DEUteragonist Vegeta served his purpose in fight with Moro, now it is our hero Goku's turn...

[Matches Malone]

We're referring to Z (and Super) as a whole. And the Buu saga still focuses on Gohan enough that I wouldn't consider the Buu saga a deviation from him as the deuteragonist of DBZ.

The main difference between Z and Super is that you can't really say Z just focused on 1 or 2 characters, as certain characters got focused on during different parts of the story. At the start of the Buu arc the focus was on Gohan, then it changed to Vegeta, then to Goten&Trunks, then back to Gohan, then to Vegeta again. This happens in every arc. Super on the other hand is unquestionably the Goku and Vegeta show from start to finish, the spotlight is always on those 2, as they are always to 2 top fighters in each arc. No one ever stayed at the top for long in Z.

[experted_luke]

To get a little bit back on topic here, I have to say, that it's really between Vegeta, Beerus, and Majin Buu beating Moro. Beerus by coming down to Earth and possibly remembering Moro and having a background with him, or just simply seeing him as some stranger threatening the existence of the Universe. Vegeta by healing himself and then defusing Moro, (which, in my opinion, wouldn't make any sense, because if you think like the authors a bit, someone that's fused wouldn't defuse too quickly without getting a bit of work in for a few panels.) or Majin Buu returning with his power intact and then sealing off Moro like he did originally. In my wholehearted opinion I believe that Merus will NOT sacrifice himself, for these three reasons. Whis is supervising Merus, kind of like a big brother. If your little brother was about to run off and do something that is stupid, (not saying that it's stupid, it's just not the angel's place to interfere) you'd stop him. My second reason for thinking that Merus will not sacrifice himself is due to Beerus hinting that he may come down to Earth and do the job himself. It makes more sense for a God of Destruction to destroy what is threatening his very own Universe. Why would he let an Angel do it for him? Another reason is, why have an angel sacrifice himself now, when a God of Destruction is seemingly all you need to finish the job? There could be even worse enemies in the future, and no angel to sacrifice themselves.

[Kagari]

We're referring to Z (and Super) as a whole. And the Buu saga still focuses on Gohan enough that I wouldn't consider the Buu saga a deviation from him as the deuteragonist of DBZ.

The main difference between Z and Super is that you can't really say Z just focused on 1 or 2 characters, as certain characters got focused on during different parts of the story. At the start of the Buu arc the focus was on Gohan, then it changed to Vegeta, then to Goten&Trunks, then back to Gohan, then to Vegeta again. This happens in every arc. Super on the other hand is unquestionably the Goku and Vegeta show from start to finish, the spotlight is always on those 2, as they are always to 2 top fighters in each arc. No one ever stayed at the top for long in Z.

Strength alone doesn't dictate role in the story. In Super, more than just Goku and Vegeta had plenty of focus.

Trunks arc: Trunks was the major character, treated to development and a role where he was pushed to solve his own problems.
Universe Survival arc: Vegeta is benched for a good part of it while Gohan takes over with Goku. Gohan gets his own character arc and important role. Android 17 comes back and gets his role/development. Freeza also had an important role. Characters like Roshi, 18, Kuririn, Piccolo also pulled their own weight. It's also notable that this arc covers nearly half the series. So I don't think it's fair to count them out.

[Dragon Wukong]

Strength alone doesn't dictate role in the story. In Super, more than just Goku and Vegeta had plenty of focus.

Trunks arc: Trunks was the major character, treated to development and a role where he was pushed to solve his own problems.
Universe Survival arc: Vegeta is benched for a good part of it while Gohan takes over with Goku. Gohan gets his own character arc and important role. Android 17 comes back and gets his role/development. Freeza also had an important role. Characters like Roshi, 18, Kuririn, Piccolo also pulled their own weight. It's also notable that this arc covers nearly half the series. So I don't think it's fair to count them out.

You're right, and strength isn't everything. But that's not to downplay the fact that Vegeta is more prominent in Super as a whole than any character not named Goku when we're discussing whether or not a character is a deuteragonist. Trunks' arc gave him a lot of focus as the (hopefully only) return in the story proper for his own arc, but that also gave Vegeta additional focus given his relationship with Trunks as his son.

And the Tournament of Power was basically an excuse to give old fighters who otherwise are generally unable to go up against the villains nowadays some screentime against fodder, bar the additional focus on 17 and Frieza, who again, were effectively making their grand return to the series. Vegeta was still given focus as the challenger to U11's own God of Destruction candidate Toppo, his relationship with U6's Cabba, and still helped Goku challenge him afterward. Even though Vegeta got knocked out before Frieza or 17, that's still, generally speaking, more than everyone who was eliminated before him.

And with the current arc, ultimately yeah, I'd say Vegeta is the deuteragonist of Dragon Ball Super.

[Kagari]

Strength alone doesn't dictate role in the story. In Super, more than just Goku and Vegeta had plenty of focus.

Trunks arc: Trunks was the major character, treated to development and a role where he was pushed to solve his own problems.
Universe Survival arc: Vegeta is benched for a good part of it while Gohan takes over with Goku. Gohan gets his own character arc and important role. Android 17 comes back and gets his role/development. Freeza also had an important role. Characters like Roshi, 18, Kuririn, Piccolo also pulled their own weight. It's also notable that this arc covers nearly half the series. So I don't think it's fair to count them out.

You're right, and strength isn't everything. But that's not to downplay the fact that Vegeta is more prominent in Super as a whole than any character not named Goku when we're discussing whether or not a character is a deuteragonist. Trunks' arc gave him a lot of focus as the (hopefully only) return in the story proper for his own arc, but that also gave Vegeta additional focus given his relationship with Trunks as his son.

And the Tournament of Power was basically an excuse to give old fighters who otherwise are generally unable to go up against the villains nowadays some screentime against fodder, bar the additional focus on 17 and Frieza, who again, were effectively making their grand return to the series. Vegeta was still given focus as the challenger to U11's own God of Destruction candidate Toppo, his relationship with U6's Cabba, and still helped Goku challenge him afterward. Even though Vegeta got knocked out before Frieza or 17, that's still, generally speaking, more than everyone who was eliminated before him.

And with the current arc, ultimately yeah, I'd say Vegeta is the deuteragonist of Dragon Ball Super.

Screen time doesn't always equate to relevancy in the story though. The Trunks arc is still more about Trunks and how he wanted to make Vegeta proud. The US arc put Vegeta on the backburner for the most part until the final segment with U11. He skips the entire exhibition and recruitment and when they do put focus on him, it comes at the cost of waiting for Goku vs Jiren to resume. Sure he defeated Toppo, but it randomly sidelines 17 and Freeza's fight with him to make it happen. It was so nonsensical, I struggle to see how it's being used to further this supposed pragmatism he has. Same with the Cabba thing, which is vapid as it is boring and unimportant to the main plot. Vegeta, is at most, Goku's sidekick and even then that works on a per arc basis.

[Dragon Wukong]

Vegeta, is at most, Goku's sidekick

What do you think deuteragonist means?

We're not talking about an arc-by-arc basis (though, the statement is still generally true that he's the main supporting role until the ToP, since even when the role of protagonist arguably shifts to Trunks in his arc, Vegeta remains the main support for Trunks, rather than that role shifting to Goku.) Generally throughout Super, Vegeta has been the main supporting role to Goku. Even when other characters have had focus put on them in an arc, Vegeta's pretty much always by Goku's side in Super. The only reason Goku even had enough energy to fight Jiren in the ToP was because Vegeta gave him the last of his energy before he was knocked out. Whether or not you consider that role or focus on him good (like with Cabba) is irrelevant to the definition.

It's an objectively true statement to say that Vegeta is the second-most important character in Dragon Ball Super due to his generally constant presence in every arc and major battle. Narratively speaking there's no other character who fits the role of deuteragonist besides Vegeta. If you disagree, I challenge you to name a counter-example that applies to the entirety of Super.

[The Undying]

I don't know how anyone can sincerely claim Vegeta isn't the deuteragonist in Super when just about every arc, including Trunks' arc, firmly establishes him in that role.

Trunks' role, by the way, wasn't "fixing his own problems". It was learning to have hope even in the most hopeless situations imaginable - the entire point is that he consistently failed to fix his problems right up until the very end of that story arc. The manga illustrates this more succinctly than the anime, but both mediums lay out that theme.

[Matches Malone]

I don't know how anyone can sincerely claim Vegeta isn't the deuteragonist in Super when just about every arc, including Trunks' arc, firmly establishes him in that role.

I can't speak for everyone, but a lot of people who claim this tend to not like Vegeta, so they're in denial about his upgraded role in Super.

[Dragon Wukong]

I can't speak for everyone, but a lot of people who claim this tend to not like Vegeta, so they're in denial about his upgraded role in Super.

It's generally this, yeah.

You'd be surprised how many people are actively hoping that the current arc doesn't end in Vegeta defeating Moro.

[omaro34]

"Last time on the Goku and Vegeta show...."

[Matches Malone]

You'd be surprised how many people are actively hoping that the current arc doesn't end in Vegeta defeating Moro.

This surprises me a lot, as these people are acting like this is DB's last arc and Goku's last chance to shine. Modern DB in nowhere near being finished, so Vegeta getting a win shouldn't be that big of a deal.

[Mad Swami]

You'd be surprised how many people are actively hoping that the current arc doesn't end in Vegeta defeating Moro.

This surprises me a lot, as these people are acting like this is DB's last arc and Goku's last chance to shine. Modern DB in nowhere near being finished, so Vegeta getting a win shouldn't be that big of a deal.

A lot of people think it's the last arc before EoZ not entirely I don't think. But I agree Goku will have many more times to shine.

[Matches Malone]

A lot of people think it's the last arc before EoZ.

Maybe ? I've seen this theory, but I don't know if Toriyama is interested in that time period, at least based on previous comments he's made. I think it's more likely Super will just continue as is after Moro.

[Mad Swami]

A lot of people think it's the last arc before EoZ.

Maybe ? I've seen this theory, but I don't know if Toriyama is interested in that time period, at least based on previous comments he's made. I think it's more likely Super will just continue as is after Moro.

I agree

[Dragon Wukong]

This surprises me a lot, as these people are acting like this is DB's last arc and Goku's last chance to shine. Modern DB in nowhere near being finished, so Vegeta getting a win shouldn't be that big of a deal.

I'm sure that's true too, but I've seen a lot of people who just actively hate Vegeta as a character to the point they don't want him to beat Moro.

[Matches Malone]

I've seen a lot of people who just actively hate Vegeta as a character to the point they don't want him to beat Moro.

I have as well, plenty of them. It goes beyond just beating Moro (which he technically did), they want him out of the picture completely, as in a background character who might just fight henchmen every now and then. Vegeta completely taking Moro down or not isn't going to change what I think of this arc, but I expect massive backlash from Goku's fanboys on social media and other places.

[Sadala Elite]

Vegeta is a support character, not a deuteragonist.

I Z he was absolutely a deuteragonist. Super however I could see a debate there. As the plot is heavily sculpted around both Saiyans gaining the power to challenge Beerus. Especially in the Manga. Why would you categorize him as support? Just curious.

Vegeta is more of a deuteragonist in Super than he ever was in Z. Super is often called "The Goku & Vegeta Show" for a reason lol.

Gohan was the real deuteragonist of Z, while Vegeta was more accurately the tritagonist.

[Mad Swami]

Vegeta is a support character, not a deuteragonist.

I Z he was absolutely a deuteragonist. Super however I could see a debate there. As the plot is heavily sculpted around both Saiyans gaining the power to challenge Beerus. Especially in the Manga. Why would you categorize him as support? Just curious.

Vegeta is more of a deuteragonist in Super than he ever was in Z. Super is often called "The Goku & Vegeta Show" for a reason lol.

Gohan was the real deuteragonist of Z, while Vegeta was more accurately the tritagonist.

I don't deny Gohan being a protagonist. However, I look at Z in two halves. The Goku and Vegeta half, and then the Gohan half. Buu saga is Goku and Vegeta's saga. Gohan is support. Whereas in the Frieza and Cell saga Gohan was as much of a lead as Goku. The Vegeta saga starts Goku and Vegeta's story and then it sort of rests on the back burner only to explode in the Buu saga. However, in Super, it's not the Goku and Vegeta show. It's the Goku show. Vegeta repeats his previous arcs, does nothing interesting, and just acts as a power scaler. Hit must be strong because he beat Vegeta. How is Goku going to win? Goku Black is strong because he beat Vegeta, how is Goku going to solve this?

[Dragon Wukong]

I don't deny Gohan being a protagonist. However, I look at Z in two halves. The Goku and Vegeta half, and then the Gohan half. Buu saga is Goku and Vegeta's saga. Gohan is support. Whereas in the Frieza and Cell saga Gohan was as much of a lead as Goku. The Vegeta saga starts Goku and Vegeta's story and then it sort of rests on the back burner only to explode in the Buu saga. However, in Super, it's not the Goku and Vegeta show. It's the Goku show. Vegeta repeats his previous arcs, does nothing interesting, and just acts as a power scaler. Hit must be strong because he beat Vegeta. How is Goku going to win? Goku Black is strong because he beat Vegeta, how is Goku going to solve this?

Vegeta isn't the deuteragonist of the Buu arc. His roles flip flop a little bit, but he briefly serves as an antagonist in Goku and Gohan's path, then he dies and from beginning (where he briefly served as protagonist) and and that point onward Gohan is in the main supporting role. Vegeta only takes over Gohan's role as a supporting role when Gohan is absorbed, which takes place at the very end of the arc. Gohan is 100% the deuteragonist of Z.

And, since the thread topic discusses the manga, it may be poignant to note that Vegeta actually beat Goku Black in the manga, and drives a lot of the Future Trunks arc in that medium.

[Mad Swami]

I don't deny Gohan being a protagonist. However, I look at Z in two halves. The Goku and Vegeta half, and then the Gohan half. Buu saga is Goku and Vegeta's saga. Gohan is support. Whereas in the Frieza and Cell saga Gohan was as much of a lead as Goku. The Vegeta saga starts Goku and Vegeta's story and then it sort of rests on the back burner only to explode in the Buu saga. However, in Super, it's not the Goku and Vegeta show. It's the Goku show. Vegeta repeats his previous arcs, does nothing interesting, and just acts as a power scaler. Hit must be strong because he beat Vegeta. How is Goku going to win? Goku Black is strong because he beat Vegeta, how is Goku going to solve this?

Vegeta isn't the deuteragonist of the Buu arc. His roles flip flop a little bit, but he briefly serves as an antagonist in Goku and Gohan's path, then he dies and from beginning (where he briefly served as protagonist) and and that point onward Gohan is in the main supporting role. Vegeta only takes over Gohan's role as a supporting role when Gohan is absorbed, which takes place at the very end of the arc. Gohan is 100% the deuteragonist of Z.

And, since the thread topic discusses the manga, it may be poignant to note that Vegeta actually beat Goku Black in the manga, and drives a lot of the Future Trunks arc in that medium.

The Buu saga was Vegeta becoming a good person. First fighting for those he loves, and then learning to work with Goku. That's why Vegito happens, that's why the Kid Buu fight happens.