Super Saiyan and Ultra Instinct combined?! (spoilers)

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superfan2024
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Re: Super Saiyan and Ultra Instinct combined?! (spoilers)

Post by superfan2024 » Sun Dec 08, 2019 1:13 pm

I really hope UI doesn't interfere with any type or form of Super Saiyan at all. UI is good as it is at least imo.

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Re: Super Saiyan and Ultra Instinct combined?! (spoilers)

Post by Hulk10 » Sun Dec 08, 2019 1:34 pm

HeroR wrote:
Sun Dec 08, 2019 4:20 am
Hulk10 wrote:
Fri Dec 06, 2019 5:31 pm
Mister_Popo wrote:
Mon Nov 18, 2019 2:53 pm
I agree Goku was a lot more in control of the form after the Cell Tournament training, but in order to go full power there still seems to be some emotion involved. Remember SSB Goku vs Black and Zamasu. He was alredy in the form, but he powered up further considerably evoked by the emotion of severe rage and loss. This while SSB has a mastered SSJ1-component as well
Didn't Old Kai say that as a Super Saiyan rage enters his heart so he isn't completely pure in that form?
Old Kai never said that.

The idea that Super Saiyan makes you less pure hearted actually came from Toei: first in a guide book, then Move 7 with Android 13, and finally into Super with Goku making the Spirit Bomb against Jiren. Nothing like this is ever stated in the manga, although it's implied that Goku isn't completely pure going Super Saiyan the first time since he wanted to brutalized Freeza. But even that is hard to say since Goku was still considered pure when he went on his murderous rampage against King Piccolo and his children.

That said, Cabba said rage is only needed the first time and you transform more naturally afterwards (yes, back tingling), which is how Cali skipped the anger part.
Yes I remember that Caulifla skipped the anger part.
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Re: Super Saiyan and Ultra Instinct combined?! (spoilers)

Post by ankokudaishogun » Sun Dec 08, 2019 2:13 pm

I wonder if Caulifla would be fully pure without malice in her heart even as Super Saiyan given she never transformed with Rage.

...then again she went and HELD HANDS IN PUBLIC with Kale, so, no, she's not even remotely pure.

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Re: Super Saiyan and Ultra Instinct combined?! (spoilers)

Post by Hulk10 » Sun Dec 08, 2019 2:18 pm

ankokudaishogun wrote:
Sun Dec 08, 2019 2:13 pm
I wonder if Caulifla would be fully pure without malice in her heart even as Super Saiyan given she never transformed with Rage.

...then again she went and HELD HANDS IN PUBLIC with Kale, so, no, she's not even remotely pure.
That doesn't make you impure.........
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Re: Super Saiyan and Ultra Instinct combined?! (spoilers)

Post by Saturnine » Wed Dec 11, 2019 2:59 am

Rage isn't really present at all times (nor does it need to) while someone's transformed to SSj, it is only the trigger for the initial transformation. It was specifically stated by Goku that normally being transformed to SSj feels uneasy and restless, but this feeling can be eliminated by training and conditioning.

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Re: Super Saiyan and Ultra Instinct combined?! (spoilers)

Post by Hulk10 » Thu Dec 12, 2019 11:19 pm

To eliminate excess stress you have to practice until it comes naturally to you.
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Re: Super Saiyan and Ultra Instinct combined?! (spoilers)

Post by GodVegetto91 » Fri Dec 13, 2019 3:31 am

superfan2024 wrote:
Sun Dec 08, 2019 1:13 pm
I really hope UI doesn't interfere with any type or form of Super Saiyan at all. UI is good as it is at least imo.
This! I don’t see how people always feel the need to make things more messy and complicated. MUI is perfect as it is on it’s own. They can have Goku and Vegeta use it for the rest of their lives and simply increase their battle power the natural way.
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superfan2024
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Re: Super Saiyan and Ultra Instinct combined?! (spoilers)

Post by superfan2024 » Fri Dec 13, 2019 5:18 pm

GodVegetto91 wrote:
Fri Dec 13, 2019 3:31 am
superfan2024 wrote:
Sun Dec 08, 2019 1:13 pm
I really hope UI doesn't interfere with any type or form of Super Saiyan at all. UI is good as it is at least imo.
This! I don’t see how people always feel the need to make things more messy and complicated. MUI is perfect as it is on it’s own. They can have Goku and Vegeta use it for the rest of their lives and simply increase their battle power the natural way.
It's just weird how people in the fandom are always complaining about there being too many Super Saiyan forms, colors, and whatnot, while still wanting UI to be Super Saiyan related lol

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Re: Super Saiyan and Ultra Instinct combined?! (spoilers)

Post by GodVegetto91 » Sat Dec 14, 2019 2:36 am

superfan2024 wrote:
Fri Dec 13, 2019 5:18 pm
GodVegetto91 wrote:
Fri Dec 13, 2019 3:31 am
superfan2024 wrote:
Sun Dec 08, 2019 1:13 pm
I really hope UI doesn't interfere with any type or form of Super Saiyan at all. UI is good as it is at least imo.
This! I don’t see how people always feel the need to make things more messy and complicated. MUI is perfect as it is on it’s own. They can have Goku and Vegeta use it for the rest of their lives and simply increase their battle power the natural way.
It's just weird how people in the fandom are always complaining about there being too many Super Saiyan forms, colors, and whatnot, while still wanting UI to be Super Saiyan related lol
Now this is a perfect comment that points out the absurdity in the fandom! Thanks.
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Re: Super Saiyan and Ultra Instinct combined?! (spoilers)

Post by Mister_Popo » Sat Dec 14, 2019 5:01 am

GodVegetto91 wrote:
Fri Dec 13, 2019 3:31 am
superfan2024 wrote:
Sun Dec 08, 2019 1:13 pm
I really hope UI doesn't interfere with any type or form of Super Saiyan at all. UI is good as it is at least imo.
This! I don’t see how people always feel the need to make things more messy and complicated. MUI is perfect as it is on it’s own. They can have Goku and Vegeta use it for the rest of their lives and simply increase their battle power the natural way.

Ultra Instinct would be very fitting to be Gokus ultimate form, more than any form he has ever gotten. I agree.
I highly doubt however it's going to be his final one.
There is too much ground that still has to be covered in the story, and i don't think they are going to do it solely in SSJ Blue / MUI.
It would still make sense the GP / Zenos bodyguards could learn them an extra ability Whis couldn't .
But it would be very 'meh' if it'd be a combination with SSJ;

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Re: Super Saiyan and Ultra Instinct combined?! (spoilers)

Post by emperior » Sat Dec 14, 2019 5:55 pm

Yeah I could see Toriyama coming up with a new power/technique even harder to attain than Ultra Instinct.

But I wished the next step after UI is to make it active all the time, in base form too, while eliminating the need to transform by saying that the strong emotions associated with transformation would negate Ultra Instinct.

Although I don’t think this will happen, because Toriyama always said he comes up with transformation to visually convey an increase of power.
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