The Glind timeline

[Yuji]

I'm a bit confused about the chronology of the Glind species.

• Glinds are born in demon realm 2, as ordinary demon citizens, under the rule of the Supreme Demon King;
• Majin Rymus creates the 18 Universes at request of the Supreme Demon King, and chooses the Glinds as the overseers of these realms;
• Presumably, non-Kaioshin Glinds are still born on their planet and live there as normal demons?
• Presumably, once a Kaioshin dies or is nearing retirement, a Glind from their home world is chosen to replace him? By Rymus?
• At some point, Nahare/Shin was chosen as the U7 Kaioshin of the East;
• 5 million years ago, Marba creates Boo and Bibidi uses him to wipe out Glind trees;
• Boo escapes to Universe 7 and kills most Kaioshin

Have I got it right? It's a bit confusing to me how these events interconnect, namely when and how Shin became the Kaioshin.

[Omori]

Glinds are born in demon realm 2, as ordinary demon citizens, under the rule of the Supreme Demon King;
Majin Rymus creates the 18 Universes at request of the Supreme Demon King, and chooses the Glinds as the overseers of these realms;
Presumably, non-Kaioshin Glinds are still born on their planet and live there as normal demons?
Presumably, once a Kaioshin dies or is nearing retirement, a Glind from their home world is chosen to replace him? By Rymus?

Yes, that's my understanding as well. Out of all the Glinds presumably 18 were selected as Kaioshin - possibly many 100M years time ago.
And then more generations followed. And free travel was of course possible.

At some point, Nahare/Shin was chosen as the U7 Kaioshin of the East;
5 million years ago, Marba creates Boo and Bibidi uses him to wipe out Glind trees;
Boo escapes to Universe 7 and kills most Kaioshin

Here's it's where things get tricky. We know that 10 Mio years ago the South and DaiKaioshin were already there, but we don't know why U7 had such a system while other universes may only have a single one.
5 Mio years ago Shin was already a Kaioshin and the events with Buu in the Demon Realm and U7 likely happened then.

However, when you look at the dialogues in Daima all these events appear more recent:
- Neva said he hasn't seen a Namekian in a few 10000 years
- Neva created the barrier between the realms, but the barrier was already there when Shin was young
- Neva knows Katatz, who was among the last Namekians the leave the realm
- Shin was still in the Demon Realm when Abura limited the use of Warp-sama, he also knows Gomah
- Shin und Degesu haven't met in a 1000 years

So generally many things are referred to as "long ago" or 1000-10000 years. Even though the events of Buu (5 Mil.) and Moro (10 Mil.) were mentioned in the DBS manga, I wonder whether these numbers were ignored in Daima

They took a lot of lore references from the "Super Exciting Guide" from 2009, where Toriyama mentioned a Shinjin lifespan of 75000 years.
https://www.kanzenshuu.com/translations ... agon-ball/

I wonder whether this number was taken as a base rather than the official timeline

[Xeogran]

And why Gods of Destruction are connected to Glinds when they seemingly have nothing to do with demon world themselves?
Maybe there's a ritual ceremony that connects them to their universe's respective Supreme Kais when they're officially appointed as GoDs. So if Vegeta were to become a GoD for example, his life would be tied to Shin's too.

[Yuji]

Glinds are born in demon realm 2, as ordinary demon citizens, under the rule of the Supreme Demon King;
Majin Rymus creates the 18 Universes at request of the Supreme Demon King, and chooses the Glinds as the overseers of these realms;
Presumably, non-Kaioshin Glinds are still born on their planet and live there as normal demons?
Presumably, once a Kaioshin dies or is nearing retirement, a Glind from their home world is chosen to replace him? By Rymus?

Yes, that's my understanding as well. Out of all the Glinds presumably 18 were selected as Kaioshin - possibly many 100M years time ago.
And then more generations followed. And free travel was of course possible.

At some point, Nahare/Shin was chosen as the U7 Kaioshin of the East;
5 million years ago, Marba creates Boo and Bibidi uses him to wipe out Glind trees;
Boo escapes to Universe 7 and kills most Kaioshin

Here's it's where things get tricky. We know that 10 Mio years ago the South and DaiKaioshin were already there, but we don't know why U7 had such a system while other universes may only have a single one.
5 Mio years ago Shin was already a Kaioshin and the events with Buu in the Demon Realm and U7 likely happened then.

However, when you look at the dialogues in Daima all these events appear more recent:
- Neva said he hasn't seen a Namekian in a few 10000 years
- Neva created the barrier between the realms, but the barrier was already there when Shin was young
- Neva knows Katatz, who was among the last Namekians the leave the realm
- Shin was still in the Demon Realm when Abura limited the use of Warp-sama, he also knows Gomah
- Shin und Degesu haven't met in a 1000 years

So generally many things are referred to as "long ago" or 1000-10000 years. Even though the events of Buu (5 Mil.) and Moro (10 Mil.) were mentioned in the DBS manga, I wonder whether these numbers were ignored in Daima

They took a lot of lore references from the "Super Exciting Guide" from 2009, where Toriyama mentioned a Shinjin lifespan of 75000 years.
https://www.kanzenshuu.com/translations ... agon-ball/

I wonder whether this number was taken as a base rather than the official timeline

Yes, I've also caught that the timeline in Daima seems to stretch back to a few thousand years ago at most, outside of the very creation of the multiverse. Because everything is focused around Neva this almost necessarily narrows the chronology down to a few thousand years ago at most. I hope they put out an extensive chronology one day.

Was the 5M date mark ever mentioned in the Boo arc or was it a Daizenshuu figure?

[Thani]

Glinds are born in demon realm 2, as ordinary demon citizens, under the rule of the Supreme Demon King;
Majin Rymus creates the 18 Universes at request of the Supreme Demon King, and chooses the Glinds as the overseers of these realms;
Presumably, non-Kaioshin Glinds are still born on their planet and live there as normal demons?
Presumably, once a Kaioshin dies or is nearing retirement, a Glind from their home world is chosen to replace him? By Rymus?

Yes, that's my understanding as well. Out of all the Glinds presumably 18 were selected as Kaioshin - possibly many 100M years time ago.
And then more generations followed. And free travel was of course possible.

At some point, Nahare/Shin was chosen as the U7 Kaioshin of the East;
5 million years ago, Marba creates Boo and Bibidi uses him to wipe out Glind trees;
Boo escapes to Universe 7 and kills most Kaioshin

Here's it's where things get tricky. We know that 10 Mio years ago the South and DaiKaioshin were already there, but we don't know why U7 had such a system while other universes may only have a single one.
5 Mio years ago Shin was already a Kaioshin and the events with Buu in the Demon Realm and U7 likely happened then.

However, when you look at the dialogues in Daima all these events appear more recent:
- Neva said he hasn't seen a Namekian in a few 10000 years
- Neva created the barrier between the realms, but the barrier was already there when Shin was young
- Neva knows Katatz, who was among the last Namekians the leave the realm
- Shin was still in the Demon Realm when Abura limited the use of Warp-sama, he also knows Gomah
- Shin und Degesu haven't met in a 1000 years

So generally many things are referred to as "long ago" or 1000-10000 years. Even though the events of Buu (5 Mil.) and Moro (10 Mil.) were mentioned in the DBS manga, I wonder whether these numbers were ignored in Daima

They took a lot of lore references from the "Super Exciting Guide" from 2009, where Toriyama mentioned a Shinjin lifespan of 75000 years.
https://www.kanzenshuu.com/translations ... agon-ball/

I wonder whether this number was taken as a base rather than the official timeline

Yes, I've also caught that the timeline in Daima seems to stretch back to a few thousand years ago at most, outside of the very creation of the multiverse. Because everything is focused around Neva this almost necessarily narrows the chronology down to a few thousand years ago at most. I hope they put out an extensive chronology one day.

Was the 5M date mark ever mentioned in the Boo arc or was it a Daizenshuu figure?

I don't know exactly, but, in my translation of chapter 445 of the manga, when Kaioshin explains of Buu and Bibidi, he uses the phrase "long ago, when humanity was first beginning to walk upright", meaning that Buu and Bibidi (and the Kaioshin by extension, including himself) predate human history. That WOULD align with the 5M mark.

[Yuji]

Yes, that's my understanding as well. Out of all the Glinds presumably 18 were selected as Kaioshin - possibly many 100M years time ago.
And then more generations followed. And free travel was of course possible.


Here's it's where things get tricky. We know that 10 Mio years ago the South and DaiKaioshin were already there, but we don't know why U7 had such a system while other universes may only have a single one.
5 Mio years ago Shin was already a Kaioshin and the events with Buu in the Demon Realm and U7 likely happened then.

However, when you look at the dialogues in Daima all these events appear more recent:
- Neva said he hasn't seen a Namekian in a few 10000 years
- Neva created the barrier between the realms, but the barrier was already there when Shin was young
- Neva knows Katatz, who was among the last Namekians the leave the realm
- Shin was still in the Demon Realm when Abura limited the use of Warp-sama, he also knows Gomah
- Shin und Degesu haven't met in a 1000 years

So generally many things are referred to as "long ago" or 1000-10000 years. Even though the events of Buu (5 Mil.) and Moro (10 Mil.) were mentioned in the DBS manga, I wonder whether these numbers were ignored in Daima

They took a lot of lore references from the "Super Exciting Guide" from 2009, where Toriyama mentioned a Shinjin lifespan of 75000 years.
https://www.kanzenshuu.com/translations ... agon-ball/

I wonder whether this number was taken as a base rather than the official timeline

Yes, I've also caught that the timeline in Daima seems to stretch back to a few thousand years ago at most, outside of the very creation of the multiverse. Because everything is focused around Neva this almost necessarily narrows the chronology down to a few thousand years ago at most. I hope they put out an extensive chronology one day.

Was the 5M date mark ever mentioned in the Boo arc or was it a Daizenshuu figure?

I don't know exactly, but, in my translation of chapter 445 of the manga, when Kaioshin explains of Buu and Bibidi, he uses the phrase "long ago, when humanity was first beginning to walk upright", meaning that Buu and Bibidi (and the Kaioshin by extension, including himself) predate human history. That WOULD align with the 5M mark.

I think that's all that's stated in the manga, and the Daizenshuu then came up with the 5M year figure, and then the DBS manga corroborated it in the Moro arc.

But I guess it is possible that in the DB universe, life evolves incredibly fast and humans first began to walk upright just 10 thousand years ago or something. That would align more with Daima's timeline and the SEG 75k year lifespan for Glinds.

[Omori]

And why Gods of Destruction are connected to Glinds when they seemingly have nothing to do with demon world themselves?
Maybe there's a ritual ceremony that connects them to their universe's respective Supreme Kais when they're officially appointed as GoDs. So if Vegeta were to become a GoD for example, his life would be tied to Shin's too.

I feel like that's something Rymus, Zeno or the Grand Priest do once a new Kaioshin or GoD is appointed.
It also sounds like GoD are normal mortals initially but later may get an extended lifespan.

I think that's all that's stated in the manga, and the Daizenshuu then came up with the 5M year figure, and then the DBS manga corroborated it in the Moro arc.
But I guess it is possible that in the DB universe, life evolves incredibly fast and humans first began to walk upright just 10 thousand years ago or something. That would align more with Daima's timeline and the SEG 75k year lifespan for Glinds.

Yes, the original manga only mentioned "when Earth's humans became able to walk upright" as the timeframe for Buu's attack in the Kaioshin Realm. The 5 million figure seemingly comes from the real world as that's something scientists think - and was used for the Daizenshuu timeline.
Also with Old Kaioshin being the one of 15 generations ago, they dated the time he was sealed in the Z Sword for 75 million years ago (5*15).
But still, not sure if Toriyama ever confirmed these numbers himself... on the other hand he checked Toyotaro's DBS chapters such Ch43, where the numbers are mentioned in the story.

Not sure if we get any more numbers in the remaining four Daima episodes, but I hope somebody will put a proper timeline together.
A proper guidebook with all the new stuff including Super would be nice. Hopefully there's a good continue editor who has the whole picture.

Or Toyotaro will make it work at some point. Be it through a Daima adaption or a future arc...

[Koitsukai]

A guidebook is so due by now, we had two new series and 4 movies, all of them expanding the world and lore of DB, retconning things, explaining past events. I'm surprised no unofficial guidebooks have been published so far, not even about the DBS anime, like the Manga Legendario or those french guidebooks people keep bringing up.

Back in the 90s, there were plenty of those going around, I can't believe there hasn't been an updated on neither of those. Maybe a DBS guidebook would be just adding new characters and universes without even looking back much at DB and Z, but Daima is going over the origins of the dragonverse, it's a must we get guidebooks now.

[Zephyr]

I kinda understand why there's been no new guidebook. Part of the their appeal is that they're so comprehensive. But since 2013 it's basically been an onslaught of new stuff to catalog, be it from films, TV episodes, manga chapters, or interviews, with much of it contradicting each other (eg: why is Kaio's planet small? where do Kaioshin come from and how long do they live?). By the time you manage to sort everything out, some new stuff drops that throws it all out of whack. I think DB needs to end end again and stay dormant for a little while before all of the new material can be made sense of together in one big picture.

[Yuji]

I kinda understand why there's been no new guidebook. Part of the their appeal is that they're so comprehensive. But since 2013 it's basically been an onslaught of new stuff to catalog, be it from films, TV episodes, manga chapters, or interviews, with much of it contradicting each other (eg: why is Kaio's planet small? where do Kaioshin come from and how long do they live?). By the time you manage to sort everything out, some new stuff drops that throws it all out of whack. I think DB needs to end end again and stay dormant for a little while before all of the new material can be made sense of together in one big picture.

No reason Toei/Shueisha can't just produce those guidebooks now that they have full creative control.

[Zephyr]

I kinda understand why there's been no new guidebook. Part of the their appeal is that they're so comprehensive. But since 2013 it's basically been an onslaught of new stuff to catalog, be it from films, TV episodes, manga chapters, or interviews, with much of it contradicting each other (eg: why is Kaio's planet small? where do Kaioshin come from and how long do they live?). By the time you manage to sort everything out, some new stuff drops that throws it all out of whack. I think DB needs to end end again and stay dormant for a little while before all of the new material can be made sense of together in one big picture.

No reason Toei/Shueisha can't just produce those guidebooks now that they have full creative control.

I assume you mean now that Toriyama isn't around anymore to add more new stuff, which is true. I'd still expect it to be a while for people to sort all of the details and big picture framing of everything before one sees the light of day, though. Not to mention the rights dispute, if that's still ongoing.

[Omori]

Yeah, in the recent years they rather do a few extra pages in VJUMP than a complete guide, and focussing on manga content of course.
In the past there had been guidebooks focussing on manga, and also some on the anime. Wonder what's the best going forward.

So yeah it would be nice to get a proper one with timelines and everything - and hopefully Toyotaro has some influence since he seems quite knowledgeable lore-wise.

[Zephyr]

Attempting to reconcile Herms' History of Ever thread and Daima's lore, here's how I'm making sense of it. I'm just ignoring statements from interviews and guidebooks about "Shinjin" lifespans and culture and all that, since that is the main stuff Daima is explicitly setting out to contradict anyway.

100+ Million Years Ago:
Rhymus creating the universes and appointing Glinds as Kaioshin has to precede anything that takes place in the universes or involves Kaioshin. In the manga, it is stated that the only person to cross the Serpent Road (to Universe 7's North Kaio's planet) in the last 100 million years is Enma, meaning that Enma, the Kaio, the Serpent Road, and Universe 7 must have existed 100 million years ago. Thus, Rhymus must have created the universes and begun appointing Glinds as Kaioshin over 100 million years ago.

75+ Million Years Ago:
The Daizenshuu date Majin Boo's assault on the Kaioshin to 5 million years ago because of the "humans walking upright" line in the manga. Since Shin/Nahare was there, he must be at least 5 million years old, meaning that a single Kaioshin generation is at least 5 million years long. Meaning that Universe 7's East Kaioshin from 15 generations prior to Shin/Nahare must be from at least 75 million years ago. Thus, events from his life, such as fusing with a witch using the Potara, lecturing the Namekians about Dragon Ball use, and being sealed in the Z-Sword by Beerus, must have all happened 75 or more million years ago.

10 Million Years Ago:
Universe 7's Grand and South Kaioshin imprison Moro, per the DBS manga.

5+ Million Years Ago:
The following things needn't have necessarily preceded anything mentioned thus far, but either must have or likely would have happened before Majin Boo's attack on Universe 7's Kaioshin.

Episode 10 of Daima establishes that the Nameks were treated like slaves by the Demon Kings. Episode 11 establishes that Neva knew Katatz, suggesting Katatz was born in the Demon Realm during this time. Episode 14 establishes that the chaos caused by people from Demon Worlds 1 and 3 prompted many Nameks to begin moving to the universes (presumably including Katatz), and also eventually prompted Neva to put up shields of light separating the three Demon Worlds from each other. Warp-sama was then instituted to re-enable travel between the three Demon Worlds.

Episode 10 establishes that while Shin/Nahare still lived in the Demon Realm, Dabra's father, Abra, was paranoid about attacks from the universes, and so put limits on Warp-sama's use. This prompted many Glinds to move to the universes, after which time Shin/Nahare became Universe 7's East Kaioshin. Shin/Nahare was still a relatively new/young Kaioshin when Boo attacked Universe 7, so this shouldn't have been too long before 5 million years ago.

Episode 8 establishes that Bobbidi had Marba create Majin Boo, who then rampaged through the Demon Realm, prompting many Glinds to move to the universes. This is one of two reasons given for the Glind leaving the Demon Realm, and I don't think anything requires that this one occur after the other one, but I think it makes for a more tidy chronology if it does. There's also nothing necessitating that Boo's Demon Realm rampage precedes his assault on Universe 7's Kaioshin, but again, tidier chronology.

5 Million Years Ago:
Again, the Daizenshuu date Majin Boo's assault on Universe 7's five Kaioshin to 5 million years ago because of the "humans walking upright" line in the manga. Two of the Kaioshin are killed, and two are absorbed, leaving Shin/Nahare as Universe 7's sole Kaioshin.

---

So:

100+ MYA - Rhymus creates the universes, and selects certain Glinds to oversee them as Kaioshin
100 MYA - Enma, the Kaio, and the Serpent Road are established by now in Universe 7's afterlife
75+ MYA - Elder Kaioshin's era
10 MYA - Universe 7's Grand Kaioshin imprisons Moro
5+ MYA - In an age where the Demon Kings treat Nameks like slaves, Katatz is born and meets Neva
5+ MYA - Many Nameks move to the universes (Katatz among them), and Neva creates shields of light separating the Demon Worlds
5+ MYA - Warp-sama is placed to re-enable travel between the Demon Worlds
5+ MYA - Dabra's father, Abra, enacts limits on Warp-sama, prompting many Glind to move to the universes
5+ MYA - Shin/Nahare becomes Universe 7's East Kaioshin
5+ MYA - Bibbidi has Marba create Majin Boo, whose rampage in the Demon Realm prompts many more Glind to move to the universes
5 MYA - Bibbidi and Majin Boo attack Universe 7's Kaioshin, only Shin/Nahare survives

[Omori]

That's probably how it needs to be put together, but the most conflicting thing there would be the Namekian lifespan. I can see Neva being exceptionally old, but Katatz as well?

Back to the Glinds:
In DBS it's also established that the Daikaioshin was Shin's master.
So maybe it was like this: South Kaioshin was a student of the Daikaioshin as well while fighting Moro and when the remaining Glinds left the Demon Realm later on, the Daikaioshin accepted them on his planet and awarded all of them Kaioshin status (East, West, North, South) as a special solution since many Glinds had to escape.

Now in EP17 Dr. Arinsu sounded like she last saw Shin when he was small (which would imply more than 5 million years), but Degesu seemingly met Shin just 1000 years ago - so outside the Demon Realm then?

Interestingly, the 2009 interview first sounded like the 75000 year lifespan only affects the Kaio, but the 2014 one includes Kaioshin here as well: viewtopic.php?t=32719
Maybe Toriyama wasn't onboard with interpretation of "5 million years" - even though it is in Moro arc.
Or somebody else in the Daima production wasn't aware of the timeline.
Anyway, maybe it can be fixed at some point in a way you suggested (even many dialogues make it tricky)

[Yuji]

I think the Daizenshuu is what's being contradicted. Daima's lore is following more in-line with the SEG, and Namekians' lifespan and Degesu's line seem to imply a smaller timespan. The only hiccup is the Moro arc following the Daizenshuu time-frame, but that can be retconned or Daima and Super are truly different continuities.

???: Rymus created the multiverse
1M+ years ago: Beerus seals the Elder Kaioshin
10-50k years ago: Boo, the Glind and Namekian exodus, Nahare's birth, humans only evolved to stand up now hilariously (or Shin was just stupidly ignorant)

[Zephyr]

I don't remember all the dialog bits that complicate things. If these dialog bits are simply the "oh, I haven't seen you/a Namek in XXXX years!" type stuff, I think that can easily be smoothed over by us simply not knowing who has traveled where in the past. Warp-sama exists and allows travel to and from the Demon Realm, and anyone could have used it for that purpose for any reason over the unseen years.

As for Namekian lifespans, what source is actually being contradicted by Katatz being over 5 million years old? I'll admit I certainly never would have imagined Namekians to be able to live that long, but I don't know if it's simply conventional fandom wisdom being contradicted, some lines in the manga, the Daizenshuu, the Super Exciting Guide, or something else entirely.

[Yuji]

I don't remember all the dialog bits that complicate things. If these dialog bits are simply the "oh, I haven't seen you/a Namek in XXXX years!" type stuff, I think that can easily be smoothed over by us simply not knowing who has traveled where in the past. Warp-sama exists and allows travel to and from the Demon Realm, and anyone could have used it for that purpose for any reason over the unseen years.

As for Namekian lifespans, what source is actually being contradicted by Katatz being over 5 million years old? I'll admit I certainly never would have imagined Namekians to be able to live that long, but I don't know if it's simply conventional fandom wisdom being contradicted, some lines in the manga, the Daizenshuu, the Super Exciting Guide, or something else entirely.

Daizenshuu 7 dates the Namekian cataclysm to Age 261, about 500 years before the events of the story. I went and checked the manga and Toriyama only describes the event as "long ago," though I may have missed any concrete numbers since I just skimmed through it. If we take the Daizenshuu 7 date, this means God and Daimao are over 500 years old and already nearing death by old age. The Grand Elder who repopulated Namek who died days into the Namek arc should also be at this age range.

I guess you can argue this was millenia ago in Toriyama's vision, or that Namekians before the cataclysm lived way longer for some reason, or Neva and Katats specifically are special, but I don't think Toriyama probably envisioned the Nameks as this ancient and long-lasting. If I had to choose between Toriyama envisioning the Namekians as a race that lives millions of years, or Toriyama retconning Boo's creation to several thousand years ago, I'd pick the latter.

Starting to think Boo's creation was just around 1000 years ago following the average Namekian lifespan and Degesu's line.

[Koitsukai]

As for Namekian lifespans, what source is actually being contradicted by Katatz being over 5 million years old? I'll admit I certainly never would have imagined Namekians to be able to live that long, but I don't know if it's simply conventional fandom wisdom being contradicted, some lines in the manga, the Daizenshuu, the Super Exciting Guide, or something else entirely.

The KBABZ and Robo Trivia Thread (Errata episode 4) has some details about the namekian timeline.

-Kaioshin's unfamiliarity with the Demon Realm Dragon Balls implies that they were put into place less than a thousand years prior to Daima (since that's when the Glind departed the Second Demon World).
-Kaioshin being unfamiliar with the Demon Realm Dragon Balls, combined with Glorio saying they're the original set, puts a more definitive timeframe on how old the Namekian Dragon Balls are. This is because Kaioshin only left the Second Demon World "over a thousand years ago" (as Arinsu says in Ep 17), meaning the Namekians left the Demon Realm before Neva created the Dragon Balls, after which the other Namekians would leave, settle on Namek, and create their own set.
-This also means that the Nameless Namekian was sent away from Namek, split into Kami and Piccolo Daimao, and created Earth's Dragon Balls inside this timeframe.
-Glorio states that "as far as he knows" nobody has ever had their wish granted by the Demon Realm Dragon Balls (which is also upheld by Panzy saying the same thing in Ep 5). However in Ep 11, Neva states that "bad people learned of them and began using them for foolish purposes". Considering that the Demon Realm Dragon Balls are less than a thousand years old (less than the average lifespan of a Majin), it's surprising that none of them know about what Neva says in Episode 11.

[Zephyr]

-Kaioshin's unfamiliarity with the Demon Realm Dragon Balls implies that they were put into place less than a thousand years prior to Daima (since that's when the Glind departed the Second Demon World).
-Kaioshin being unfamiliar with the Demon Realm Dragon Balls, combined with Glorio saying they're the original set, puts a more definitive timeframe on how old the Namekian Dragon Balls are. This is because Kaioshin only left the Second Demon World "over a thousand years ago" (as Arinsu says in Ep 17), meaning the Namekians left the Demon Realm before Neva created the Dragon Balls, after which the other Namekians would leave, settle on Namek, and create their own set.

Okay so Daima does give explicit dates for these exoduses? Or is synchronizing "I haven't seen X in Y years" to these exoduses a matter of extrapolation and inference being done in the trivia thread? I don't remember 100%, but I don't think it's the former, because I know it would have caused much more controversy than it already has (and this thread might not even have been made). If it's the latter, see again my point about people being able to travel to and from the Demon Realm being able to account for the "I haven't seen X in Y years" lines.

Daizenshuu 7 dates the Namekian cataclysm to Age 261, about 500 years before the events of the story. I went and checked the manga and Toriyama only describes the event as "long ago," though I may have missed any concrete numbers since I just skimmed through it. If we take the Daizenshuu 7 date, this means God and Daimao are over 500 years old and already nearing death by old age. The Grand Elder who repopulated Namek who died days into the Namek arc should also be at this age range.

I guess you can argue this was millenia ago in Toriyama's vision, or that Namekians before the cataclysm lived way longer for some reason, or Neva and Katats specifically are special, but I don't think Toriyama probably envisioned the Nameks as this ancient and long-lasting. If I had to choose between Toriyama envisioning the Namekians as a race that lives millions of years, or Toriyama retconning Boo's creation to several thousand years ago, I'd pick the latter.

Starting to think Boo's creation was just around 1000 years ago following the average Namekian lifespan and Degesu's line.

Okay now this is a really good point. I'd neglected to account for the older Namekians we see. I could handwave away God's age as "oh, he was already pretty old when the cataclysm happened", but setting aside he escaped Namek as a child, that wouldn't account for Muri, who looks visibly old, and the Grand Elder was the lone survivor of the cataclysm, so Muri would have been born after it. On the other hand, I don't think anything was said about God or Daimao being close to death by old age? I might be wrong though, feel free to correct me. As far as I remember the Grand Elder is the only Namekian who reached, and/or was suggested to be near, natural old-age death.

I think it's easy enough to say that they have quite long natural lifespans, but they spend the vast bulk of it looking all wrinkly. That is obviously headcanon, and I doubt that was the implication Toriyama intended to convey with all of this new lore. At the same time, Boo's rampage is inextricably tied (via Kaioshin's line in the original manga) to human chronology on Earth, and I don't think Toriyama remembered that. I sincerely doubt "DB humans began walking on two legs a few thousand years ago" was an intended implication of the lore, any more than "Namekians live for millions of years".

Obviously a work of fiction, and one as patently silly as DB, has no obligation to adhere to real world science or history. But Nameks are at least a made up race of beings. So, greatly expanding their lifespan is way more preferable to me than astronomically shrinking human chronology on Earth. That despite the myriad intended resemblances to real life human biology, history, and civilization, DB humans diverged from DB chimpanzees more recently than the irl advent of writing just raises way more questions than it answers, and it's not the kind of pill I'd happily swallow.

And, like, yeah, obviously, the Dragon World is incredibly different from our real world universe and Earth; dinosaurs are still around, and aliens are absolutely real and have visited Earth on numerous occasions, which could maybe account for humanity rapidly developing from bipedalism to flying cars in a few thousand years. But it all just stinks of Young Earth Creationism and "Ancient Aliens" crap to me, and I'll easily go with "Namekians live for several millions of years" over it any day, in lieu of explicit dates completely taking that interpretive option off the table.

[Yuji]

Well, in Super, we see the results of a thousand years in a civilization. It's enough for planet Barbari to start developing religion and language. Maybe Toriyama was unaware of how long evolution takes.

Or maybe Shin himself was unaware of it. Which is par for the course.

Either way, unless the Moro arc is amended, the original timeline should stand unless Daima gives more concrete numbers. I just don't think that was the intention and obviously Toyotaro's fan-mind conflicts with Toriyama's chronology.