GreatSaiyaman123 wrote: Wed Feb 26, 2025 10:52 am
Sora Saiyan wrote: Wed Feb 26, 2025 4:34 am
That isn't a fair argument. We have feats from Gokus fight against a lesser Gomah, and he was no longer strong enough to provide a stimulus for adaptation even when Gomah was at this level. It only changed when the crew bought him a little time to finish charging up his power ready for the kamehameha. We can't say he could've made giant Gomah adapt akin to SSJ Vegetas showing when he couldn't even manage it against a much weaker big Gomah, even though he had ample opportunity. This is, ofcourse, not including the first adaptation he forces Gomah to have upon initially achieving SSJ4.
The only time the Tertian oculus has forced the adaptation and recovery sequence, prior to the adults appearing, is when an opponent or opponents have displayed a level of power above his, to the point where he's been overwhelmed by said power. This fits all tertian oculus adaptation and recovery events against adult Vegeta, too
I guess it looks something like this.
SSJ3 Vegeta > Exhausted SSJ3 Vegeta >= Giant Gomah (post adaptations) >=< SSJ Vegeta > Giant Gomah > SSJ4 Mini Goku >= Big Gomah (2nd power up) > Big Gomah (1st power up) > Big Gomah > SSJ3 mini Goku > SSJ mini Vegeta
I think you don't understand how the fight works. If a fighter is losing and then lands a punch, it doesn't mean he got stronger; it just means he's not so weak that he can't fight back. You're nitpicking each exchange as its own fight instead of adding them up to see the fight as a whole.
The big picture is that SSJ4 Goku was a solid step ahead of Big Gomah, but Big Gomah could still fight back. Gomah only powers up when he's getting an extended beatdown, and when he does so the eye goes berserk for a second. That's what happened vs SSJ3 Goku and when he became giant. Being punched once doesn't trigger a power up.
I'm not not picking any individual exchange, but weighing it up with the context provided. I'm unsure who you think I'm applying this to. Is it SSJ4 against big Gomah? Because if so I have explained my view on this. We see Gomah try to fight SSJ4 Goku upon him initially achieving the form. Here he gets beaten by him pretty comfortably, but then Gomah's eye kicks in and he adapts, now displaying a level of power where he can now contend with SSJ4 Goku, yes, he's on the back foot slightly overall, but winning some exchanges and being his equal in others. No longer is he comfortably on the losing end. From a pure power perspective there isn't much of a gap, infact an arguement can be made that Goku only outclasses him in battle IQ at this point. As I've mentioned, it takes Goku charging up for a full power KHH to force Gomah to adapt once again.
If what you're refering to is SSJ4 Goku Vs Giant Gomah, then this one doesn't really make any sense. Gomah blasts Goku away once he first achieved the form, and Goku is the one who attempts to attack Gomah, only for Gomah respond and they clash fists, Goku is promptly sent flying through some rock formations. You'll also notice that before Gomah puts Goku in that weird ball, he's actually lay out on the floor after the clash and momentarily unresponsive. That's after just 1 clash bear in mind.
Also I'm quite literally looking at the fight as a whole, and how each blow, dodge, clash etc represent the levels of the combatants relative to each other, it is ofcourse very complicated as Gomah adapts to fighters stronger than him pretty regularly, so you then need to isolate that portion of the fight and speak specifically about that portion, as he's a bit of a moving goal post.
Gomah does not only power up due to extended beat downs either, as you'll see against SSJ4 Mini Goku, a single powerful gut punch causes the eye to kick in, as before that he actually held him off and attempted to put some space between them before receiving said punch. The eye kicks in and causes his body to glow, and he recovers (as mirrored in the instances with SSJ-3 Vegeta). The second time against SSJ4 Goku a single Kamehameha caused it, after he almost defeated Goku with the punch he landed. The first time his eye does something against the Tamagami and Goku it pretty much activates an anti grief attack, and then hits them with a laser. Out of all of the power ups, this one is the most different, but I'll still call it a power up as the eye doing something and him recovering seems to be the one consistent display we have. This is also the only time the eye doesn't power him up from a single powerful attack (until SSJ3 Vegeta)
Against SSJ Vegeta he's is kicked in the gut and through some rock formations the Tertian oculus activates (eye and body glow) and his head snaps back towards Vegeta and he then exclaims "wh-what?!" This is essentially what happens in all the instances against SSJ3 Vegeta, which all mirror the eye activation and body glow that occur in Gomah's first power up against SSJ4 Mini Goku. However, in that instance he closed the gap between him and Goku, which admittedly was pretty large (he was getting beat bad, but he could still engage in very brief skirmishes and dodge some blows) but not quite like the gap shown between Giant Gomah and SSJ3 Vegeta (true stomp, Giant Gomah was nothing but an unresponsive punching bag), so the eye couldn't jump to this level of power, even with an additional 3 activations.
Side note: there's a chance Gomah has hit his limit on being able to draw any more power from the eye, and he is only recovering when he is hit with a blow/s which exceeds his durability.
