Queerness in DB

[Trunksuu]

I guess homosexuality in DBZ and DB was somewhat negative. General Blue is the best example because I guess he's openly gay. There was a section in the manga of the translation where Krillin called him slurs (which I won't repeat) and Bulma noting that he might be gay. (Also I'm sorry the picture is huge.)



Also even in the end of DBZ when Trunks is hit on by that one guy.



I guess the point I'm trying to make is that sometimes gayness in DB is kinda negative, probably considering time periods and if being gay in Japan in the 80s and 90s was looked down upon. I'm not sure, I guess I'd like more clarification.

[GreatSaiyaJeff]

General Blue to me saved the red ribbon army arc, he kept things fresh and exciting. Sure that gag with him turning down Bulma was funny, but I didn't think of it as a joke against gay people, I thought the joke was more around at Bumla who got rejected since it did seem to be more at her expense.

As for the pedophilia, I'm really glad Funimation dubbed that out, sure we got an unresolved plot point of him having a long last brother but hey, better then adding pedophilia as part of a negative gay stereotype.

[cheddarsword]

I find it surprising that it's not more prevalent, but then, most of the sexuality in Dragon Ball is aimed at straight males anyway.

I say that because though there is a female audience for DB, I question how many of them are lesbians. Not saying there aren't lesbian DB fans, but if you were to put the numbers side by side, I'd say straight males would be the larger group Vs. lesbians.

Blue is indeed one of my favorite characters from the Red Ribbon arc.

Also, Blue's line was changed for the US release of the manga? What happened to "NO MAN HAS BOOBS THAT BIG!"? That line was gold! I think it also sells his homosexuality better too.

[Polyphase Avatron]

I find it surprising that it's not more prevalent, but then, most of the sexuality in Dragon Ball is aimed at straight males anyway.

I say that because though there is a female audience for DB, I question how many of them are lesbians. Not saying there aren't lesbian DB fans, but if you were to put the numbers side by side, I'd say straight males would be the larger group Vs. lesbians.

Blue is indeed one of my favorite characters from the Red Ribbon arc.

Also, Blue's line was changed for the US release of the manga? What happened to "NO MAN HAS BOOBS THAT BIG!"? That line was gold! I think it also sells his homosexuality better too.

I know female fans who find the male characters attractive, mostly future Trunks, Vegeta, and adult Gohan.

[Cipher]

I'm shocked this thread wasn't bumped specifically to talk about Kale.

[IAmTheMilkMan]

There was a section in the manga of the translation where Krillin called him slurs (which I won't repeat)

Sorry, but what exactly are you referring to? I just checked my copy of the first Viz graphic novel and couldn't find Krillin saying anything of the sort, nor do I ever remember encountering something like that during my previous read-throughs. Is my translation different? Am I not looking in the right spot? Help me out here.

[ekrolo2]

Wasn't General Blue implied to be a paedophile?

[Cipher]

Wasn't General Blue implied to be a paedophile?

Only in the anime, in one of its worst filler sequences of all time.

[rereboy]

I guess homosexuality in DBZ and DB was somewhat negative. General Blue is the best example because I guess he's openly gay. There was a section in the manga of the translation where Krillin called him slurs (which I won't repeat) and Bulma noting that he might be gay. (Also I'm sorry the picture is huge.)



Also even in the end of DBZ when Trunks is hit on by that one guy.



I guess the point I'm trying to make is that sometimes gayness in DB is kinda negative, probably considering time periods and if being gay in Japan in the 80s and 90s was looked down upon. I'm not sure, I guess I'd like more clarification.

That's just humor.

[cheddarsword]

I find it surprising that it's not more prevalent, but then, most of the sexuality in Dragon Ball is aimed at straight males anyway.

I say that because though there is a female audience for DB, I question how many of them are lesbians. Not saying there aren't lesbian DB fans, but if you were to put the numbers side by side, I'd say straight males would be the larger group Vs. lesbians.

Blue is indeed one of my favorite characters from the Red Ribbon arc.

Also, Blue's line was changed for the US release of the manga? What happened to "NO MAN HAS BOOBS THAT BIG!"? That line was gold! I think it also sells his homosexuality better too.

I know female fans who find the male characters attractive, mostly future Trunks, Vegeta, and adult Gohan.

Yes and that's fine, but can you say that women are were in Dragon Ball's original target audience? I mean the series ended in the mid 90's, back when young boys were still a prime audience. The only thing that's changed since those days is how many young girls and women that are into the same things. That number has grown.

Maybe women are a target for Super's audience, but I doubt they were for the original DB/DBZ.

I'm shocked this thread wasn't bumped specifically to talk about Kale.

Truthfully, Kale likely isn't a lesbian. Though I can see why people would think that.

It's rather common for people to look up to someone and to want the best for them. Especially when the person they admire holds a position higher than they do.

[FoolsGil]

Well, like I stated in an earlier page on this resurrected thread, except for the anime only scene in Penguin Village, Dragonball did right by General Blue. One of the more memorable villains, had a huge arc, great fighter, just happened to be gay, and just happened to be camp. Krillin may have had choice words for the guy, but it was during the 80s, when things weren't very tolerant, and then Krillin got his ass handed to him, there had to be some level of vindication from that even if Krillin is the good guy.

I'm shocked this thread wasn't bumped specifically to talk about Kale.

Well, we aren't in the 80s anymore, let alone the 20th century. If Kale does turn out to be lgbt, she'll be handled with a lot more respect.

[Basaku]

That's just stereotypical and exploitive humor.

I fixed that for you. Now excuse me, I have tons of Spanish jokes about Portugal to catch up on.

I'm shocked this thread wasn't bumped specifically to talk about Kale.

Most are waiting to see how it develops, whether it's actually lesbian romantic interest or just some master-student jealousy of attention

[Dbzfan94]

or just some master-student jealousy of attention

I think that's what it might be, but who knows.

[ABED]

I fixed that for you. Now excuse me, I have tons of Spanish jokes about Portugal to catch up on.

That doesn't prevent it from being funny.

[Dbzfan94]

I fixed that for you. Now excuse me, I have tons of Spanish jokes about Portugal to catch up on.

That doesn't prevent it from being funny.

This. Humor is humor. Even if it offends people, it can still be funny. I never liked the PC notion of "offensive in any way = not funny"

[Basaku]

I fixed that for you. Now excuse me, I have tons of Spanish jokes about Portugal to catch up on.

That doesn't prevent it from being funny.

This. Humor is humor. Even if it offends people, it can still be funny. I never liked the PC notion of "offensive in any way = not funny"

Not all humor is equal, that's just an excuse for bad comedians or a cover-up to get a free-pass for prejudice. The hardest and most 'offensive' jokes (well beyond anything in Dragon Ball) will go well with the audience if it knows they don't come from a doubtful place. Watch some standups.

I fixed that for you. Now excuse me, I have tons of Spanish jokes about Portugal to catch up on.

That doesn't prevent it from being funny.

I prefer genuinely funny, thanks. Like you know, a dumb Roshi-chasing-girls joke in the middle of story involving Bulma as a full-fledged character.

[ABED]

I prefer genuinely funny, thanks. Like you know, a dumb Roshi-chasing-girls joke in the middle of story involving Bulma as a full-fledged character.

If someone laughs, it's genuinely funny, and sometimes stereotypes can be used for great comedic effect. Chichi is often the stereotypical tiger mom. I don't think it's funny, but I'm sure many do.

Not all humor is equal

Sure. Some jokes are worth a smile, some jokes are worth a chuckle, and some jokes are gut busting, tear inducing, laugh out loud funny. But I think you mean that some jokes are objectively lesser than others.

[Basaku]

If someone laughs, it's genuinely funny, and sometimes stereotypes can be used for great comedic effect. Chichi is often the stereotypical tiger mom. I don't think it's funny, but I'm sure many do.

Keyword sometimes, keyword not all the time. Women in DB do not appear or are involved exclusively as the punchlines, that's the difference. I've just said it in the post you quoted and posts before concerning similar discussions you were also taking part in.

[rereboy]

That's just stereotypical and exploitive humor.

I fixed that for you. Now excuse me, I have tons of Spanish jokes about Portugal to catch up on.

You might want to read my post in the second page of this topic, where I stated: "I think queerness is basically irrelevant in Dragon Ball. It's only rarely present as stereotypical humor, like other kinds of stereotypical humor are also present (for example, Roshi's perverted ways)."

Apparently, you seem to think that I would be upset about stereotypical humor when it's about my country but you couldn't be more mistaken about that.

You see, I understand that humor is basically ALWAYS made by making fun of something serious. For example, when I watch "Home Alone", I see someone getting hit in the head by a brick thrown from the 5th floor. Isn't that a serious situation/issue that would probably kill the dude and constitutes attempted murder? Of course it is. Does that mean that it's not humor? Of course it's humor. Other serious issues like nationality and sexual inclination and behavior are no different. Humor, as long as its really humor and not some sort of twisted propaganda, can and should be about any subject.

[Basaku]

You might want to read my post in the second page of this topic, where I stated: "I think queerness is basically irrelevant in Dragon Ball. It's only rarely present as stereotypical humor, like other kinds of stereotypical humor are also present (for example, Roshi's perverted ways)."

Are Roshi's perverted ways portrayed in DB in a vacuum? Nope. They are included next to 'vanilla' displays of (heterosexual) interest, pairings etc. Now, do the gay jokes in DB have a 'vanilla' counterpart?

Humor, as long as its really humor and not some sort of twisted propaganda, can and should be about any subject.

Well said. Now, if Spain references Portugal exclusively as a joke (while having both jokes AND legitimate, serious references about France for example) is that equal-oppurtunity honest real humor or something a bit less sincere?