Producer confirms Daima was made for GT fans

[FortuneSSJ]

While making Goku a kid was seen as making the series accessible to a wider audience, it was Toriyama’s idea to turn the entire main cast into kids too

I knew it. No way Toei would go that far on their own. What a stupid idea.

[JulieYBM]

While making Goku a kid was seen as making the series accessible to a wider audience, it was Toriyama’s idea to turn the entire main cast into kids too

I knew it. No way Toei would go that far on their own. What a stupid idea.

Why is it a stupid idea? If anything, Dragon Ball Daima didn't take the concept far enough by actually exploring the difficulties that the characters face beyond a few scenes early on. There's material to mine there.

[AliTheZombie13]

Why is it a stupid idea?

Because it betrays the entire philosophy of Dragon Ball of always improving one-self or something.
Don't agree with that viewpoint in particular, but this fandom has been very loud why they hate the idea of nerfing the characters.

[Retan]

Wow Japan, or maybe just the db room must be as out of ideas as Hollywood is to make a new series a tribute to GT of all crap.

[JulieYBM]

Why is it a stupid idea?

Because it betrays the entire philosophy of Dragon Ball of always improving one-self or something.
Don't agree with that viewpoint in particular, but this fandom has been very loud why they hate the idea of nerfing the characters.

That's a stupid way to look at the idea. To be forced back by a will stronger than one's own into a form that represents one's 'beginning' (childhood) allows for a story to reflect on the past, present and future for a character. People change with time, so having that becme evident in the characters and then reflected back at them now that they are in these miniature forms is a really good opportunity for giving the characters new challenges to overcome.

[BernardoCairo]

Akio Iyoku is a very smart guy. He knows the trends. GT is not as popular as Z or Super, but it has its fans. Trying to tap into that market was a smart move. But I don't think he meant that they wanted to "copy" GT or even remake it. They wanted to capture that feeling of having an adventure with the "kid" Goku (which GT, in turn, was trying to replicate from the original manga/series). That's why the focus is more on the world than on Goku himself.
I personally would have made a series with the real kid Goku (maybe between the Red Ribbon Saga and the 22nd Tenkaichi Budokai). However, I know that this could have been very confusing for general audiences (plus, elements like Vegeta, Piccolo, and the Super Saiyajin would have been lost). Ultimately, explaining where Dabura and Babidi came from is a nice loose end that the manga left behind.

[AliTheZombie13]

I don't know if I agree that it's a loose end.
Just saying "The enemy came from the 7th Circle of Hell" works good enough for the story to work.
Seeing the 7th Circle of Hell would be, in theory, neat. But the Demon Realm is just so zZzZzZz...

[Basaku]

Why is it a stupid idea?

Because it betrays the entire philosophy of Dragon Ball of always improving one-self or something.
Don't agree with that viewpoint in particular, but this fandom has been very loud why they hate the idea of nerfing the characters.

That's a stupid way to look at the idea. To be forced back by a will stronger than one's own into a form that represents one's 'beginning' (childhood) allows for a story to reflect on the past, present and future for a character. People change with time, so having that becme evident in the characters and then reflected back at them now that they are in these miniature forms is a really good opportunity for giving the characters new challenges to overcome.

It does allow all that, but there's none of in Daima actually. There are no mental challenges here, they just learn how to shot ki blast as fast again as before. A nothingburger character developement.

Turning the entire adult cast into kids was pointless when there was a full cast of actual kid characters to take on this journey and have them develop in a true meaningful ways, even is solely thx to the fact of how much of blank slates they still are. Goten, Trunks, Marron, Dende. Nothing more was needed, the oppurtunity couldn't present itself better.

Instead the core GT idea that already didn't work once got used again and once again not in the way you describe it should've been.

Sure I'm loving all the new lore and I'm hyped for a new form, I like new flashy as anyone. But it doesn't change Daima's big flaws... it's another DB show that's a gallery of BIG, obvious, glaring missed oppurtunities and storytelling chances that won't repeat themselves and won't reap the benefits for the franchise in future

[JulieYBM]

Because it betrays the entire philosophy of Dragon Ball of always improving one-self or something.
Don't agree with that viewpoint in particular, but this fandom has been very loud why they hate the idea of nerfing the characters.

That's a stupid way to look at the idea. To be forced back by a will stronger than one's own into a form that represents one's 'beginning' (childhood) allows for a story to reflect on the past, present and future for a character. People change with time, so having that becme evident in the characters and then reflected back at them now that they are in these miniature forms is a really good opportunity for giving the characters new challenges to overcome.

It does allow all that, but there's none of in Daima actually.

I'm aware. It's what we've all been criticizing for nearly five months. The issue isn't the idea, the issue is the execution—that was the point of my post.

[Basaku]

I'm aware. It's what we've all been criticizing for nearly five months. The issue isn't the idea, the issue is the execution—that was the point of my post.

I understand, was just adding my thoughts on how they could counter that, which is mainly not doing it at all if they can't write it properly. Having real blank slate kids would've been well, simply easier to naturally develop/write/grow through the show than what you're describing. It's a much trickier thing to pull off for older/established characters that already went through all their initial growth and developement

[Chuquita]

I agree that there's a lot of unrealized potential in having these characters struggle with being forced into their child bodies. Like Super had that one episode where Goku couldn't access his full power after the U6 tournament; this could've been that but done in a variety of different ways that play to each of the main characters involved and imo would've been very interesting, but it would've clashed with what Iyoku said in the interview about why Daima is what it is, unfortunately.

[ZombieVito]

What a dumb idea.

Oh well, at least they made a series better than GT even if it's by a little so there's that.

[Basaku]

I agree that there's a lot of unrealized potential in having these characters struggle with being forced into their child bodies. Like Super had that one episode where Goku couldn't access his full power after the U6 tournament; this could've been that but done in a variety of different ways that play to each of the main characters involved and imo would've been very interesting, but it would've clashed with what Iyoku said in the interview about why Daima is what it is, unfortunately.

True but even with taking into account what Iyoku said, there's no such thing as "nostalgia for weak execution of a concept from the past". If anything, nostalgia blinds and helps forget if a certain concept was not well executed. So... they really should've tried to do better with character developement if they already decided to do GT again basically. Esp since even with all the nostalgia for the 90s, GT still had iffy reputation at best compared to Z, Japan fandom included

[JulieYBM]

What a dumb idea.

Oh well, at least they made a series better than GT even if it's by a little so there's that.

What idea is dumb? To whom does this supposedly 'dumb' idea belong?

[Zephyr]

I think the "good ideas, bad execution" talking point isn't unreasonable by any means, but it's also kind of saying nothing. A sufficiently gifted storyteller could mine gold from any premise. That doesn't mean every premise or "idea" holds the same inherent appeal to any given person. I can give reasons why I think "they all turned into kids!" is an extremely unappealing premise to me, and "but there's potential there!" doesn't really do much to win me over. There's potential everywhere, for those with eyes to see.

[JulieYBM]

I think the "good ideas, bad execution" talking point isn't unreasonable by any means, but it's also kind of saying nothing. A sufficiently gifted storyteller could mine gold from any premise. That doesn't mean every premise or "idea" holds the same inherent appeal to any given person. I can give reasons why I think "they all turned into kids!" is an extremely unappealing premise to me, and "but there's potential there!" doesn't really do much to win me over. There's potential everywhere, for those with eyes to see.

I'm not taking issue with whether an idea actually sound appealing on an individual level, but the broader spectrum literally deeming an idea as objectively bad.

[Zephyr]

I think the "good ideas, bad execution" talking point isn't unreasonable by any means, but it's also kind of saying nothing. A sufficiently gifted storyteller could mine gold from any premise. That doesn't mean every premise or "idea" holds the same inherent appeal to any given person. I can give reasons why I think "they all turned into kids!" is an extremely unappealing premise to me, and "but there's potential there!" doesn't really do much to win me over. There's potential everywhere, for those with eyes to see.

I'm not taking issue with whether an idea actually sound appealing on an individual level, but the broader spectrum literally deeming an idea as objectively bad.

Yeah that's fair, I can't agree with the "objectively bad" angle.

[Chuquita]

I agree that there's a lot of unrealized potential in having these characters struggle with being forced into their child bodies. Like Super had that one episode where Goku couldn't access his full power after the U6 tournament; this could've been that but done in a variety of different ways that play to each of the main characters involved and imo would've been very interesting, but it would've clashed with what Iyoku said in the interview about why Daima is what it is, unfortunately.

True but even with taking into account what Iyoku said, there's no such thing as "nostalgia for weak execution of a concept from the past". If anything, nostalgia blinds and helps forget if a certain concept was not well executed. So... they really should've tried to do better with character developement if they already decided to do GT again basically. Esp since even with all the nostalgia for the 90s, GT still had iffy reputation at best compared to Z, Japan fandom included

I agree. I always disliked the "Goku gets turned into a kid" aspect of GT, and making everyone in Daima a kid is just as bad, imo. The whole mini thing was an immediate disappointment to me when Daima was first revealed. In order to make the concept interesting to me it would have to get deeper, character and story wise, than I feel those in charge would want in db atm.

I agree with people having pointed out if they wanted to have child leads, Trunks, Goten, and Marron were right there.

I think having late 30's Goku, 20's Piccolo and early 40's Vegeta facing new adversaries is fun. Child protagonists are a dime a dozen and it feels insincere to shoe horn adults into a child mold (and then do close to nothing with the concept).

The only thing Daima has going for it for me is it's not DBHeroes; that I actually dropped, even with it having the cast as adults, it was boring.

At least they're running out of pre-existing db stuff to mine for nostalgia. (I hope).

[GhostEmperorX]

The idea itself is the kind of thing you do for an episode or two anyway, which is why there's rarely (if any) series that do this and run with it for the whole duration like DB entries have.

[Basaku]

At least they're running out of pre-existing db stuff to mine for nostalgia. (I hope).

this was literally the first thing that came to my mind after reading that Iyoku interview xD I mean, there's till Cooler and maybe Janemba but other than that? Nobody cares about Bojack so they shouldn't even bother attempting to bring him back

I wonder if running out of things to mine from the past will actually lead to taking new storytelling directions/ideas/risks tho... seeing how utterly safe and strategic Iyoku is about all this (and blunt lol) makes me doubt...