Discussion regarding the entirety of the franchise in a general (meta) sense, including such aspects as: production, trends, merchandise, fan culture, and more.
Hello, ladies, gentlemen, and everyone between and beyond, and welcome to week 34 of the first Dragon Ball rewatch of the decade.
We're doing five episodes a week, and we'll be watching every single episode of Dragon Ball, Dragon Ball Z, and Dragon Ball GT. All 508 episodes. Plus the TV specials and the movies.
I encourage you all to watch in Japanese with subtitles, especially if you have never done so before, but watch along in whichever way brings you the most joy.
So much trivia this week, KBABZ had to send it to me as a text file rather than a Discord message. I hope you all appreciate it!
I'm including the roughly equivalent Kai episodes for the Z episodes we're watching below (this week, just episode 1). You'll also notice I'm including the original Saban dub episode numbers as well. Neither of these will line up perfectly with the normal Japanese Z viewing, but I tried my best.
I'm also numbering the individual episode breakdowns below continuously. Because why not.
Z episode numbers will be alongside the continuous number and title, in a smaller font.
Oh, and on top of everything else; Z movie 1 is in two weeks.
Also, KBABZ and I spent a very long time on the trivia this week, so you'd better it.
Episode 151 - Thanks to Chi-Chi’s Bridal Training Dub title: Outrageous Octagon (Funimation) / The Curse Of Crimson Peak! (Blue Water)
Originally aired 5th of April 1989
Episode director: Kazuhisa Takenouchi
Animation supervisor: Masayuki Uchiyama
Goku and Chi-Chi can’t draw near the mountain due to a blizzard. After hearing from an old woman named Hakkake who lives at the base of the mountain that the blizzard is actually a curse prohibiting women from touching the mountain, and that it can freeze even fire, Goku sets off for the mountain once again. There he chases away Pilaf and his gang, who this time had set their sights on the Basho Fan. He then obtains some snow, but it soon melts. Meanwhile, as she’s doing housework at the old woman’s place, by chance Chi-Chi discovers the Basho Fan in the garden!! The two return to the castle and fan the flames, but…
Anime-only/filler content: All filler
Episode 152 - Hurry, Goku! The Mysterious Mountain of the Five Elements Dub title: Mystery of the Dark World (Funimation) / The Mystery Of Mt. Five Elements! (Blue Water)
Originally aired 12th of April 1989
Episode director: Mitsuo Hashimoto
Animation supervisor: Yukio Ebisawa
Uranai Baba appears before Goku and the others, and informs them that the flames are from the Furnace of Eight Divinations. She says that the Furnace of Eight Divinations is located on the summit of the Mountain of Five Elements, and is governed by an ancient and revered individual. At the base of the Mountain of Five Elements, Goku and Chi-Chi have trouble with some phantom enemies, but still manage to arrive at the Furnace of Eight Divinations. Gohan, of all people, is working there! Goku requests the ancient and revered individual, the beautiful lady An’nin, to stop the Furnace of Eight Divinations. But An’nin replies that this would throw the living world into chaos…!!
Anime-only/filler content: All filler
Episode 153 - Mount Frypan Burns! An Instant Do-or-Die Journey Dub title: The End, The Beginning (Funimation) / The Quest To Save A King (Blue Water)
Originally aired 19th of April 1989
Episode director: Minoru Okazaki
Animation supervisor: Minoru Maeda
If they were to extinguish the fires of the Furnace of Eight Divinations, which carries the souls of the dead to the afterlife, then the living world be thrown into great disorder. Having explained things thus, An’nin then suddenly attacks Goku by becoming a giant!! But Goku counters with the Bashō Fan, and seeing it, An’nin says that it can create an opening in the furnace’s flames, allowing them to plug up the hole in the furnace. Since Goku already has the honey from old lady Hakkake and the shell of the Fire-Eating Bird’s egg, both of which are required to do this, he is able to seal up the hole in the furnace!! The castle’s fire dies down, and Goku and Chi-Chi’s wedding ceremony proceeds safely.
Anime-only/filler content: All filler
Episode 154 - Mini Goku is Just Precious! I’m Gohan (DBZ episode 1) Uncut dub title: The New Threat (Funimation)
Originally aired 26th of April 1989 Kai equivalent: Episode 1 - The Curtain Opens on the Battle! Son Goku Returns Edited dub equivalent: Episode 1 - The Arrival of Raditz (original title) / Arrival (US DVD title)
Episode director: Daisuke Nishio
Animation supervisor: Masayuki Uchiyama
It has been five years since the 23rd Tenka’ichi Budōkai. Goku and Chi-Chi have a son, Gohan, and they live on Mt. Paozu. But meanwhile, a spaceship lands far away, and from it an alien appears! As he searches for “Kakarotto” the man discovers Piccolo, who is giving off strong power. But even Piccolo, Goku’s equal, is petrified before this man’s tremendous power!! The alien then picks up another strong power, and heads off in that direction.
Anime-only/filler content: Everything before Raditz' pod touches down, everything involving Goku and Gohan in the woods (a large portion of this was kept in Kai, but not in the Saban dub)
Episode 155 - The Strongest Warrior in All of History is Goku’s Brother! (DBZ episode 2) Uncut dub title: Reunions (Funimation)
Originally aired 3rd of May 1989 Kai equivalent: Episode 1 - The Curtain Opens on the Battle! Son Goku Returns Edited dub equivalent: Episode 1 - The Arrival of Raditz (original title) / Arrival (US DVD title)
Episode director: Osamu Kasai
Animation supervisor: Katsumi Aoshima
For the first time in five years, Bulma has been invited over to Kame House, where Kame-Sen’nin and Kuririn live. Goku also arrives (late), and introduces Gohan, but the alien then lands in front of the four of them!! Calling Goku “Kakarotto”, he declares that he is one of the Saiyan, the strongest warrior race in the universe, and that furthermore he is Goku’s older brother, Raditz! Goku and the others are astonished. When Goku refuses to help him invade another planet, Raditz takes Gohan hostage!!
Anime-only/filler content: Nothing notable, aside from general padding (most of which was removed for Kai, but not the Saban dub).
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Interesting trivia:
Spoiler:
At this point in time in the manga, Ten gives his life to avenge Chaozu, Vegeta pauses the fight for three hours for Goku to arrive, Goku makes it to the end of the Serpent Road and starts his journey from God's Lookout, Kuririn throws the Kienzan at Nappa, and Piccolo sacrifices his life for Gohan.
By episode 153 of DBZ, Ten uses the Shin-Kikoho to keep Semi-Perfect Cell at bay while 16 and 18 escape, while Vegeta and Trunks emerge from the Room of Spirit and Time. In Kai's 153rd episode, Vegeta fights Kid Boo to give Goku one minute to gather his ki for a Genki Dama.
Episode 151 is the last time the Pilaf gang are seen using their original designs. In thier brief appearance in GT, they're old, and in Super, they're kids (an adult Mai from the future also appears in the Black arc, but her design is very different from how she was in the original run).
As before, in the entire Wedding Dress filler arc Goku is depicted with Nyoi-Bo. It should still be connecting Karin's Tower and God's Lookout, and will be depicted there in the Saiyan Arc.
Goku using the Nyoi-bo to escape the Eightfold Furnace is the final time he's depicted actually using it in the anime series, though he will use it again in Z movies 1 and 2, and briefly be seen holding it at the end of GT.
In the Japanese dialogue, Chichi remarks that the fire around her castle has gone out. However in the actual animation, no such thing happens.
The shot of Goku and Chichi leaving Mt. Frypan for the Mountain of Five Elements is the only time we get an aerial view of the castle grounds. It has a small wooded area, several parks, a lake in the shape of Gyu-Mao's old ox helmet, and the burning castle in the middle. All of these are of course framed by the base of Mt. Frypan, the remains from when Master Roshi destroyed it attempting to put out the first fire from the start of the story.
This is the second time the afterlife has been mentioned in the story, once again by Uranai Baba. This time, however, the manga has already shown Goku go there and back again in the Saiyan Arc, so the anime is now introducing this idea early before it goes there later.
The Mountain of Five Elements is also the name of the mountain Buddha trapped the Monkey King under for a few hundred years in Journey To The West after his mischief in heaven. (He would later be freed on the condition that he accompanies Tripitaka to India as his disciple, though by that time, the mountain had been renamed)
The grounds of the Mountain of Five Elements is the only time Goku has attempted to summon Kinto'Un and it's unable to appear (barring the period his first one was destroyed by Tambourine, of course).
Goku, of course, shouldn't have too much trouble crossing the walkway gap, considering he could easily jump that length after six months of Turtle School training. Also, he can fly by now, which the anime seems to have forgotten (though, in fairness, his flying abilities prior to this seemed to be quite limited, so it is possible he was still learning the technique).
It's possible, albiet entirely unfounded, that Grandpa Gohan was reintroduced in this arc to give some additional background on why Goku named his son after him, for anyone who missed the early run of DB.
Annin's explaination of all souls wandering aimlessly forever is essentially the same as what happens when one of the Demon Clan, such as Piccolo, kills somebody (only without the dead rising up from Hell part); though many fans misunderstand this as the souls being "trapped in limbo". (I think we may have made this error in a previous trivia section, so consider this a retraction, if we ever did make that mistake. I can't be bothered to check --Robo)
In the shot following Goku as he jumps down into the Eightfold Furnace, the Kame symbol is missing from his gi.
During the sequence where Goku patches the Eightfold Furnace, Gyuumao switches sides of the doorway he's leaning on.
Once again the fire is declared out even though the flames didn't shrink at all.
In the Japanese audio, Uranai Baba is heard calling out for Gyuumao even though her mouth isn't moving. This happens a second time during the final shot where she divines the future.
For some reason, in the Funimation dub of episode 153, and only that episode, Roshi and Goku make various vocalisations in the eyecatches. The Japanese version doesn't do this. I would compare Blue Water's dub of this, but Blue Water didn't use the eyecatches for DB.
Also in the Funimation dub of Episode 153, the narrator Brice Armstrong tells the audience to watch Dragon Ball Z for the further adventures of Goku and his friends. At the time this dub premiered in 2003, it had been seven years since Funimation's original dub of Dragon Ball Z had debuted, in September 1996.
The Japanese version, for what it's worth, has the narrator simply say "The next story takes place five years from now", since DBZ episode 1 was going to air the next week, in the same timeslot, as if nothing had really changed (and, really, it hadn't ).
The Blue Water dub errs closer to the Japanese version, but doesn't kep the direct reference to there being another story immediately after; instead, he says "It looks like their adventures are just beginning!"... Despite the fact this would be the very last piece of Dragon Ball media Ocean would dub until their still-unreleased Kai dub, which was recorded between 2010 and 2013 (which, as it stands, is the very last Dragon Ball thing Ocean has ever dubbed). On this note, Robo would like it known that Ocean are still shopping their version of Kai around to various outlets. Despite what the naysayers may say, Ocean Kai simply refuses to die.
As was touched on briefly above, Dragon Ball Episode 153 aired on April 19th 1989; losing no momentum at all, Dragon Ball Z Episode 1 aired the following week in the exact same timeslot on April 26th 1989, keeping up the famed "Toriyama block" started by the original Dr. Slump anime on April 8th 1981, which would resume all the way up to the end of the second Dr. Slump series concluded in September 1999.
Dragon Ball episode 153 actually had a "Next episode preview" for Z episode 1, even. But, no home media release includes this, and the English dubs didn't include it either.
It isn't accurate to call Dragon Ball Z a "sequel" to Dragon Ball in the same way Super is; in truth it's essentially a rebrand, as the then-current producers felt that changing the name would allow them to market it as a brand new show while keeping the same production teams, potentially drawing in buzz to counteract the ratings-decline that long-runners often experience. (And, by all accounts, it worked)
Toriyama suggested using the last letter of the english alphabet, Z, for the rebrand, as he explains here:
Rumor has it that you titled it after an energy supplement with “Z” in the name.
Toriyama:
That’s not true~. (laughs) “Z” is the last letter of the alphabet, right? Anyhow, from that time, I really already wanted to end the comic, (laughs) so I gave the title a “Z” with the meaning of “that’s all, folks~”. I don’t remember saying a single thing about there being an energy supplement. Rumors can be so wild. (laughs)
Nakatsuru:
Did you have any image of something other than the “Z”?
Toriyama:
No, I probably didn’t. I myself thought, “they don’t really have to change the title, do they?” but someone from the anime staff demanded it, saying “we want to freshen it up”, so I was just sort of like, “this should be fine”.
Nakatsuru:
Dragon Ball ends right with Goku getting married, then Dragon Ball Z starts with Goku’s older brother Raditz arriving.
Toriyama:
Wow, is that so? So it made a perfect dividing point, then.
Of course, despite his thought that things would end soon at the time, this would not happen for another seven years and the "Z" portion of Dragon Ball would ultimately take up two-thirds of the manga by the time it eventually ended.
It's also worth noting that this quote illustrates further that Toriyama never really cared to know when the DB/Z divide happened, and didn't really get why Toei wanted to do it, he just sort of went along with it.
The animation team at Toei meanwhile considered "New Dragon Ball", "Dragon Ball 2", "Dragon Ball 90" (in reference to 1990), "Dragon Ball: Wonder Boy" and "Dragon Ball" Gohan's Big Adventure" as potential rebrand names.
Amusingly enough, in 1989 "Dragon Ball 3: Goku Den" would release for the Famicom, the sequel to the previous year's "Dragon Ball: Daimao Fukkatsu".
The opening and closing credits of Dragon Ball Z have a particularly strong focus on Gohan and his father. This is likely because Toei considered him the next major character, particularly as they considered "Gohan's Big Adventure" to be one of the subtitles for the new show. And of course, if you have no knowledge of the Boo arc (and, particularly, given the Gohan focus at this point in the manga, with him training under Piccolo and being a critical part in the fight against Nappa and Vegeta), this would seem to be so...
In the early/mid 1990s, Gen Fukanaga originally wanted to dub just Dragon Ball Z after he saw it in Japan, however -- after his uncle at Toei managed to convince them to even let this no-name startup have one of their flagship franchises, after their initial refusal -- Toei told him he should dub Dragon Ball first from episode one. In a case of Exact Words, Funimation only dubbed the first thirteen episodes before moving on to Z as if it never happened. They wouldn't dub Dragon Ball until 2001 while they were in the midst of the Cell Games.
Many would say Dragon Ball had poor ratings in syndication which is what led to its cancellation, but realistically, its ratings were no worse than Z's were in its first season, despite Z having a significantly better syndication partner. Dragon Ball only became a success in the USA towards the middle/end of season 1 of Z, far past the 13-episode run DB had been given... It's easy to say one thing or another about potential skulduggery here, but Robo's view on it is that Gen Fukunaga clearly wanted to start with Z, since that's the show he saw in Japan, so when he saw lukewarm ratings for DB, he used that as an excuse to move on to the show he really wanted to do, then since Z was what he wanted to do all along, he was much more willing to stand by it for longer... So, it's likely just a case of an inherent bias behind the people in charge leading them to give Z more of a chance, rather than either DB failing, or any deliberate sabotage.
At this point, we'll now refer to "Ma-Junior" as Piccolo in these entires.
The logo shown at the start of Z's opening has the blue Shen Long emblem, inherited from the Dragon Ball anime's logo with a pink background and shading. It's worth emphasizing that Toriyama only drew this emblem for the very first chapter of the manga!
The first version of the Head Cha La opening doesn't feature Gohan running on Shenlong's back, instead having an aerial view of a pretty landscape. As well, Nappa and Vegeta aren't depicted walking through the wall of fire, as they haven't appeared in the story yet; instead a distant Kinto'Un is shown flying across along the bottom of the shot.
The original Rock the Dragon intro used for the 1996 dub, meanwhile, primarily used shots from the first three Z movies (mostly from the third): Only Nappa destroying the figher jet is from the anime itself. Worse than this however is that the last few shots are from the third version of the Head Cha La intro, showing Trunks, as well as Goku and Vegeta as Super Saiyans right from when Raditz arrives.
The Funimation in-house dub of Z that began in 1999 initially reused the Rock The Dragon opening, but they changed over to their own, new opening starting from around the Garlic Jr. saga. At this point, the Canadian airings switched to using different edits of the episodes done by Ocean. These edits continued to use the Rock The Dragon opening visuals (as well as the accompanying sound effects, grunts, etc.), but had a new song composed by the Canadian company Anitunes.
The Canadian opening would also be used for the Westwood Media dub of DBZ, however, the UK version of this swapped out some shots (mainly the ones from Z movie 1, though they also removed the Nappa plane shot) in favour of shots from the Namek/Freeza sagas, to make the OP feel a bit more relevant. They didn't change the audio at all, though, so the wrong SFX/grunts play over the new footage.
Dragon Ball Kai's intro has several allusions to the original Cha-La opening to Z, including Gohan diving through the air to be caught by Goku on the Kinto'Un, the three Saiyan pods descending down to Earth, a distant Kinto'Un going across the screen, and a general emphasis on Goku using his famous cloud.
Kai episode 1 contains 12 reanimated scenes, almost all from the recap. Some of these shots were only reanimated in the 16:9 widescreen version broadcast on Japanese TV and put on the German and French Blu-ray releases, however we're not aware of a proper tally of all the 4:3 reanimated scenes anywhere.
In the initial airings of Kai episode 1, the English word "Paradise" was misspelled as "Paradice" in the on-screen lyrics in the OP. This error persists in Japanese reairings of Kai, however it was corrected for all foreign distribution, and home video.
The name of Roshi's voice actor was also misspelled as "佐藤正浩" ("Satō Masahiro") instead of "佐藤正治" ("Satō Masaharu") in this first-airing version.
The group shot at the end of the Cha-La OP shows Chaozu wearing a sort of wide-brimmed item over his neck and shoulders. He only wore these when first arriving at the 23rd TB with Ten, Kuririn and Yamucha.
Cha-La and Zenkai Power are the longest-reigning opening and ending in the franchise, being used for 200 episodes (Makafushigi Adventure and Romantic Ageru Yo, respectively, take second place. Chozetsu Dynamic from Super takes third for the OP, but I've spent too long writing up this OP anyway, so I'm not going to do the additional research to figure out all the rest. Maybe I'll do it in a few months when the OP/ED changes again. --Robo).
DBZ episode 1 marks the introduction of Shunsuke Kikuchi's ninth music package for the franchise. He composed this music specifically for this part of the story, for use in the series. This would not happen again until episode 200, when the OP changes, as Toei realised they could continue to inject new themes into the series by just reusing the scores Kikuchi was composing for the movies twice yearly. As a result, leitmotifs become a bit muddled for many characters after the Saiyan arc concludes; while some characters like Piccolo, Goku, and Gohan continue to get new iterations of their themes, some major characters such as Freeza, the cyborgs, or Cell never actually had themes of their own composed.
In the original edited dub, the replacement score would be composed by Ron Wasserman (though the opening, Rock The Dragon, was composed by someone else. Possibly Jeremy Sweet, we don't really know), who is most widely-known for his work on Power Rangers. At the time, he was an independent contractor who Saban would hire for various shows, though his work -- as with all other work Saban hired their independent contractors for -- was credited as being composed by Shuki Levy. We're not entirely sure about how Mark Menza or Nathan Johnson's replacement scores were done, but Ron Wasserman is at least distinct from both Kikuchi and his successor Bruce Faulconer in that he composed a full original score for each episode, rather than composing packages of cues to be placed in episodes by music editors.
The very first episode of Dragon Ball Kai opens with the final moments of the Bardock Special followed by a basic recap of Dragon Ball's plot, with a particular emphasis on Piccolo to explain his somewhat complex history (though, in the process, it pretty much completely skips over the Red Ribbon and Baba arcs). It ends on the shot of Chichi grabbing Goku's arm at the wedding in Episode 153, one of the final shots of the original anime.
Kai opening on the Bardock Special spoils two facets of the plot: 1) That Goku is a low-class alien from another planet, and 2) That Frieza destroyed planet Vegeta rather than a meteor (which wouldn't be revealed for another 20 episodes).
Kai actually ended up doing many of the same edits as Saban made to their version of DBZ episode 1, however Kai actually includes far more of uncut Z episode 1 than Saban did, and in fact, compared to Kai, the way Saban cut their version of episode 1 is a lot closer to how it plays out in the manga.
After the latest timeskip, Goku is now 23 and Bulma is 27.
One of the more famous changes for Z is Goku's gi: it's now changed from red with a yellow symbol to orange with a white symbol. As well, his undershirt and belt were changed from black to blue. Toriyama used this colouration primarily as early as 1985, but the anime used red and black after the more common limited-colour manga pages. Though various shots in the ED used for the last two arcs of DB used the manga and Z colouring of Goku's gi and shirt.
The lengthy forest sequence involving Goku and Gohan (as well as the opening) actually spoils a major plot point from the manga early: that Gohan is his son. In the manga, Gohan isn't seen until Goku steps off Kinto-un at Kame House, and the audience finds out their relation at the same time Bulma, Kuririn and Roshi do.
Raditz's shoulder armour is a noticeably different shape compared to what would be established later with Vegeta and the Frieza Force.
Raditz's scouter was originally depicted with a blue panel in the manga. Toriyama would later colour it green, which is what the anime uses.
The very first scouter reading shown in the series is 5. The very last scouter reading in the anime would also be 5, when Mecha-Freeza scans Trunks' suppressed ki.
Catching a bullet was originally performed by Roshi when the Red Ribbon Army invaded his island (later done by the Crane Hermit and Goku in filler). Raditz is the first to toss it back, however.
The original 1996 dub has the farmer say "That smarts" as he lies in a crumpled pile in front of his car, implying he survived the shot. The 2005 "Ultimate Uncut" redub keeps some trace of this, as the farmer continues to groan and moan as he hits the car, implying he was just knocked out. Funimation's Kai dub, unlike their two previous dubs, doesn't sugar-coat this scene at all; the farmer clearly dies, even in the edited version (though the edited version cuts the shot of his dead body lying in front of the car).
In Japanese, and Funimation's unedited Kai dub, Roshi expresses a desire to feel Bulma's breasts when she arrives back at Kame House. Viz censors this to him merely wanting a kiss. The edited dubs merely cut this out.
Don't expect extensive notes on the differences between all the various English versions of these early portions of Z. It's a real headache to get everything together to compare the Japanese, 1996, 2005, and Kai versions of these scenes.
The early Kai eyecatches show Gohan with a respectful "fist in palm" gesture. This is taken from when he first greets himself to Bulma, Kuririn and Roshi.
The flying vehicle Bulma uses to arrive at Kame House is the same used by the Red Ribbon Army. They appeared primarily in the Blue saga, including when she's chased after the two soldiers who intended to rape her, as well as when they invaded Roshi's island.
Gohan's stated age was originally stated as three in the Shonen Jump version of Chapter 196. On the title page of 197, however, his age was been revised to four, and this is reflected in the Tankobon version of 196 (although the artwork still shows him holding up three fingers, implying he can't count just like his dad, even though he's later shown to be very good with maths). This means that Gohan was concieved about three months after the 23rd TB concluded. (There's a reason this detail is included; read on. --Robo)
The anime is able to correct this by having Gohan hold up four fingers.
In Funimation's dub, Gohan's age was further increased to five and a half years old, which raises some questions regarding Chichi's pregnancy.
Lastly, in the ViZ translation Gohan says "This many!". He still holds up three fingers, which is then contradicts Bulma saying he's awfully polite for a four-year-old.
Goku saying Gohan got his manners from Chichi suggests that she's trying not to be the crass country bumpkin she used to be and instead a respectful wife, which somewhat tracks with how she behaved just after Goku proposed at the tournament.
The Oozaru form is brought up here after being pretty much completely absent since the end of the 21st Tenkaichi Budokai, which concluded three years earlier in 1985. It wouldn't actually be depicted again until Gohan accidentally turns into one during his training in the wilds. (I'll bet a bunch of you subconsciously assumed that was a filler scene! --Robo)
Goku states that in addition to the Four Star Ball, he also has the Three and Six-Star Balls. This implies that he has a Dragon Radar in order to find them; it's most likely he used the Radar he took from Bulma to track down Tambourine in the Piccolo arc (Bulma would later build another to help Roshi and Tien gather the Dragon Balls before Daimao could, which is probably the radar Bulma will give Goku in episode 3).
In the manga and Z, when Goku stresses out over detecting Raditz's ki, Bulma says "Better not be Yamcha". In Japanese Kai this line isn't said at all, but Bulma still crosses her arms and moves her mouth enough to begin saying the line; Funimation's dub adds a line from her, "I dunno", likely to cover this editing goof.
In the manga, Raditz states that Goku looks "just like [his] father". In the anime, however, this is revised to "just like our father", implying their brotherly connection before it's revealed soon after.
Raditz makes a declaration that the Saiyans are the most powerful warrior race in the universe. While the "race" thing is a potential out-clause, such a claim made by the likes of him and Vegeta of course ignore the later introductions of characters like Dodoria, Zarbon, the Ginyu Force, and of course Frieza.
Vegeta and Nappa make their first anime appearances in Raditz's explaination of Saiyan "business". As would become infamous, both he and Nappa have incorrect colouring on their armour and on Vegeta's hair because Toriyama hadn't provided Toei with their colour palette yet as he normally would. This clip makes it into Kai and the colouring errors were not fixed (unlike in Kai episode 3, where Toei recoloured every shot of Vegeta and Nappa that they used, to fix this error).
Several female Saiyans are also depicted during this flashback. We'll see one or two more unnamed Saiyans in Kaio's Complete History Of The Saiyans And Their Ultimate Downfall At The Hands Of Something That Wasn't Freeza in Z episode 20, before finally seeing a few that have names and lines in the Bardock special. I believe this is the last time we'll see any female Saiyans in the series aside from Pan and Bra, who are each only half or quarter Saiyan.
The shot of Goku's pod on Earth depicts it atop a mountain overlooking a river. This would be changed in the Bardock Special to a field of bamboo. Both versions are used in Kai.
Raditz states that the full moon is the key to unlocking a Saiyan's true potential. This is pretty much the only period in the series history when the Oozaru form is treated this way before it's replaced with Super Saiyan, until GT would return to this idea by combining the two transformations for Super Saiyan 4.
Planet Vegeta as it appears above Raditz while he reminisces about its destruction is depicted with two Saturn-like rings. These don't appear in later depictions of the planet, and it's also shown in red and green colours, which practically every later depiction will contradict. The manga simply depicts an explosion (coloured yellow in the Full Color edition).
Raditz mentions that he and another Saiyan survived as they were on assignment together, with a third being on a solo assignment (the manga isn't quite this specific). This would be contradicted by the 2018 Broly movie where Raditz, Vegeta and Nappa are all depicted together on the same mission.
When Raditz approaches Goku with the intent to steal Gohan, Goku threatens to kill him. This is only the third time he's stated this intent, the previous times being with Tambourine and Piccolo Daimao.
The recap opening in Kai's second episode uses sepia-graded clips from the final 23rd TB episode to somewhat recap Piccolo's and Goku's history together, which wasn't utilized in its Z equivalent.
The Japanese Zenkai Power ending uses a shot of Gohan staring up in fear at Piccolo, alluding several episodes early that he'll take Gohan away for training.
Several of the insert shots of Zenkai Power keep up the tradition of using some of Toriyama's title page artwork in the ending animations:
The Son family on the Jeep is from Chapter 199, where Goku and Piccolo start to battle Raditz.
The Chibi TB Arena is from Chapter 184, where Goku draws Piccolo's fire away by jumping up into the air, causing him to blow up a mountain range. Gohan runs across the shot in case you forgot he's the star.
Tiger Skirt Gohan is from Chapter 207, where Gohan first begins his Wilderness Training and escapes the dinosaur. Gohan's clothing here is actually an authentic Monkey King outfit, referencing Goku's inspiration. Monkey got this outfit shortly after becoming Tripitaka's disciple; the two meet a tiger on the road, so Monkey kills it, and uses its skin to make his outfit (he would refine this outfit a little when they stopped off at a farm to rest for the night).
Episode summaries, airdates, and titles courtesy of Kanzenshuu's episode guide. Filler breakdowns and Dragon Ball logo provided, and trivia co-written, by KBABZ.
Last edited by Robo4900 on Wed Aug 26, 2020 9:04 am, edited 2 times in total.
The point of Dragon Ball is to enjoy it. Never lose sight of that.
The Saiyan arc without a doubt has the strongest introduction to any arc. We get so many revelations and world building right from the start. Things don't even stop there, as 3 episodes later Goku himself dies and we're told 2 even stronger fighters are on their way. I couldn't think of a stronger intro if I tried. Also worth mentioning is the new opening, which has become one of the most classic openings in Shonen history.
Semantics but Dragon Ball’s dub actually started after the Cell Games juust before the Otherworld Tournament arc and ended up ending the fall after Z wrapped up. Feeling the need to tell viewers to be sure to watch Dragon Ball Z is still weird as I guarantee pretty much any dub Dragon Ball viewer in 2003 had already watched Z. One of those times were Funimation’s obvious bias for Z is showing, I suppose,
Like I said before, I don’t much care for the Wedding Dress arc. It’s a pretty underwhelming “finale”
I love that the first Z episode makes direct parallels between Goku and Gohan right down to a run in with a Sabre Tooth Tiger.
If I’m not mistaken the shot of the sun just before Raditz’s pod zooms through is the same footage as the beginning of Mystical Adventure (Dragon Ball’s OP)
Shigeru Chiba’s Raditz has a really cool voice, same with the Ocean guy. Justin Cook...not so much
Watching the 1996 dub and 2005 dub is interesting not only because Funimation uses the same script as much as possible but it becomes apparent how much better the Vancouver cast was even with the Texas cast having 6 years experience at this point.
The editing of these episodes by Funimation for the 96 dub is interesting too. Not only does it skip the “peaceful era”’stuff and jumps straight to the “Alien invader!!!” scene and completely cut out Gohan in the woods they actually rearrange scenes too. In the edited dub Chi Chi and Goku’s interaction happens AFTER Raditz’s run in with the farmer, they also move Piccolo’s encounter with Raditz before Goku finds Gohan instead of at the end of the episode.
To Funimation’s credit the redub does something they rarely do and actually acknowledge Z’s status as a sequel to Dragon Ball! They actually mention Goku defeating Piccolo and the 5 year time skip. Even the redub title “The New Threat” is an acknowledgement that this is a sequel series. Which is impressive when the dub can barely be bothered to act like there was a series before Z. On the other hand they refer to Piccolo as King Piccolo, which not “technically wrong” (they are the same being) it’s not really accurate since Goku defeated “Piccolo Junior” 5 years ago. King Piccolo was defeated 8 years ago.
For some reason, the narrator in the redub refers to Raditz as “A Saiyan Warrior” now pretty much any person watching already knows this, but chronologically speaking, nobody should know this yet so it’s weird.
Following the “We’re acknowledging this is a sequel to Dragon Ball” Gohan’s age is fixed from 5 1/2 to 4 1/2 yet he still ends up being 11 by the Cell Games. Oops.
In the Japanese version Kuririn implies Raditz is drunk “it’s not good to drink this early in the afternoon” the edited dub kind of sort of keeps this idea in a very G rated way. He says he thinks Raditz had been dipping into the egg nog. The super hard core edgy uncut dub
of course uses the exact same dialog as the edited for kids network tv dub.
In the Japanese version Bulma brings manju buns
In the Funi dubs she brings truffles
The Kai Funi dub compromise by just generically referring to them as goodies. Because even in 2010 Funimation is iffy on acknowledging this Japanese anime takes place in Japan.
Still think the wedding dress filler arc is fun for what it is, I always loved the concepts like what happens between life and death that we got in the Mount Five Elements episodes.
I've watched the Saiyan arc so many times with the original edited dub, remastered dub, Kai and both Japanese versions, and it's still a blast every time. Goku being an alien was a brilliant retcon, you've got to give Toriyama for pulling it off and it not feeling inorganic or forced in any way.
Something I noticed comparing the first episodes of Z and Kai is that the former focuses more on Gohan and you spend more time with him in the wild whereas the latter really builds up Goku. I think both are great ways to experience the story, and it's nice the choice is there because some prefer Gohan over Goku and vice versa.
Also love the new openings and endings in this portion of the series. Much prefer Cha-La Head Cha-La and Dragon Soul to Makafushigi Adventure. Not a fan of Zenkai Power but Yeah Yeah! Care Break is great. For the edited dub I do like the guitar in Rock the Dragon even though it doesn't fit Dragon Ball too well, also get nostalgic listening to it, which I can't complain about.
Do you have any info about international non-English broadcasts about the Dragon Ball anime or manga translations/editions? Please message me. Researching for a future book with Dragon Ball scholar Derek Padula
Dragon Ball Ireland wrote: Wed Aug 19, 2020 4:33 pm
Not a fan of Zenkai Power but Yeah Yeah! Care Break is great. For the edited dub I do like the guitar in Rock the Dragon even though it doesn't fit Dragon Ball too well, also get nostalgic listening to it, which I can't complain about.
I feel the exact opposite. Zenkai Power is my favorite Japanese ED for Dragon Ball. Yeah Yeah! Care Break is just so so generic
Interesting how as noted above they basically were flat out telling viewers at the end of ep 153 in the dub as Baba covers her crystal ball "Hey kids, watch DBZ now" while the Japanese version had no such directness to it, although i think this may also partly be because DB's dub unlike Z and GT didn't have the next episode previews at the end and on that note it's kind of weird at the same time because Z had already wrapped up it's initial dubbed broadcast run on Toonami many months before. Z ep 291/276 had aired in January 2003, while DB ep 153 aired in December about ten months later. The original version merely said "The story continues five years from now" which of course goes with the episode's original broadcast in Japan on 4/19/1989 before the credits had rolled (Yes, the NEP's/FEP's were put before the credits unlike how the Dragon Boxes and later reruns of all three series did) had a first episode preview to tell viewers that Z was premiering the very next week at the same time.
In general, i feel the Wedding Dress arc is ok as a conclusion to the original series and transition over to DBZ though there are others that i'm much more partial to like the Solo Training arc, Goku's Worldly training with Kami and Mr. Popo before the 23rd Budokai and the later Afterlife Tournament/Anoyo-ichi Budokai.
And thus with that we conclude Dragon Ball and move on to Z.
Now some thoughts on Z eps 001 and 002:
- Like the callback to the original DB series opening with the sun as Raditz's space pod flies by, i believe it's just recycled footage from it.
- The Gohan in woods filler material is ok including the saber tiger stuff, though in general i can take or leave it.
- Of course Lunch gets briefly mentioned in passing as to her whereabouts, and then of course appears in the flesh about a dozen or so episodes later which also is filler.
- Gohan is four years old in the anime, and as noted when he first appeared in the manga in late 1988 within Weekly Shonen Jump his age was actually three years. This was subsequently changed by the time Z aired and the alteration reflected when said chapter was released in the tankobon and all further collected editions. It is figured this was done because the anime staff were concerned about such a young child being beaten around. Of course, the FUNi dubs went one step further and changed it to him being five (subsequently corrected back to four) although that still conflicts with his age later in the series particularly around the Cell arc.
- Every time i see the scene where Raditz approaches Kami House, i can't help but think of Roshi's "I smell death in the air" line from the old Z dub even when watching the Japanese version.
- Wow, i can only imagine and visualize what it was like at the time with finding out that Goku originally wasn't of Earth, though of course those fans who were reading the manga in Jump several months beforehand already knew this before the show even started.
Last edited by SuperSaiyaManZ94 on Wed Aug 19, 2020 7:26 pm, edited 11 times in total.
DB collection related goals as of now:
1.) Find decent priced copy of Dragon Box Z Vol. 4 (Done)
A disappointing episode, and weakest so far in this arc. Similar to the rest of the episodes the Goku and Chi-Chi character moments are the best, the comedy gags leave something to be desired but the drama keeps the story exciting.
The Goku and Chi-Chi moments were fewer in
this episode because they were separated for much of it, although the shot of Chi-Chi holding on to Goku's chest on the Kinto Un, and them being brought in by Hakkake to warm up after landing in the snow were rather sweet. The Pilaf gang scenes were starting to see diminishing returns, and their presence was limited to being pushovers as the blizzard posed just as much a threat to them as Goku, their missiles missing Goku was the epitome of this.
The idea that the blizzard cursed girls from travelling up the mountain felt necessary, especially with Chi-Chi having the task of washing dishes it felt like it was stereotyping women. The one saving grace was that Chi-Chi was asked to find running water, so at the very least her having to do outside gave her a sense of purpose outside traditional gender norms. Goku's decision to create a huge ball of snow to put out the fire at Gyumao’s castle was an act of great intentions, although it showed the naivety he still has regarding anything to do with nature.
Throughout the episode there are several scenes of
the fire tearing Gyumao's castle apart, and the Ox King runs into dead ends and falls over, adding to a sense of drama and consequence for how long Goku and Chi-Chi's quest is taking. Conversely the
moment Chi-Chi finds the Basho fan, hugs Hakkake realizing she can save her father were nice moments and remind the viewer that this arc is moving towards a rewarding conclusion, especially when the honey jar is given as a wedding gift.
Goku's attempt to put out the fire with the Basho fan to no avail keeps the tension going, but at this
point it seems like the end is near, and the sense of wonder lies in how Goku will be able to save the day and his new father-in-law.
Episode 152 - Hurry, Goku! The Mysterious Mount Five Element
A huge improvement over the last episode with a lot more payoff from previously established plot points and ideas from this arc and more nice Goku and Chi-Chi moments.
Goku's continued failure to put out the fire with the Basho fan and taking Baba's advice that he has to
reach Mount Five Elements to stop the fire straight from the source emphasizes that he's still willing to listen to his elders.
The scenes from Goku and Chi-Chi riding on Kinto Un through the lands canyons and stormy clouds to working together to jump acoss pits of spikes were quite endearing. The idea Kinto Un can't work in this area was a welcome addition as it added a necessary obstacle where Goku could lead by example to help Chi-Chi make the jumps herself.
At one point Chi-Chi was stopped in her tracks by a flock of bats, and nearly falls but Goku saves her, which was a nice moment and an admirable act. In addition the presence of evil spirits gave Goku an
opportunity to show what he learned from Mr Popo about sensing your opponents spirit, and not always rely on what you perceive, by demonstrating for Chi-Chi not to be intimidated by how threatening someone appears. The notion that these evil spirits and demons were figments of Goku and Chi-Chi's imagination was a fascinating idea and a great payoff to the confidence that Goku has developed, and gives him the opportunity to teach Chi-Chi to overcome her fears.
Much like the last episode the scenes of the Ox King running throughout the castle, escaping the flames added some necessary tension and a reminder of the importance of Goku and Chi-Chi's
journey.
Once Goku and Chi-Chi reach the Magic Furnace the scene where the former reunites with Gohan was a touching moment after how much this man has been built up throughout the series. Taijorokun's introduction was more ominous, both for the size she appeared as and her revelation that both the living world and the next world will go into chaos if the magic fire was extinguished.
With another risk at hand the hype for the conclusion of the wedding dress mini arc reaches its decisive climax.
Episode 153 - Mount Frypan Burns! An Instant Do-or-Die Journey
In this episode the long and winding journey for Goku and Chi-Chi to save Gyumao’s castle from certain doomn reaches its grand resolution.
The tension remains high with cutbacks to the Ox King is surrounded by collapsing towers, and looks exhausted from all the running around. Baba witnessing the destruction of the castle adds a sense of consequence should Goku fail as she had become a friend and is depending on him.
Goku shows his commitment to wanting to do the
right thing through his frustration with Taijorokun seemingly trivializing Goku's request for her to help put out the magic fire by offering him noodles. Goku's decision to try pull the lever even though he was told all the departed souls will be lost if he completes this act shows impulsiveness is still a weakness for his character. Goku and Taijorokun's fight further emphasized this need for Goku to be more prudent and cautious, especially given Taijorokun's realization Goku could put out the magic fire without unleashing chaos was a complete accident as he was using the Basho fan to fight back. In this moment Chi-Chi shows her wisdom by keeping the shell fragments from the fire eater and the honey from the special bees, which Taijorokun informs is all Goku needs along with the Basho fan to stop the fire.
Goku's journey through the magic furnace in such a short space of time was exciting while it lasted,
although his use of the Nyoibo, which he shouldn't have anymore was an unnecessary plot hole, but as it was a brief moment it can be ignored.
The sense of accomplishment as Baba is shocked to see the flames clear from Gyumao’s castle and Chi-Chi's tears of joy as she jumps towards Goku was very satisfying. The Ox King pretending to be dead to Baba was a rather dark joke for the series, but his justification for keeping Chi-Chi's dress fresh alleviated the moment, and was a respectable act.
Goku and Chi-Chi's wedding ceremony was a great moment to wrap up the wedding dress arc and
the original Dragon Ball series. The boy who lost his adoptive grandfather, learned to live alone, quickly met friends who became loyal and trained to become the strongest fighter in the world was now settling down, and as Baba confirms his adventures are just beginning.
Z and Kai Episode reviews to follow.
Do you have any info about international non-English broadcasts about the Dragon Ball anime or manga translations/editions? Please message me. Researching for a future book with Dragon Ball scholar Derek Padula
I enjoyed that filler arc a lot more than I remembered. It's great to see Goku and Chichi working together and I think they make a great couple. Their relationship is a nice transition into DBZ.
I liked Annin's voice actress.
Wouldn't Gyuumao have died from smoke inhalation long before the fire burnt him up?
DBZ Episodes 1 & 2
"Head-Cha-La" is an Anglicized form of hecchara essentially meaning "no worries" or "no problem".
I like this opening, but prefer Makafushigi and We Gotta over it. Similarly, I prefer Romantic and Angels over Zenkai.
Steve Simmons is now doing the subtitles, and while I appreciate the accuracy and cultural respect, I dislike his wordy and overly literal translations. He also has some particular vocabulary quirks that recur throughout this and his other series that I'm not fond of. I suppose that it's at least nice to have a fan doing the translations.
It's interesting to see the anime moving away from rural Chinese settings and into rural America with the ostrich farmers and whatnot.
In the anime, Goku and family are living next to Son Gohan's old house up in the Baozi/Pao Tzu/Paozu mountains. This wasn't the case in the manga.
I like how Raditz tells Goku to kill 100 people and leave their bodies in a pile on the island lol.
MasenkoHA wrote: Wed Aug 19, 2020 4:32 pm
Shigeru Chiba’s Raditz has a really cool voice, same with the Ocean guy. Justin Cook...not so much
The Ocean guy Jason Gray-Stanford is an actor in real life as well who has been in a bunch of stuff. He also did Cui I think. I don't like Justin Cook in any of his roles.
Stanford was Randy Disher in Monk. As a big fan of Monk and Tony Shalhoub in general, Stanford being the voice of Raditz was a big deal for me. It was kinda like finding out Luke Skywalker was also the voice of The Joker. Ah, the days before IMDB.
Boy does Chiba have range.
The biggest truths aren't original. The truth is ketchup. It's Jim Belushi. Its job isn't to blow our minds. It's to be within reach.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take - Wayne Gretzky" - Michael Scott
Happiness is climate, not weather.
ABED wrote: Wed Aug 19, 2020 9:01 pm
Stanford was Randy Disher in Monk. As a big fan of Monk and Tony Shalhoub in general, Stanford being the voice of Raditz was a big deal for me. It was kinda like finding out Luke Skywalker was also the voice of The Joker. Ah, the days before IMDB.
Boy does Chiba have range.
Indeed, i'll say Shigeru Chiba has some kind of range because he can go from the more higher pitched comedic type characters like Emperor Pilaf to deeper menacing sounding ones such as Raditz and Garlic Jr. (since Akira Kamiya didn't return for his arc in the series for whatever reason) and he handles both ends masterfully.
Last edited by SuperSaiyaManZ94 on Wed Aug 19, 2020 11:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
DB collection related goals as of now:
1.) Find decent priced copy of Dragon Box Z Vol. 4 (Done)
I'd also like the make a semi-announcement regarding the state of the filler sections: They won't contain the same amount of detail as before.
The filler recaps thus far were based on my memories and notes made while making Dragon Ball Kai: The First Chapters, where I removed the filler and made notes on what I took out. I simply recounted the significant ones. Z however is completely foreign to me: I've been exposed primarily to Kai, do not own Z in any fashion, and to be perfectly frank the episode plot recaps on the main Kanzenshuu site suck because they don't reference filler AT ALL unless the whole episode is that, like with Garlic Jr.
As such it's really difficult for me to note filler scenes from this point on. I have the English Full Colours for a little bit of help, but once they've dried up after Namek, well, that's it!
The Ocean guy Jason Gray-Stanford is an actor in real life as well who has been in a bunch of stuff. He also did Cui I think. I don't like Justin Cook in any of his roles.
Ooh that’s neat. I knew most/all of the Ocean actors had prolific resumes in voice acting but I didn’t know any of them had an impressive resume in live action acting (I only knew of Saffron Henderson having a minor role as a hair metal rocker victim in Jason goes Manhattan)
Dragon Ball Wikia credits Ian Corlett to the role of Cui but I’m not sure how reliable that is since the Ocean era never credited actors to specific roles and the wikia had a strong Funimation in-house cast bias.
Justin Cook is actually one of the few voices I feel got worse in Kai. In Z he at least seems to be trying to emulate Jason Gray-Stanford slow menacing growl but not really well, in Kai he’s just hamming it up and not in a fun way
The Ocean guy Jason Gray-Stanford is an actor in real life as well who has been in a bunch of stuff. He also did Cui I think. I don't like Justin Cook in any of his roles.
Ooh that’s neat. I knew most/all of the Ocean actors had prolific resumes in voice acting but I didn’t know any of them had an impressive resume in live action acting (I only knew of Saffron Henderson having a minor role as a hair metal rocker victim in Jason goes Manhattan)
Dragon Ball Wikia credits Ian Corlett to the role of Cui but I’m not sure how reliable that is since the Ocean era never credited actors to specific roles and the wikia had a strong Funimation in-house cast bias.
Justin Cook is actually one of the few voices I feel got worse in Kai. In Z he at least seems to be trying to emulate Jason Gray-Stanford slow menacing growl but not really well, in Kai he’s just hamming it up and not in a fun way
Whoa hold the phone she was in F13 part 8? That's one of my favorite films in the series(yes really) yet somehow I never knew that, that is so cool.
The only other live-action VA I can think of is Peter Mayhew(Chewbacca)who played Susha in the GT special.
"Why run away from something you're not afraid of?" - Goku
Planetnamek wrote: Thu Aug 20, 2020 12:19 amThe only other live-action VA I can think of is Peter Mayhew(Chewbacca)who played Susha in the GT special.
James Marsters (of Buffy fame) also played Zamasu. He was Piccolo in the live action movie that shall not be named, but luckily he got his redemption in this series when he got cast in Super.
Jason Douglas is known for The Walking Dead too.
Do you have any info about international non-English broadcasts about the Dragon Ball anime or manga translations/editions? Please message me. Researching for a future book with Dragon Ball scholar Derek Padula
Planetnamek wrote: Thu Aug 20, 2020 12:19 amThe only other live-action VA I can think of is Peter Mayhew(Chewbacca)who played Susha in the GT special.
James Marsters (of Buffy fame) also played Zamasu. He was Piccolo in the live action movie that shall not be named, but luckily he got his redemption in this series when he got cast in Super.
Jason Douglas is known for The Walking Dead too.
Dameon Clarke is in a bunch of stuff you've seen over the years like 24, Castle, and Supernatural.
The biggest truths aren't original. The truth is ketchup. It's Jim Belushi. Its job isn't to blow our minds. It's to be within reach.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take - Wayne Gretzky" - Michael Scott
Happiness is climate, not weather.
Planetnamek wrote: Thu Aug 20, 2020 12:19 am
Whoa hold the phone she was in F13 part 8? That's one of my favorite films in the series(yes really) yet somehow I never knew that, that is so cool.
KBABZ suggested I put some of the trivia you guys have shared in the OP... I am not making that trivia section any longer than it already is!!
KBABZ's initial draft of the trivia was also broken into three sections; one covering DB 151-153, one covering Z production changeover stuff, and one covering Z 1-2. I decided these section breakups didn't exactly make the sheer size of the trivia section any less intimidating, and much like DB/Z itself, I see it all as just one big block of trivia anyway, so... Maybe KBABZ and I will argue about that in the next few days and I'll fix it, but we'll see.
Anyway, I'm way behind (watching episode 140 as I type this), but I honestly quite like the Wedding Dress arc, to my recollection of it. 149-151 are only okay, but I recall 152-153 being a great pair of episodes, and a fitting end to the pre-Gohan era (particularly, it's nice that Goku and Chichi get to meet Grandpa Gohan just before their wedding, and they get to go on a little adventure together too). Z episodes 1 and 2 are, of course, awesome. Matches Malone calls it the best start to an arc there is, but to me, that crown still goes firmly on the Piccolo Daimao arc. Still, the Saiyan arc opens very well.
Even though it does spoil the revelation that Goku has a son, the scenes with Goku and Chichi at home are nice, though I always found the Gohan in the woods filler very tiresome; I certainly don't miss it in the Saban or Kai versions (though my exposure to Kai is somewhat limited; I've always preferred Z). Likewise, I don't miss Roshi's attempt at poking Bulma's boobs in the Saban and edited Kai versions of this part. In fact, I think it makes the episodes better... Actually, in general, I think both Saban and Kai (either edited or otherwise) have a better version of the contents of these first two episodes than the uncut Z version.
Regarding Ultimate Uncut vs Saban Z... It's worth noting that Funi added narration to the beginning of Z episode 1, since Saban Z didn't contain that scene, so Funi did have to, of course, render the dialogue not covered by Saban's version... And, in a perfect show of Funi's ways not significantly changing over the course of 1999 to 2005, they bloat that narration out to be a deluge of added shit that attempts to make the beginning feel more "epic" and "edgy" than it originally was, and it contrasts against the Japanese score very hard when you watch it that way.
There's also some pretty serious errors in the "Uncut"-ification of the Saban dialogue, but the most egregious example is one I'll point out in a few weeks when we actually get to the week containing it.
To be honest, if you ask me, the Ultimate Uncut dub is one of the worst things Funimation ever did. The acting is significantly better than their work on DB/Z/GT, but unlike in Kai, it's still not good. The dialogue still has almost all the problems the Saban dub had (with only the most surface-level things fixed), including the newly-added Ultimate Uncut dialogue, and the whole thing is still rife with censorship despite being "Ultimate Uncut". On the whole, due to the poor acting, and the lack of any improvement on dialogue or anything, and the fact that a lot of the really dull filler was left in... Personally, I still think the better way to experience Z in dubbed form, if Kai isn't an option, is to just watch the Saban dub. It's unfaithful to the original, yes, but that's just a fact of dubbed Dragon Ball; Saban's version is still the better viewing experience, by a country mile (I have similar feelings in regards to the Westwood dub being superior to the corresponding in-house Funi dub, but I guess we'll get there later). I just wish MangaUK would get their shit together and release the original dubs on DVD someday; I'd never complain about home video again if I had that. (... Okay, I'd still complain, but I'd at least finally have a version I could unreservedly enjoy right out of the box!)
The point of Dragon Ball is to enjoy it. Never lose sight of that.
I think it’s the fact that the Texas cast is being made to mostly say the same dialog as the Vancouver cast that makes the weaker voice acting (in my opinion) stand out more
It’s like when Piccolo says “Goku, you sly dog” when Goku grabs Raditz and puts him in a lock. It’s...a really dumb line but man does Mcneil sell the line. Sabat? Not so much.
And I’ve think I’ve mentioned before but I do think the 96 dub meets the fast pacing of Kai and the better development of Z in the middle which makes it a bit more enjoyable than both. The Power Rangers score and lolol censorship does bring it down a tad (I dislike the Johnson score even more but the Kikuchi score being an option for the 2005 dub renders it obsolete)
Sometimes I wonder if they intentionally cast Chiba for Raditz as he's the first villain in Z and he voiced Pilaf, the very first villain of the OG DB show. I always love when Chiba plays comedic characters, but his role as Raditz does show that he can do serious and menacing roles too. I have to say though, I was always more surprised that Tessho Genda played Shu, since I know him for being Toguro, the Japanese voice of Optimus Prime and being the go-to-guy for Arnold Schwarzenegger in Japanese dubs of his films.
"It was deemed to be too awesome." - Scott McNeil on Dragon Ball Kai not being aired yet in Canada.
So I hadn’t seen the beginning (or really any of Z) since the first time I watched it 9-10 years ago. I’m not a good critic, but I really enjoyed rewatching these. Having gotten much more experience with kids since then, I am liking Gohan a lot more than I did before. I’m not going to be on the same schedule as this thread series but I’ll try to check in.
I feel like a lot of love was put into the first five episodes. The new branding breathed some life into the series. The new music is exceptional. I especially like the tracks associated with Raditz.
That's one of my favorite films in the series(yes really) yet somehow I never knew that, that is so cool.
