I find Goku to be the worst character in this show

[Draconic]

^ Just for clarity. I don't like this Goku and I think that's by design of the writers. I feel they could have been more subtle in their approach but it's obvious they couldn't because it would be hand waved away with the
"Goku has always been like this" nonsense. I firmly believe that are purposely doing this and unfortunately have to be this blatant because the fandom will go into denial..

Anyway, I'm interested to see what comes out of all this, but I don't expect fans of the way Goku previously acted to be happy about this either.

I'm not sure how those two don't work with eachother. Yes, Goku's "always been like this", only that now it's brought into the forefront and actually used to generate conflict, whereas before every character would just go with whatever stupid shit Goku came up with.

[Asura]

^ Just for clarity. I don't like this Goku and I think that's by design of the writers. I feel they could have been more subtle in their approach but it's obvious they couldn't because it would be hand waved away with the
"Goku has always been like this" nonsense. I firmly believe that are purposely doing this and unfortunately have to be this blatant because the fandom will go into denial..

Anyway, I'm interested to see what comes out of all this, but I don't expect fans of the way Goku previously acted to be happy about this either.

I'm not sure how those two don't work with eachother. Yes, Goku's "always been like this", only that now it's brought into the forefront and actually used to generate conflict, whereas before every character would just go with whatever stupid shit Goku came up with.

The problem is not that Goku's always been like this, it's that they're turning up these faults that he's always had to ridiculous one-dimensional levels, to the point where it basically just defines his character. Like sansrivaaL said, Goku doesn't give a fuck anymore, and his only reaction to all of this horrible news of trillions of innocent people having to die is "fuck ya'll who's next?"

Goku has always had these faults, but what people aren't realizing is that they were never to this level.

[TheMikado]

^ Just for clarity. I don't like this Goku and I think that's by design of the writers. I feel they could have been more subtle in their approach but it's obvious they couldn't because it would be hand waved away with the
"Goku has always been like this" nonsense. I firmly believe that are purposely doing this and unfortunately have to be this blatant because the fandom will go into denial..

Anyway, I'm interested to see what comes out of all this, but I don't expect fans of the way Goku previously acted to be happy about this either.

I'm not sure how those two don't work with eachother. Yes, Goku's "always been like this", only that now it's brought into the forefront and actually used to generate conflict, whereas before every character would just go with whatever stupid shit Goku came up with.

The problem is not that Goku's always been like this, it's that they're turning up these faults that he's always had to ridiculous one-dimensional levels, to the point where it basically just defines his character. Like sansrivaaL said, Goku doesn't give a fuck anymore, and his only reaction to all of this horrible news of trillions of innocent people having to die is "fuck ya'll who's next?"

Goku has always had these faults, but what people aren't realizing is that they were never to this level.

Thank you, no one is saying Goku is "Superman" or perfect or whatever anyone else wants to lob at it. His negative traits just never overshadowed him as a character like this before. That's all.

[Draconic]

^ Just for clarity. I don't like this Goku and I think that's by design of the writers. I feel they could have been more subtle in their approach but it's obvious they couldn't because it would be hand waved away with the
"Goku has always been like this" nonsense. I firmly believe that are purposely doing this and unfortunately have to be this blatant because the fandom will go into denial..

Anyway, I'm interested to see what comes out of all this, but I don't expect fans of the way Goku previously acted to be happy about this either.

I'm not sure how those two don't work with eachother. Yes, Goku's "always been like this", only that now it's brought into the forefront and actually used to generate conflict, whereas before every character would just go with whatever stupid shit Goku came up with.

The problem is not that Goku's always been like this, it's that they're turning up these faults that he's always had to ridiculous one-dimensional levels, to the point where it basically just defines his character. Like sansrivaaL said, Goku doesn't give a fuck anymore, and his only reaction to all of this horrible news of trillions of innocent people having to die is "fuck ya'll who's next?"

Goku has always had these faults, but what people aren't realizing is that they were never to this level.

I 100% agree that those traits are not that well handled, but if they didn't turn them up a little, you couldn't make a story about them. It's a story that brings Goku's poison front and center, everybody is seeing it and it's fucking everybody over. Of course it seems to overshadow him. It's the first time it's actually trying to be addessed. It should culminate in Goku getting some development, hopefully. This whole Goku is evil thing couldn't happen if you didn't have at least some build up in the earlier arcs, so to say that the writers just up and decided to write Goku like this out of nowhere is just stupid. However, that also doesn't mean they're doing a great job. But there's a middle between saying that Goku's main traits are nonsense and that they aren't well represented.

[Asura]

I'm not sure how those two don't work with eachother. Yes, Goku's "always been like this", only that now it's brought into the forefront and actually used to generate conflict, whereas before every character would just go with whatever stupid shit Goku came up with.

The problem is not that Goku's always been like this, it's that they're turning up these faults that he's always had to ridiculous one-dimensional levels, to the point where it basically just defines his character. Like sansrivaaL said, Goku doesn't give a fuck anymore, and his only reaction to all of this horrible news of trillions of innocent people having to die is "fuck ya'll who's next?"

Goku has always had these faults, but what people aren't realizing is that they were never to this level.

I 100% agree that those traits are not that well handled, but if they didn't turn them up a little, you couldn't make a story about them. It's a story that brings Goku's poison front and center, everybody is seeing it and it's fucking everybody over. Of course it seems to overshadow him. It's the first time it's actually trying to be addessed. It should culminate in Goku getting some development, hopefully. This whole Goku is evil thing couldn't happen if you didn't have at least some build up in the earlier arcs, so to say that the writers just up and decided to write Goku like this out of nowhere is just stupid. However, that also doesn't mean they're doing a great job. But there's a middle between saying that Goku's main traits are nonsense and that they aren't well represented.

But how does overexaggerating a character's faults to ridiculous levels out of nowhere make for good writing? There hasn't even been an explanation for it (yet). To overexaggerate and twist Goku's character simply to make it a sub-plot where people are angry at Goku for something that isn't even usually his character, is some really awful and nonsensical writing.

To me it would be like Vegeta doing all that evil shit during the Buu saga without turning Majin. It just wouldn't make any sense. You could say "But Vegeta used to be evil! This was always his character!" or "But Vegeta still wasn't that great of a guy back then!" but would you be able to defend normal Vegeta (not Majin) killing all those people at the tournament? Would that really be good writing to turn Vegeta's evilness up to 120% out of literally nowhere without any excuse (like Majin)?

[SansrivaaL]

The problem is not that Goku's always been like this, it's that they're turning up these faults that he's always had to ridiculous one-dimensional levels, to the point where it basically just defines his character. Like sansrivaaL said, Goku doesn't give a fuck anymore, and his only reaction to all of this horrible news of trillions of innocent people having to die is "fuck ya'll who's next?"

Goku has always had these faults, but what people aren't realizing is that they were never to this level.

I 100% agree that those traits are not that well handled, but if they didn't turn them up a little, you couldn't make a story about them. It's a story that brings Goku's poison front and center, everybody is seeing it and it's fucking everybody over. Of course it seems to overshadow him. It's the first time it's actually trying to be addessed. It should culminate in Goku getting some development, hopefully. This whole Goku is evil thing couldn't happen if you didn't have at least some build up in the earlier arcs, so to say that the writers just up and decided to write Goku like this out of nowhere is just stupid. However, that also doesn't mean they're doing a great job. But there's a middle between saying that Goku's main traits are nonsense and that they aren't well represented.

But how does overexaggerating a character's faults to ridiculous levels out of nowhere make for good writing? There hasn't even been an explanation for it (yet). To overexaggerate and twist Goku's character simply to make it a sub-plot where people are angry at Goku for something that isn't even usually his character, is some really awful and nonsensical writing.

To me it would be like Vegeta doing all that evil shit during the Buu saga without turning Majin. It just wouldn't make any sense. You could say "But Vegeta used to be evil! This was always his character!" or "But Vegeta still wasn't that great of a guy back then!" but would you be able to defend normal Vegeta (not Majin) killing all those people at the tournament? Would that really be good writing to turn Vegeta's evilness up to 120% out of literally nowhere without any excuse (like Majin)?

I think what he means is they're obviously making a story about Goku being the villain/evil and it wont work if they show how Goku would normally respond to those situations, Toei/Toriyama's trying to pull a fast one on us, like "yeah you know, Goku? the main character? well he's the antagonist in this arc now, but.... wait for it... wait for the twist." I mean its really obvious, Goku's main rivals are a team of justice heroes The Justice League of U11, so Goku's supposed to be the bad guy.
I think its IC if Goku tries to piss them to get a better fight, I mean he did that with Oob (poor trashtalking tho) but we know Goku's willing to have people hate him just to get a good fight out of it, and he's doing a really amazing job making people hate him, since not just characters but also people in the fanbase are starting to hate him.

[Basako]

You say that you could see him concerned about the danger, when exactly did you see that?

I didn't say it well, I meant that I didn't see him as concerned as he should, so we agree on this. Apart from the first reaction that he has when he hears about the rule of erasing universes, the rest of the time he is like ignoring that.

Goku didn't say a damn thing or react at all when Bergamo asked Zeno about calling the tournament off if he won. After Goku won, he basically started shit-talking his opponent, which was incredibly odd and something Goku has never done. When all the universes started getting angry and yelling at Goku for spelling out their doom, Goku didn't seem particularly worried at all, and was literally like "Fuck all of you, BRING IT ON! BRING IT ON!"

The point is Goku doesn't even try to make himself NOT look like the villain. He straight up doesn't give a shit, and doesn't even deny it when Toppo calls him evil. At no point do you ever see Goku surprised, shocked, worried, anything when news about the universes are being erased. He had a dumb look on his face in episode 78 when the Grand Priest was telling everyone, but that was about it. He makes no effort to try and dispel the narrative of him being evil/a villain, and it's all very odd and out-of-character, although I believe it's being done on purpose.

The grand priest said that Zeno would erase all universes if Goku didn't go in full strenght, so he didn't have other choice. What did Goku have to say?

Bergamo tells him that the fighters of the rest universes will go against him, then is when he says, ok, come to me with the strongest guys you find, I'll fight and win. He is not insulting anyone, he is being proud, more than usual, but not like an evil person. He should be a bit worried, maybe. But remember for example how excited he was when Kaio told him about Freezer. It's not new and it's certainly not a villain.

Toppo calls him evil because he bought Bergamo's bullshit speech, as most of the other viewers. But that doesn't make him evil, it's not his fault that Zeno pretends to erase universes, he is just focusing on the fights he will have. I think Toppo may understand Goku's motivations better next chapter.

[Asura]

You say that you could see him concerned about the danger, when exactly did you see that?

I didn't say it well, I meant that I didn't see him as concerned as he should, so we agree on this. Apart from the first reaction that he has when he hears about the rule of erasing universes, the rest of the time he is like ignoring that.

Goku didn't say a damn thing or react at all when Bergamo asked Zeno about calling the tournament off if he won. After Goku won, he basically started shit-talking his opponent, which was incredibly odd and something Goku has never done. When all the universes started getting angry and yelling at Goku for spelling out their doom, Goku didn't seem particularly worried at all, and was literally like "Fuck all of you, BRING IT ON! BRING IT ON!"

The point is Goku doesn't even try to make himself NOT look like the villain. He straight up doesn't give a shit, and doesn't even deny it when Toppo calls him evil. At no point do you ever see Goku surprised, shocked, worried, anything when news about the universes are being erased. He had a dumb look on his face in episode 78 when the Grand Priest was telling everyone, but that was about it. He makes no effort to try and dispel the narrative of him being evil/a villain, and it's all very odd and out-of-character, although I believe it's being done on purpose.

The grand priest said that Zeno would erase all universes if Goku didn't go in full strenght, so he didn't have other choice. What did Goku have to say?

Bergamo tells him that the fighters of the rest universes will go against him, then is when he says, ok, come to me with the strongest guys you find, I'll fight and win. He is not insulting anyone, he is being proud, more than usual, but not like an evil person. He should be a bit worried, maybe. But remember for example how excited he was when Kaio told him about Freezer. It's not new and it's certainly not a villain.

Toppo calls him evil because he bought Bergamo's bullshit speech, as most of the other viewers. But that doesn't make him evil, it's not his fault that Zeno pretends to erase universes, he is just focusing on the fights he will have. I think Toppo may understand Goku's motivations better next chapter.

These people are fighting for their lives. Toppo, Bergamo, all of them. Goku has doomed their universes and shows no sympathy, compassion, guilt, anything. (This was all before Goku even knew that the universes would be erased anyway)

In regards to Goku not having a choice, this is true. Take note though that he has literally zero contemplation about this, and doesn't care at all.

It's not so much Goku's actions, but rather his personality that is making him seem villainous. He's shown time and time again that he doesn't care at all about innocent people in other universes being "potentially" erased, and makes no effort to try and convince people he's not actually evil, and just wants a good fight. Like I said before, Goku doesn't even deny it when Toppo calls him evil.

The writers are very, very obviously, and very, very intentionally twisting Goku's character to make him appear villainous. I don't understand how people still aren't understanding that after the recent episode and are still chalking it up to "That's Goku! That's just how he's always been!". What they're doing couldn't be more obvious (although the question as to why still remains), and to try and defend Goku's reactions (or lack thereof) as being "not villainous" goes completely against what the writers are (again, very obviously) interjecting into the story.

[Basako]

These people are fighting for their lives. Toppo, Bergamo, all of them. Goku has doomed their universes and shows no sympathy, compassion, guilt, anything. (This was all before Goku even knew that the universes would be erased anyway)

In regards to Goku not having a choice, this is true. Take note though that he has literally zero contemplation about this, and doesn't care at all.

It's not so much Goku's actions, but rather his personality that is making him seem villainous. He's shown time and time again that he doesn't care at all about innocent people in other universes being "potentially" erased, and makes no effort to try and convince people he's not actually evil, and just wants a good fight. Like I said before, Goku doesn't even deny it when Toppo calls him evil.

The writers are very, very obviously, and very, very intentionally twisting Goku's character to make him appear villainous. I don't understand how people still aren't understanding that after the recent episode and are still chalking it up to "That's Goku! That's just how he's always been!". What they're doing couldn't be more obvious (although the question as to why still remains), and to try and defend Goku's reactions (or lack thereof) as being "not villainous" goes completely against what the writers are (again, very obviously) interjecting into the story.

Goku is fighting for his life and universe too and hasn't doomed anyone, even Bergamo knows that, he is just manipulating consciously to put everyone against Goku and he gets it. Sidra notices this, as well as Beerus and Whis. Obviously, everyone wanted Bergamo to win, as Zeno agreed to forgive all universes, but Goku couldn't hold back. By the way, what about Whis saying that it was a bad idea to tell Zeno to quit the rule? It didn't took him that much to consider it when Bergamo suggested it. Well, that's just a thought beside.

Goku is not happy about the universes being erased but he will fight, first, because he has no other choice, as the rest, second, because he loves fighting. But, what does he have to do? Cry about the situation? Be more serious?

The writters have pushed his pride and eager for fight a bit, so, along with Bergamo's words, the rest of the gods and Toppo make Goku his target. But, that's still not evil, at least for the people who know him from before. Should Gohan and the others consider him villanous or evil? No way, they know him. Gohan even smiles when Goku asks for the strongest fighters.

And, yes, Goku has always been excited about fighting strong opponents. That's not being evil.

[TheMikado]

I 100% agree that those traits are not that well handled, but if they didn't turn them up a little, you couldn't make a story about them. It's a story that brings Goku's poison front and center, everybody is seeing it and it's fucking everybody over. Of course it seems to overshadow him. It's the first time it's actually trying to be addessed. It should culminate in Goku getting some development, hopefully. This whole Goku is evil thing couldn't happen if you didn't have at least some build up in the earlier arcs, so to say that the writers just up and decided to write Goku like this out of nowhere is just stupid. However, that also doesn't mean they're doing a great job. But there's a middle between saying that Goku's main traits are nonsense and that they aren't well represented.

But how does overexaggerating a character's faults to ridiculous levels out of nowhere make for good writing? There hasn't even been an explanation for it (yet). To overexaggerate and twist Goku's character simply to make it a sub-plot where people are angry at Goku for something that isn't even usually his character, is some really awful and nonsensical writing.

To me it would be like Vegeta doing all that evil shit during the Buu saga without turning Majin. It just wouldn't make any sense. You could say "But Vegeta used to be evil! This was always his character!" or "But Vegeta still wasn't that great of a guy back then!" but would you be able to defend normal Vegeta (not Majin) killing all those people at the tournament? Would that really be good writing to turn Vegeta's evilness up to 120% out of literally nowhere without any excuse (like Majin)?

I think what he means is they're obviously making a story about Goku being the villain/evil and it wont work if they show how Goku would normally respond to those situations, Toei/Toriyama's trying to pull a fast one on us, like "yeah you know, Goku? the main character? well he's the antagonist in this arc now, but.... wait for it... wait for the twist." I mean its really obvious, Goku's main rivals are a team of justice heroes The Justice League of U11, so Goku's supposed to be the bad guy.
I think its IC if Goku tries to piss them to get a better fight, I mean he did that with Oob (poor trashtalking tho) but we know Goku's willing to have people hate him just to get a good fight out of it, and he's doing a really amazing job making people hate him, since not just characters but also people in the fanbase are starting to hate him.

What Asura is saying is that as it stands there is no plot mechanism for Goku to be exaggerating these traits to this degree.
Vegeta's had his evil tendencies exaggerated in the Buu arc, however the plot mechanism was VERY clear. Majin Vegeta.
Goku is essentially having his character traits uncharacteristically exaggerated. My personal belief is that this is by the scripts design and they will say God ki has driven Goku power drunk and strip it from him at the end of the arc... Why the effect isn't so prominent of Vegeta would be poor writing however... But anyway, whether they are doing it on purpose or not out of universe has no barring on why Goku is now suddenly displaying these traits to a level he has never done before. That's what we are waiting for. Will it be explained? Maybe, but so far Super has really failed in provided context and connecting the dots with exposition in previous arcs. I'm not anticipating them doing so in this arc either.

[Asura]

Goku is not happy about the universes being erased but he will fight, first, because he has no other choice, as the rest, second, because he loves fighting. But, what does he have to do? Cry about the situation? Be more serious?

Where are you getting the "Goku is not happy about the universes being erased" from? We saw over and over last episode how much Goku does not give a fuck about the other universes. We saw it before he even knew Zeno was going to erase the universes anyway.

Goku doesn't have to cry about the situation, I dunno who even suggested that. The fact that he has literally zero reaction though to Bergamo asking Zeno to spare the universes if he wins is just incredibly odd for Goku. Actually, he doesn't have zero reaction. He literally says, and I quote "I don't care". I DON'T CARE. This was before Zeno even decided to let Bergamo's proposition through. I really don't understand how you can defend Goku not caring about this many innocent lives while saying that it's just good ol' Goku, the one we all knew and loved.

Goku is actively telling the other universes he doesn't give a fuck what happens to them and their trillions of innocent lives and just wants to fight people. That is NOT Goku. Goku wants a good fight and he's selfish, but he's not a prick who would sacrifice entire UNIVERSES and then shove it right in their faces just so he could fight people. As far as we know, literally nothing has changed with Goku, so why all of a sudden is he incredibly antagonistic out of seemingly nowhere?

It's not Goku's character, and TOEI isn't trying to do some crazy insane "he was like this all along, you just never noticed!" thing. They're very obviously making Goku this antagonistic for a reason. They're trying to point out that he's a villain at every single turn. The signs are very obvious here. TOEI wouldn't be hyperbolizing the fuck out of Goku's character traits for no reason (at least, not a character trait that could wind up to trillions of people dying. his absolute retardation in the Future Trunks arc though? Ugh).

[SansrivaaL]

But how does overexaggerating a character's faults to ridiculous levels out of nowhere make for good writing? There hasn't even been an explanation for it (yet). To overexaggerate and twist Goku's character simply to make it a sub-plot where people are angry at Goku for something that isn't even usually his character, is some really awful and nonsensical writing.

To me it would be like Vegeta doing all that evil shit during the Buu saga without turning Majin. It just wouldn't make any sense. You could say "But Vegeta used to be evil! This was always his character!" or "But Vegeta still wasn't that great of a guy back then!" but would you be able to defend normal Vegeta (not Majin) killing all those people at the tournament? Would that really be good writing to turn Vegeta's evilness up to 120% out of literally nowhere without any excuse (like Majin)?

I think what he means is they're obviously making a story about Goku being the villain/evil and it wont work if they show how Goku would normally respond to those situations, Toei/Toriyama's trying to pull a fast one on us, like "yeah you know, Goku? the main character? well he's the antagonist in this arc now, but.... wait for it... wait for the twist." I mean its really obvious, Goku's main rivals are a team of justice heroes The Justice League of U11, so Goku's supposed to be the bad guy.
I think its IC if Goku tries to piss them to get a better fight, I mean he did that with Oob (poor trashtalking tho) but we know Goku's willing to have people hate him just to get a good fight out of it, and he's doing a really amazing job making people hate him, since not just characters but also people in the fanbase are starting to hate him.

What Asura is saying is that as it stands there is no plot mechanism for Goku to be exaggerating these traits to this degree.
Vegeta's had his evil tendencies exaggerated in the Buu arc, however the plot mechanism was VERY clear. Majin Vegeta.
Goku is essentially having his character traits uncharacteristically exaggerated. My personal belief is that this is by the scripts design and they will say God ki has driven Goku power drunk and strip it from him at the end of the arc... Why the effect isn't so prominent of Vegeta would be poor writing however... But anyway, whether they are doing it on purpose or not out of universe has no barring on why Goku is now suddenly displaying these traits to a level he has never done before. That's what we are waiting for. Will it be explained? Maybe, but so far Super has really failed in provided context and connecting the dots with exposition in previous arcs. I'm not anticipating them doing so in this arc either.

Sadly thats the way Toei wanted to do, by exaggerating those traits of Goku, because they want him to be the antagonist this arc (at least until the real one arrives or this is all a scam)
The plot mechanism here is Goku wanting a good fight, how does he get that? by pissing them off, how does he do that the Goku way? by acting cocky and smug with not a care in the world if anyone dies. Toei's deliberately making Goku look like the bad guy, so ofc they wont show any remorse on Goku's side, unless they go the character development route, then all of what I'm saying will be thrown down the drain. All I'm sure about, is that there will be a twist regarding Goku's behaviour.
Never say never my friend, they're putting Goku (the main character) in such a bad state, there is no way they'll let it end like that, even for a kids show and someone with no knowledge about Goku, no writter would do that to a main shonen character.

That God ki corrupting him theory of yours doesnt exactly work since the opposite is happening to Vegeta, he's becoming too soft when it comes to family matters. So what will happen is Goku having his God ki removed while Vegeta's doesnt? that is just bad they trained hard to achieve that form only to have it removed? I would hate that seriously.

[Basako]

Goku is not happy about the universes being erased but he will fight, first, because he has no other choice, as the rest, second, because he loves fighting. But, what does he have to do? Cry about the situation? Be more serious?

Where are you getting the "Goku is not happy about the universes being erased" from? We saw over and over last episode how much Goku does not give a fuck about the other universes. We saw it before he even knew Zeno was going to erase the universes anyway.

From his first reaction, him asking Whis to tell Zeno to take the rule out and that I know the character from before, I don't even consider that he is happy about universes being erased, why do you? It's not like Zeno is the typical villain, he isn't, they can't fight him and he sets the rules. So the only thing he can do in this situation is fight, which he likes as he always has. What else do you want him to do?

Goku doesn't have to cry about the situation, I dunno who even suggested that. The fact that he has literally zero reaction though to Bergamo asking Zeno to spare the universes if he wins is just incredibly odd for Goku. Actually, he doesn't have zero reaction. He literally says, and I quote "I don't care". I DON'T CARE. This was before Zeno even decided to let Bergamo's proposition through. I really don't understand how you can defend Goku not caring about this many innocent lives while saying that it's just good ol' Goku, the one we all knew and loved.

I'm asking what reactions you want him to have. He does react with Bergamo's words about him, he clearly didn't like them and complains. About Bergamo's suggestion to spare the universes. What does he have to say? He can't oppose to that. But the thing is they don't let him to hold back, which is a relieve, because he doesn't like to lose, meaning he would consider holding back if they had let him. He says he doesn't care in respond to Bergamo saying all universes will go against him, because he actually wants to fight strong opponents, no that he doesn't care about the universes being erased. I'm not just defending Goku, I'm saying that he cares, but he accepts that fighting is the only thing he can do now and, as he enjoys that, he goes for it and doesn't hide it.

Goku is actively telling the other universes he doesn't give a fuck what happens to them and their trillions of innocent lives and just wants to fight people. That is NOT Goku. Goku wants a good fight and he's selfish, but he's not a prick who would sacrifice entire UNIVERSES and then shove it right in their faces just so he could fight people. As far as we know, literally nothing has changed with Goku, so why all of a sudden is he incredibly antagonistic out of seemingly nowhere?

Goku is not telling such a thing, bring me the quote him saying he doesn't care about those trillions. Him being excited about fighting doesn't mean he doesn't care. Goku hasn't sacrificed anybody, those are Zeno's rules and he clearly suggested to tell him to take out that rule, but they told him not to do that. If there is somebody to blame is Zeno.

It's not Goku's character, and TOEI isn't trying to do some crazy insane "he was like this all along, you just never noticed!" thing. They're very obviously making Goku this antagonistic for a reason. They're trying to point out that he's a villain at every single turn. The signs are very obvious here. TOEI wouldn't be hyperbolizing the fuck out of Goku's character traits for no reason (at least, not a character trait that could wind up to trillions of people dying. his absolute retardation in the Future Trunks arc though? Ugh).

Goku likes fighting, that's Goku and has always been, even in terrible situations in the past. They pushed his pride and eager to fight a bit and put him on purpose in situations were he looks worse, like Bergamo fighting for the spare of the universes against him, instead of the other way around, to make him the target of the rest of the universes. This doesn't make him evil, neither a villain. I understand that the new characters like Toppo don't know him and may consider that Goku doesn't care, but Gohan and the others clearly don't think that. Because they know him, as viewers like us know him, I don't understand how can you even be considering those things.

[Asura]

I dunno what to really say anymore since I feel like I'm just saying the same thing over and over again. I can see nothing will convince you otherwise that this isn't how Goku normally acts, even with TOEI absolutely lambasting us in the face with it last episode.

I think next episode against Toppo will be very telling, and I don't think the end result will be as simple as Toppo going "Oh wow, this guy's perfectly good after all! Yep. Nothing even slightly off about him."

But again, MasakoX's analysis video of Universal Survival Arc Goku does a great job representing the viewpoint of people who believe Goku isn't himself right now. I highly recommend watching it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EA1ADQFwZb0

[TekTheNinja]

Should Gohan and the others consider him villainous or evil? No way, they know him. Gohan even smiles when Goku asks for the strongest fighters.

I'm just gonna focus on this point since the others don't seem to be. What the hell does them knowing Goku have shit to do with it? The only in-character response for Gohan to make right now is to tell Goku off, and be absolutely furious about it. I could imagine him saying, "Is your stupid fight more important than the life of my daughter Dad?!" or something like that. Does he do that though? Nope. He's like, "lol I'll try my best Dad."

This is NOT Gohan.

[Simere]

Are any characters acting in-character to you?

[DBZAOTA482]

Are any characters acting in-character to you?

Gohan (when they actually choose to do stuff with him), Vegeta, Krillin, Bulma, the kids, #18, Beerus, and Whis all act in-character... but that's pretty much it.

[Lord Beerus]

Are any characters acting in-character to you?

Gohan (when they actually choose to do stuff with him), Vegeta, Krillin, Bulma, the kids, #18, Beerus, and Whis all act in-character... but that's pretty much it.

That's like... the whole major cast.

[mfwlegend3]

Sociopathy is characterized mostly by the individual not being able to feel empathy, Goku has demonstrated, both in the manga and in Super, that he's perfectly capable of doing so. Thus, he's not a sociopath; this isn't hard to get.

Actually, one of the key contrasts between psychopaths and sociopaths is that sociopaths are able to form attachments to a certain person or group of people. The absolute absence of empathy belongs to the psychopath category.

[Lord Frieza]

Psychopath - a person suffering from chronic mental disorder with abnormal or violent social behaviour.

Sociopath - a person with a personality disorder manifesting itself in extreme antisocial attitudes and behaviour.

Goku is nether. Goku is just a very detached person (separate or disconnected) who displays something almost akin to to Aspergers, in that he has some difficulty with social interactions and exhibit a restricted range of interests and/or repetitive behaviors. But even this dose not quantify Goku fully and trying to pin him with human mental conditions will never quite match up as he's an alien and has lived a very unusual life.