Endgame of the 'Universe Survival' arc..?

[Galan007]

Curious what you guys think the endgame of the ToP/Universe Survival arc might be..? Here are a few possibilities I could think of...


a.) Zen-Oh deletes all of the losing universes/characters, no questions asked. One universe remains in DB-continuity..?

b.) The surviving universe uses the Super Dragon Balls to resurrect all of the universes erased by Zen-Oh behind his back(not likely as that'd probably piss him off, and he'd just erase everything out of spite)..?

c.) Zen-Oh allows the survivors to use the SDBs to 'amalgamate' the multiverse -- essentially streamline continuity by resurrecting all of the 'good' and/or 'noteworthy' characters, and have them all reside within ONE universe(basically what DC comics did in back in 'Crisis on Infinite Earths')..?

d.) Zen-Oh decides not to destroy anything, because an intact multiverse is just too much damn fun..?


I only ask because I believe that the whole multiverse concept, and all the new characters gleaned since its reveal, seems like WAY too much of a cash-cow for Toriyama to just throw away -- the storytelling potential there is HUGE.

Moreover, I think making it a point to note that there are only 28 inhabited mortal planets in Universe 7(which was also stated to contain 'countless' galaxies) might have been a possible set up for the 'amalgamation' option... As it seems like there is MORE than enough room for the 'good' and/or 'noteworthy' characters from all the other [nullified] universes to reside in w/o having to worry about continuity feeling claustrophobic.

...Though if the merger of continuity is indeed the path Toriyama decides to take, I wonder what would happen to all the GoDs, Angels, and Kaioshin from the other universes? Will they *stay* erased, leaving Beerus/Whis/Shin as the last remaining 'Gods' in existence, or will they be resurrected as well, and reorganize cosmology to accommodate them? For example: divide the remaining universe into 12 'quadrants', with each quadrant having it's own designated GoD/Angel/Kaioshin..?


Just curious what your thoughts are.

[Lord Beerus]

I'm expecting a Universe 7 to win, the erased universes to be brought back to the life and merged with Universe 7, and Freeza, somehow and someway being brought back to life permanently.

[TheMikado]

Curious what you guys think the endgame of the ToP/Universe Survival arc might be..? Here are a few possibilities I could think of...


a.) Zen-Oh deletes all of the losing universes/characters, no questions asked. One universe remains in DB-continuity..?

b.) The surviving universe uses the Super Dragon Balls to resurrect all of the universes erased by Zen-Oh behind his back(not likely as that'd probably piss him off, and he'd just erase everything out of spite)..?

c.) Zen-Oh allows the survivors to use the SDBs to 'amalgamate' the multiverse -- essentially streamline continuity by resurrecting all of the 'good' and/or 'noteworthy' characters, and have them all reside within ONE universe(basically what DC comics did in back in 'Crisis on Infinite Earths')..?

d.) Zen-Oh decides not to destroy anything, because an intact multiverse is just too much damn fun..?


I only ask because I believe that the whole multiverse concept, and all the new characters gleaned since its reveal, seems like WAY too much of a cash-cow for Toriyama to just throw away -- the storytelling potential there is HUGE.

Moreover, I think making it a point to note that there are only 28 inhabited mortal planets in Universe 7(which was also stated to contain 'countless' galaxies) might have been a possible set up for the 'amalgamation' option... As it seems like there is MORE than enough room for the 'good' and/or 'noteworthy' characters from all the other [nullified] universes to reside in w/o having to worry about continuity feeling claustrophobic.

...Though if the merger of continuity is indeed the path Toriyama decides to take, I wonder what would happen to all the GoDs, Angels, and Kaioshin from the other universes? Will they *stay* erased, leaving Beerus/Whis/Shin as the last remaining 'Gods' in existence, or will they be resurrected as well, and reorganize cosmology to accommodate them? For example: divide the remaining universe into 12 'quadrants', with each quadrant having it's own designated GoD/Angel/Kaioshin..?


Just curious what your thoughts are.

I’ve said it multiple times but here goes again for those who missed it.. the Super Dragonballs are used to wish Goku and Beerus never met. Thereby undoing everything that happens in Super and still allowing for every single character to exist while also restoring Trunks timeline.

[Hellspawn28]

I don't see a reset wish happening because it would make everything pointless. They also hinted a trip to Planet Sadala, so I do think U6 and probably U11 will be wish back too. Goku will make a deal to wish back two Universes if they can keep a good mortal level ranking.

[BlueBasilisk]

What I'd like: the inhabitants of the other Universes are brought over to Universe 7 to revitalize it and bring up the mortal level. Still won't be at 7.whatever but it should be better than now and easier to reach that mark.

Some character development for Zeno so he's not so reckless and fickle and shows some consideration for the mortals in the universes he oversees. Maybe some parallel development for Goku since he and Zeno are similar in that they are innocently dangerous to so many people.

Reflection on the relationships between the gods and mortals and how the gods being so shitty at their jobs has disastrous effects on the lives of mortals.

What I expect based on the arc so far: the whole thing is just an excuse for an extended wanking of Universe 7 and Goku in particular at the expense of 7 other universes and any negative implications of the arc will be swept under the rug at the end of the arc with no lasting impact on any of the characters. "Trillions of people died but it's Bulla's birthday party! Yay, happy ending!" Also Frieza will be the final villain for an episode or two but it won't amount to anything and he'll go back to hell emptyhanded.

[Galan007]

I’ve said it multiple times but here goes again for those who missed it.. the Super Dragonballs are used to wish Goku and Beerus never met. Thereby undoing everything that happens in Super and still allowing for every single character to exist while also restoring Trunks timeline.

Wouldn't that allow Zamasu & Black to commit their universal genocide/domination completely unopposed, though? Because I think that was going to happen regardless of Goku and Beerus meeting one another.

And tbh, if Goku and Vegeta hadn't known Beerus, and/or achieved God-levels of power, an encounter with Zamasu & Black probably wouldn't have gone nearly as well for them...

[Lionel]

I'm part of the group of fans who subscribes to the theory of either the universes all coalescing together in U7 or the inhabitants being revived in tow with their planets to contribute to the numbers of worlds in U7. If the other four universes were willing to oblige then U7 would only have to take 1 or 2 universes on for themselves. Regardless of the outcome, I very much hope that everything isn't simply undone by the end of the tournament. Toyotaro made a point of relaying how the character of Zeno felt about the convolution of having so many universes. Keep him tethered to that belief. The omni-king can still receive development to his personality in some other variety as has already been suggested.

[TheMikado]

I’ve said it multiple times but here goes again for those who missed it.. the Super Dragonballs are used to wish Goku and Beerus never met. Thereby undoing everything that happens in Super and still allowing for every single character to exist while also restoring Trunks timeline.

Wouldn't that allow Zamasu & Black to commit their universal genocide/domination completely unopposed, though? Because I think that was going to happen regardless of Goku and Beerus meeting one another.

And tbh, if Goku and Vegeta hadn't known Beerus, and/or achieved God-levels of power, an encounter with Zamasu & Black probably wouldn't have gone nearly as well for them...

No, ironically from a story perspective we know what events do and don’t happen naturally in Super. For instance Trunks comes from 20 years in the future where his Zamasu isn’t corrupted until Black comes from Gokus timeline into his. We also know the ToP didn’t take place in Trunks timeline, but we do know Buu happened or at least part of it did. Further we know Beerus never comes looking for Goku or Trunks on Earth because I still exists.

Remember the only reason black exists in both versions is due to Zamasu having seen Goku on Godtube. Both the manga and the anime take different approaches so it’s clear Toriyama didn’t care too much about the origin story beyond Zamasu seeing Goku use SSB in the Tournament via God tube.

[Polyphase Avatron]

Wishing to undo the events of the entire series would be the biggest copout ever.

[MR.Mark]

I think universe 7 is going to win. However for all we know Zeno may decide that it's easier to upgrade Universe 7 to house the fallen inhabitants of others erased universes, making the U7 earth 10 times bigger. This would open up new mysterys and strong guys to discover on U7 Earth alone, let alone around the universe. Ofcousre there's still the universes that didn't have to fight in the TOP so who knows what the end result will be. One of the best aspects of the TOP arc is you really can't predict what will happen in the end.

[TobyS]

Hmm I was thinking about the merger being probable.

I realised there's no reason the merger has to be as a result of the super DBs maybe Zeno just has the power to do that outright.

That frees up the super DBs to be used for something else, like Freezas revival.

[Majin Jator]

Remember that an episode about Trunks and Goten protecting the island is in the making (they would't have bothered showing the poachers otherwise). Unless such episode is broadcasted as a break of the tournament (an unpopular decision, I might venture) the end of the tournament can't be anything drastic, like Freeza having his way (unless that is resolved quickly in-universe), or TheMikado theory (that can still happen later down the road).

[TheMikado]

Remember that an episode about Trunks and Goten protecting the island is in the making (they would't have bothered showing the poachers otherwise). Unless such episode is broadcasted as a break of the tournament (an unpopular decision, I might venture) the end of the tournament can't be anything drastic, like Freeza having his way (unless that is resolved quickly in-universe), or TheMikado theory (that can still happen later down the road).

Yeah I also think there could be a scenario where the "reset" is wished for but its for a time in the future like a year or something. So they could essentially do anything they wanted in that time period and it wouldn't matter.

[BlueBasilisk]

What if they asked Super Shenron to raise the mortal level of the Universes to an acceptable level or higher? I don't think they'd actually do that in the story but it might be interesting to see how that wish would play out.

[coola]

While reset everything seem possible, wouldnt that make Super meaningless? Kinda what Sonic 06 is to Sonic franchise? Althrough Sonic timeline is complete mess anyway, why Silver is still there? What about Moon?

[Majin Jator]

While reset everything seem possible, wouldnt that make Super meaningless? Kinda what Sonic 06 is to Sonic franchise? Althrough Sonic timeline is complete mess anyway, why Silver is still there? What about Moon?

For Toei is the easiest (laziest) way to "fit" Super into continuity, and leave themselves room for a new series in the future with new, marketable Goku transformations; without adding more over the top power tiers (same way SSB and SS4 coexist in videogames right now).

I hate the Story Reset trope myself, but I definitely can see that happening.

[Hellspawn28]

Doing a reset ending won't work since U7 is still around the end of DBZ. If Beerus never meet Goku then Goku would never be friends with Zeno and never came up with the idea of a Tournament. U7 would end up being erase along with the other lower rank Universes if it was not for Goku because Zeno wanted to get rid of the other lower Universes for a while now.

[TheMikado]

Doing a reset ending won't work since U7 is still around the end of DBZ. If Beerus never meet Goku then Goku would never be friends with Zeno and never came up with the idea of a Tournament. U7 would end up being erase along with the other lower rank Universes if it was not for Goku because Zeno wanted to get rid of the other lower Universes for a while now.

We have confirmation that Zeno didn’t erase the universes because Trunks Future still exists unless you want to make the case that Trunks won the ToP all by himself and never mentioned it. Basically Super and it’s story confirms that in timelines where there are not two Zenos the ToP and ubiverse erasures do not occur anytime soon.

[sintzu]

I think a reset can happen to bring everything down again as the bigger things get the harder it gets to come up with new content. However, It's clear from a financial point that Super isn't anywhere near being over so if a rest is on their plans it won't be for a very long time.

[Whatever]

No, ironically from a story perspective we know what events do and don’t happen naturally in Super. For instance Trunks comes from 20 years in the future where his Zamasu isn’t corrupted until Black comes from Gokus timeline into his. We also know the ToP didn’t take place in Trunks timeline, but we do know Buu happened or at least part of it did. Further we know Beerus never comes looking for Goku or Trunks on Earth because I still exists.

Remember the only reason black exists in both versions is due to Zamasu having seen Goku on Godtube. Both the manga and the anime take different approaches so it’s clear Toriyama didn’t care too much about the origin story beyond Zamasu seeing Goku use SSB in the Tournament via God tube.

It won't happen,Golden Freeza would still happen regardless if Goku meets Beerus or not,unless you say they are gonna reset everything and then let things end when Freeza comes and murders everyone with ease.

I think a reset can happen to bring everything down again as the bigger things get the harder it gets to come up with new content. However, It's clear from a financial point that Super isn't anywhere near being over so if a rest is on their plans it won't be for a very long time.

By that logic they should wish Goku never met Raditz since thats when things started getting way too big,not like they cannot find ways for things to bring bigger things like they did after Freeza.