be paying the price for their saiyan heritage and power no matter how strong they became. The whole righteous pure saiyan thing was awful. I prefer the GT route of painting them as ruthless killers and the enemy feeling justified in wiping that threat from the universe.

Why should the Saiyans that are alive, including the half Saiyans, still have to pay the price for the unchosen?