Daima to Super Connection

[Super Murjin]

Hey everyone,

I know many people are probably sick of the Daima to Super Connection discussions.

I found some articles coming straight from Akio Iyoku regarding this topic.

Here are links to the articles where he discusses this a bit more.

https://animehunch.com/is-dragon-ball-d ... rms-it-is/

https://mantan-web.jp/article/20250210d ... 4000c.html

Thoughts?

[ZombieVito]

There's no connection.

They are different continuities.

[Vegeta th3 4th]

Daima is in no way, shape, or form connected to Super. Daima pretty much destroyed all claims that Super was just as important as the original manga, and that all future stories had to line up with it. As far as Toriyama was concerned, Super was no different than GT and Z's old movies in the sense that it can easily be ignored if need be. I've said it many times and I'll say it many times more: the original manga is the only thing that truly counts; everything else is on equal footing below it. The original anime's filler, the old movies, GT, and Super are all of equal importance to the companies involved with the franchise. Daima however may be different. Considering it was the original author's final project before his tragic passing, I wouldn't be surprised if its importance is placed above everything else I mentioned, but still below the original manga, so basically:

The original manga
Daima
DB & Z filler, old movies, GT, & Super

[Issei189]

Whatever the case. Let's just see where they go from Daima. Keep in mind that Daima was a one time thing. The branding will not continue. SS4 Goku will still show up in another project.

[The Tori-bot]

I found some articles coming straight from Akio Iyoku regarding this topic.

If the topic is “Daima's connection to Super”, then no, you didn’t.

Thoughts?

Can you provide the relevant quotes that discuss anything to do with continuity? Or do I just keep lamenting that people don’t actually read the articles they post anymore?

[Muffin Man]

Daima however may be different. Considering it was the original author's final project before his tragic passing, I wouldn't be surprised if its importance is placed above everything else I mentioned

I know for me personally, Daima is the only thing post Buu saga that I plan on acknowledging as part of the main continuity. Works great as an epilogue that sort of brings things full circle in a fun way, and it's low key and low stakes enough and takes place soon enough after the Buu saga that it doesn't feel weird going from Daima to EoZ (unlike going from Super to EoZ, which is a head trip and I'm left wondering why Goku still cares so much about fighting Uub). Plus, Goku's character portrayal just feels right. Like, not flanderized the way Super Goku was.

[Marco Polo]

But how do we explain this?

[Vegeta th3 4th]

I know for me personally, Daima is the only thing post Buu saga that I plan on acknowledging as part of the main continuity.

From the great production value to the new fan favorites Kuu and Duu, and my personal favorite: Ssj3 Vegeta, I can tell you for a fact that I'll be re-watching Daima anytime I re-watch the original DB & Z. You couldn't pay me to allow Super to abuse my eyes again.

Works great as an epilogue that sort of brings things full circle in a fun way.

If Toriyama continued the manga for a bit longer back in the day, this is definitely the kind of story we would've gotten. After 30 years, the Buu arc's demon realm plot thread has finally been resolved. Going from the defeat of Kid Buu to the end of Z always felt rushed, this series makes that transition far more smoother.

Plus, Goku's character portrayal just feels right. Like, not flanderized the way Super Goku was.

Super pretty mush shit the bed with every character, not just Goku, although he got the worst of it unfortunately. It was so refreshing seeing a Goku who's not completely brain dead.

But how do we explain this?

Spoiler:

What about it ? they reused character designs they already had to explain something. Super's latest chapter just included statues of characters from the other world tournament arc. It doesn't mean anything besides being a nice Easter egg for fans.

[Yuji]

There's a Toriyama illustration for Battle of Gods with Shin, rather than Kibitoshin. He probably intended Shin to defuse from Kibito much earlier than intended. I wouldn't actually doubt it if he just wrote Shin in all his notes for Super and the anime staff eventually realized he did mean Shin and not Kibitoshin, and tried to quickly shoehorn in a justification for their defusion.

It's possible that in Toriyama's mind all these stories connected without paying attention to the details, which are filled in by Toei and Toyotaro. "Goku uses his full power against Beerus" by Toriyama is translated into "Goku uses SS3" by Toei. I'm sure Daima in Toriyama's mind led to some vague concept of BoG, then RoF and so on.

[Vegeta th3 4th]

It's possible that in Toriyama's mind all these stories connected without paying attention to the details, which are filled in by Toei and Toyotaro. "Goku uses his full power against Beerus" by Toriyama is translated into "Goku uses SS3" by Toei. I'm sure Daima in Toriyama's mind led to some vague concept of BoG, then RoF and so on.

It's been said by reliable sources (mostly Geekdom) that Toriyama was checking the scripts personally, unlike with Super where he left that to Toei's writers. If Toriyama wanted Daima to line up with Super, it would've. Goku having Ssj4 here makes it impossible to connect to Battle of Gods, unless there's a sequel series where he loses the form.

[Yuji]

It's possible that in Toriyama's mind all these stories connected without paying attention to the details, which are filled in by Toei and Toyotaro. "Goku uses his full power against Beerus" by Toriyama is translated into "Goku uses SS3" by Toei. I'm sure Daima in Toriyama's mind led to some vague concept of BoG, then RoF and so on.

It's been said by reliable sources (mostly Geekdom) that Toriyama was checking the scripts personally, unlike with Super where he left that to Toei's writers. If Toriyama wanted Daima to line up with Super, it would've. Goku having Ssj4 here makes it impossible to connect to Battle of Gods, unless there's a sequel series where he loses the form.

I don't think Toriyama really cared for particular details such as the form Goku used against the antagonist before he gets yet another form. What I'm saying is that in Toriyama's "canon" aka his story of Dragon Ball in his head, Goku probably did in fact use SS4 against Beerus and then still needed SSG, just as in Toriyama's canon Shin and Kibito have been separate since the Boo arc ending.

Daima shares too many details with Super stuff for me to think Toriyama completely erased it from his mind. Not just the big stuff like the cosmology but even little details such as Bulma's obsession with cosmetics.

[Helios518]

It's possible that in Toriyama's mind all these stories connected without paying attention to the details, which are filled in by Toei and Toyotaro. "Goku uses his full power against Beerus" by Toriyama is translated into "Goku uses SS3" by Toei. I'm sure Daima in Toriyama's mind led to some vague concept of BoG, then RoF and so on.

It's been said by reliable sources (mostly Geekdom) that Toriyama was checking the scripts personally, unlike with Super where he left that to Toei's writers. If Toriyama wanted Daima to line up with Super, it would've. Goku having Ssj4 here makes it impossible to connect to Battle of Gods, unless there's a sequel series where he loses the form.

Toriyama doesn't actually care about the particulars. As seen when Toyotaro was constantly surprised that after Toriyama read the DBS manga drafts, he would only correct jokes or maybe art.

Tbh it wouldn't even make it impossible to connect to BoG. SS4 not showing up for BoG is as consistent as Goku and Vegeta not using SSG until Anime's ToP/Broly movie or Manga's Champa/Future Trunks arc respectively. Honestly, SSG makes less sense of returning because the initial explanation of the form not returning was because they absorbed the form in their base but that got retconned.

That said, I don't really have a strong opinion of Super and Daima sharing the same continuity or not, I just think Dragon Ball will just do whatever they want despite any huge inconsistencies.

[Vegeta th3 4th]

Daima shares too many details with Super stuff for me to think Toriyama completely erased it from his mind.

I don't think it was a matter of erasing it, but rather doing something in isolation due to how long Super got over the years.

[Muffin Man]

Daima shares too many details with Super stuff for me to think Toriyama completely erased it from his mind. Not just the big stuff like the cosmology but even little details such as Bulma's obsession with cosmetics.

But the cosmology doesn't really line up either, as he replaced Zeno with Rymus as the highest authority in the multiverse.

(And I gotta say, I much prefer Rymus)

[Vegeta th3 4th]

But the cosmology doesn't really line up either, as he replaced Zeno with Rymus as the highest authority in the multiverse.

I thought it would be revealed that Rymus is related somehow to Zeno, but it never happened.

[Omori]

I guess at the moment it's best to just wait and see. For possible interviews, how the next story (be it movie or manga) relates to it, if videogames like the Daima DLC give extra information etc.

For now we got a few conflicts, not just with DBS, also with the general DB timeline as whole regarding past events.
Can it solved? If there's a will. There's three more years until BoG.
Is there the intention for it to be a different continuity? Possible.
Iyoku vs Shueisha may also plays a role. It's all really hard to tell at this point and it can be either way.

[ZeroNeonix]

Is Daima part of the same continuity as Super? Yes. Does that make sense? No. Do they care? No. lol

Just gotta go with the flow, at this point. It's not all going to make sense. There are contradictions everywhere, but they're all loosely threaded together, like super hero comics.

This isn't even anything new. The End of Z doesn't make sense with what Super gives us, but they're both canon.

[emperior]

Daima shares too many details with Super stuff for me to think Toriyama completely erased it from his mind. Not just the big stuff like the cosmology but even little details such as Bulma's obsession with cosmetics.

But the cosmology doesn't really line up either, as he replaced Zeno with Rymus as the highest authority in the multiverse.

(And I gotta say, I much prefer Rymus)

Yes. As for Daima’s lore, there don’t seem to be Gods of Destruction either, nor are there Angels and Super Dragon Balls.

[Muffin Man]

Daima shares too many details with Super stuff for me to think Toriyama completely erased it from his mind. Not just the big stuff like the cosmology but even little details such as Bulma's obsession with cosmetics.

But the cosmology doesn't really line up either, as he replaced Zeno with Rymus as the highest authority in the multiverse.

(And I gotta say, I much prefer Rymus)

Yes. As for Daima’s lore, there don’t seem to be Gods of Destruction either, nor are there Angels and Super Dragon Balls.

Which I much prefer, personally.

I feel like it's worth mentioning that, while AT did end up heavily revising the story of Battle of Gods, the original idea of having a story about a God of Destruction was not his.

https://www.kanzenshuu.com/translations ... -toriyama/

With what stance did you approach your work?

To be honest, I was busy as it was with just my own job, so I didn’t intend to get involved with the animation. The rough script I read in order to check it over had an interesting-sounding theme of a God of Destruction, but the contents were a little dark, so while I was in the midst of giving advice on how to improve it, I got carried away and ended up writing almost everything.

So all this time in Super he's been building off of this core idea of these powerful Gods that wasn't actually his idea in the first place. So it makes sense that it's not something he would automatically retain as a core element of his vision when working on an unrelated project.

[Vegeta th3 4th]

As for Daima’s lore, there don’t seem to be Gods of Destruction either, nor are there Angels and Super Dragon Balls.

Great observation; I didn't think about that, but you're right. I never minded the destroyers; I just never liked how they were constantly a moving goalpost. Things however did get crazy with the angels and Zeno basically being untouchable.