Non-thread-worthy discussions

[MasenkoHA]

I never understood why in ROF Toriyama added the line for Freeza, that he predicted to reach 1,300,000 power level in four months. Toriyama gave up on power level so why mention it. Plus on Namek Freeza second form has a power level of over 1,000,000 which is stated in the manga. Freeza 1st form was 530,000 power level, which is stated in the manga.

In DBS Anime of ROF Freeza shoot at Kuririn and Bulma. It is strange Vegeta orders Goten and Trunks to leave, but doesn't order the others to leave who are in the way.

Toriyama didn’t give up on power levels they were just a quirk unique to the Freeza Force. Once they were no longer around it made no sense to bring them up. It’s perfectly rational for Freeza to mention them in Resurrection F because, again, that was his and his army’s whole thing and their equivalent to sensing chi.


Also I would just assume the 1,300,000 estimation was referring to his suppressed based form, since that was the form he was in when referring to that number

[super michael]

I never understood why in ROF Toriyama added the line for Freeza, that he predicted to reach 1,300,000 power level in four months. Toriyama gave up on power level so why mention it. Plus on Namek Freeza second form has a power level of over 1,000,000 which is stated in the manga. Freeza 1st form was 530,000 power level, which is stated in the manga.

In DBS Anime of ROF Freeza shoot at Kuririn and Bulma. It is strange Vegeta orders Goten and Trunks to leave, but doesn't order the others to leave who are in the way.

Toriyama didn’t give up on power levels they were just a quirk unique to the Freeza Force. Once they were no longer around it made no sense to bring them up. It’s perfectly rational for Freeza to mention them in Resurrection F because, again, that was his and his army’s whole thing and their equivalent to sensing chi.


Also I would just assume the 1,300,000 estimation was referring to his suppressed based form, since that was the form he was in when referring to that number

Even if Freeza was thinking of making his 1st form 1,300,000, that is only a 770,000 increase from his 530,000. That doesn't triple his own power level. C18 was able to beat SSJ1 Vegeta like nothing, while Freeza 100% couldn't beat the new inexperienced SSJ1 Goku who was way weaker.

Goku was able to make his SSJ stronger than Semi-Perfect Cell, who has the power of C17 + Cell.

[Koitsukai]

It's odd, the line, but it's not something one cannot work around.

We don't know exactly how his suppression forms work, so perhaps doubling the suppressed form means an exponential growth for the final form instead of a linear growth.
Maybe with 500k he can supress 120M and with 1,300M he can supress a whooping 1B or whatever. This should be obvious since he was confident on taking on a Goku who had defeated Buu and fought Beerus, and he was aware of this.

Clearly, Freeza underrated himself because he ended up having a 1st form stronger than a more than rusty SS Gohan, and a Final Form that fought a base form infused with God power, way above Z.
Maybe, with his initial assessment, his final form would've been around SS3 Goku or SS3 Gotenks. Of course, talking about the movieverse, because in the other media, his FF was retconned to be on par with SS.

[TheRed259]

I think Toyotaro overdid it with Gohan's hair here. I don't think they're supposed to be that long.

Spoiler:

[Zephyr]

Go big or go home.

[Yuji]

Absolutely ridiculous. Love it.

[JulieYBM]

Gohan's arm and the round spot on Gokuu's scalp look atrocious lol

[JulieYBM]

I just rewatched Dragon Ball Super Episode #90. It's such an awesome, culminating moment for Gohan and Gokuu's relationship, especially given the focus it's had in the first part of this arc. It's such a shame that this episode had such a terrible production and looks like dogshit, because for one of the most exciting moments in the franchise, it absolutely should look as good as Dragon Ball Super Broly or Dragon Ball Daima Episodes #17-20. Gohan facing down Gokuu, now a grown man, and wanting to face him man-to-man at their best is such a cathartic moment.

[ZeroNeonix]

I was watching this video recently, and something came to me that I hadn't realized before. The reason Super never reaches the heights of Z, in my opinion, is because it is too self-referential. Seeing this guy go through the list, and how each character was handled, made me realize how little Super pushes characters forward.

For example: Something that a lot of people hate about Gohan is how he keeps having the same arc over and over. He lets himself go, gets weak, and trouble appears. Gohan realizes he has a responsibility as defender of Earth to keep up with his training. He trains for five minutes and immediately catches up. This happens THREE times in Super. Except in Resurrection F, Gohan didn't get that part where he trains for five minutes.

Why do they keep repeating this same story arc? Simple. He did it in Z. In the Buu arc, he falls behind in his training, he realizes he has a responsibility to defend the Earth, and he gets a power up with little effort. Gohan is not the only one, either.

Why is Vegeta back as Goku's rival? Because he was Goku's rival in Z. Why is Future Trunks' future in ruins again? Because it was in Z. Goten and Trunks are the same as they were in Z, too small and only having fusion as a gimmick. Broly, Super Saiyan 4 (Daima, but still), Frieza coming back from the dead (again), all popular things they pulled from Z and/or GT.

The series started with Battle of Gods (which I know was technically Z, but it jump-started Super as a series), but after that, they've had virtually no original ideas. Almost everything in Super is done for nostalgia.

[BootyCheeksJohnson]

The "collector's edition" Blu-ray for Daima pisses me off. It's trying to mirror the JP release by using the same special box/art, and comes with some art cards and stickers, but doesn't include the official art book. I'd think if they could only include one thing it would be that. I feel that collector's would be far more interested in owning a fully translated book with behind the scenes tidbits and original character designs for the show over some foil cards that will get looked at for 2 seconds and thrown back in the box.
The art book that was included in the Manga UK collector's edition of Super is the goal they should've strived for. Especially since it's $75 for pre-order on Crunchyroll. At that price you're basically just paying extra for some worthless cards, a sticker, and a big outer box to carry everything.

[Noah]

Am I the only one who feels like DBGT’s soundtrack just fits the Christmas/end-of-year vibe? The openings, endings, even the BGM music have this nostalgic, slightly bittersweet feeling that really matches this time of year.

I can’t fully explain why, but it always hits harder for me around December.

[MasenkoHA]

So here’s something kind of interesting

Michael B.Jordan who is a big fan of anime including Dragon Ball Z cited anime as an influence on Creed III. The cross punch was mentioned specifically as a reference to Dragon Ball Z. But here’s the thing. The cross punch that is everywhere in battle themed anime originated in the 70’s anime “Tomorrow Joe” an anime about…boxing. So a Hollywood movie about boxing took cues from non-boxing anime that took its cues from a boxing anime. Just neat how things can come full circle

[JulieYBM]

So here’s something kind of interesting

Michael B.Jordan who is a big fan of anime including Dragon Ball Z cited anime as an influence on Creed III. The cross punch was mentioned specifically as a reference to Dragon Ball Z. But here’s the thing. The cross punch that is everywhere in battle themed anime originated in the 70’s anime “Tomorrow Joe” an anime about…boxing. So a Hollywood movie about boxing took cues from non-boxing anime that took its cues from a boxing anime. Just neat how things can come full circle

He also probably got the idea from Hajime no Ippo, a boxing series that I believe he has mentioned liking before.

[Kenji]

I was watching this video recently, and something came to me that I hadn't realized before. The reason Super never reaches the heights of Z, in my opinion, is because it is too self-referential. Seeing this guy go through the list, and how each character was handled, made me realize how little Super pushes characters forward.

That's precisely my biggest issue with Super (and by extension Daima).

Virtually all the messages the story tries to tell its audience have either already been told before and in a much better way, or are simply not good enough to stand out on their own. To make matters worse, some arcs require the characters to forget the very same messages they have learned through the course of the entire series in order to learn them again, making the story feel like it's not advancing and stuck in a repetitive cycle of taking two steps back and landing in the exact same place where it started.

That being said, Super was made in order to bring in a new generation of fans, not us old farts who grew up in the 90's and know the entire franchise in the back of our heads. Our experiences are going to be vastly different than that of a child who had Super as their first contact with Dragon Ball, so maybe through that lens, I can excuse Super's shortcomings and lack of novelty. That being said, if repeating what's already been said before was always the plan, I would've rather they have made a remake and not a sequel.

[super michael]

I was watching this video recently, and something came to me that I hadn't realized before. The reason Super never reaches the heights of Z, in my opinion, is because it is too self-referential. Seeing this guy go through the list, and how each character was handled, made me realize how little Super pushes characters forward.

That's precisely my biggest issue with Super (and by extension Daima).

Virtually all the messages the story tries to tell its audience have either already been told before and in a much better way, or are simply not good enough to stand out on their own. To make matters worse, some arcs require the characters to forget the very same messages they have learned through the course of the entire series in order to learn them again, making the story feel like it's not advancing and stuck in a repetitive cycle of taking two steps back and landing in the exact same place where it started.

That being said, Super was made in order to bring in a new generation of fans, not us old farts who grew up in the 90's and know the entire franchise in the back of our heads. Our experiences are going to be vastly different than that of a child who had Super as their first contact with Dragon Ball, so maybe through that lens, I can excuse Super's shortcomings and lack of novelty. That being said, if repeating what's already been said before was always the plan, I would've rather they have made a remake and not a sequel.

True only those that watched Dragon Ball, Dragon Ball Z and read the manga would not like the writing in DBS. Those that read Dragon Ball would know that Goku knows how to meditate and is a great sensei, he literally made Gohan into the strongest warrior on earth in less than 1 year. In the 23rd Martial Art Tournament Goku could tell who was in a disguise and knew when a God was lying to him.

In DBS everyone acts surprise when Goku says smart things, like when he was right about Zamasu and Goku Black. They never acted like that in DB/DBZ when Goku was correct. They want everyone to believe Goku is a dumb character. In DBS Super Hero they took it to another level, now he is dumb when it comes to training.
Lets not forget that Goku by being a pest to Whis, Whis almost didn't train Goku. This is something that never happened in Dragon Ball. Goku was extremely dumb and immature.

In DBS Chi Chi believes Goten should train only if there are bad guys, she is acting like DBZ episode 1. Even with everything that happened to them and their future family, still nothing she thinks in a dumb way. When a bad guy appears, it would be too late to take action. It was too late when Future C17 and C18 killed the Z fighters and it was too late for Future Chi Chi and Future Goten to do anything against Goku Black.


DB/DBZ the characters progress, while in DBS the characters lose their progress for no reason just to repeat the story.

[jjgp1112]

I pretty much have no proof of this and in fact things that Scott Morgan has said evidence the opposite but I swear in later years the Faulconer team were taking some cues from the Japanese soundtrack. Piccolo's Super Namekian theme can be easily rearranged to sound closer to his signature Japanese music and the Mystic Gohan theme sounds a lot like Spirit Vs Spirit in a higher key:

https://youtu.be/fL6UkwkR5l8?si=wujQ2LpCdc-WxFwT

(And Abridged shows how seamlessly Gohan Angers can blend with Spirit vs Spirit. Now granted, Gohan Angers is rooted in his fight theme that debuted in the Garlic Jr. Arc but still lol)

Of course, this probably isn't taking cues from Kikuchi so much as the fact that music theory is basically a process of reheating Beethoven and Mozart's nachos lmao

[ABED]

With serialization becoming the default, I've actually grown to enjoy filler (or what people think is filler) more over the years. Plot is just the way we get to the story. It's not the end all be all.

[Yellow Flower King]

With serialization becoming the default, I've actually grown to enjoy filler (or what people think is filler) more over the years. Plot is just the way we get to the story. It's not the end all be all.

Its going to become rarer and rarer as time goes on, sadly enough. I still want a re animated adaptation of the manga, but I am glad the first adaptation has "filler" in it.

[ABED]

With serialization becoming the default, I've actually grown to enjoy filler (or what people think is filler) more over the years. Plot is just the way we get to the story. It's not the end all be all.

Its going to become rarer and rarer as time goes on, sadly enough. I still want a re animated adaptation of the manga, but I am glad the first adaptation has "filler" in it.

funnily enough, as TV shows become more and more like films cut up into "episodes", there's going to be more actual padding/filler. So many times I've watched a docuseries or a limited series and thought "this could've been a 90-minute movie."

[JulieYBM]

It's funny, because anime in recent years have been experimenting with longer runtimes and I feel like they've managed to do so quite successfully because they're still using staff with television experience. Marvel's recent series have used film-side production crew who don't know how to follow the standard television drama format and it winds up making their episodes really structurally lopsided.