What if Dragon Ball was never dubbed in English?

[kiarasuraru]

Internet discussion about Dragon Ball would improve a millionfold thanks to all the countless dub fanfiction not poisoning the well anymore.
The likes that insult Nozawa and worse because they cannot stand "granny Goku" also wouldn't exist creating a net positive for the world too. Nor would the people defending the dub fanfiction like if their life depended on it for no reason but childhood nostalgia to the point they degrade and insult the original work, the franchise as a whole and even the entire medium.
Honestly, the more I think about it the more positives than negatives I can see which says a lot in many many ways.

[super michael]

If Dragon Ball never got dubbed in English, I would have still ended up watching it on TV in another language. So for me it wouldn't have changed at all.
If the anime never got dubbed in English, that would change everything about the game. The game might use the Japanese version music and voice for the game, since that would mean the English version doesn't exist.

I watched Saint Seiya: Knights of the Zodiac that is on Netflix, I was wondering is it worth it to watch the original Saint Seiya? I never watched the original.

[kiarasuraru]

I watched Saint Seiya: Knights of the Zodiac that is on Netflix, I was wondering is it worth it to watch the original Saint Seiya? I never watched the original.

The anime is pretty well done, really nice art, very good music, but it's also an eighties shonen anime so it'll have the usual caveats of padding and stock footage spam and filler of varying quality. As long as you don't mind/can stand those things you shouldn't have many issues. It's also relatively short too.
And well, there's also the issue that its format can feel very "outdated" or "simple" in comparison to modern shounen. Can be a con, can be a plus, depending on the person.

[PowerPhantom245]

I'm curious if Sean Schemmel and Christopher Sabat would have been famous, had it not for English dub.
Their voice acting career literally launched with Dragon Ball Z and has gotten many roles for other anime since.

[Kid Buu]

Since you're in the UK do you remember what channel Batman TAS aired on? Google says CBBC but I could swear it was on Cartoon Netowrk. I remember Batman of the Future (Batman Beyond) and Justice League were 100% on CN.

I was quite late to the party with Batman TAS, and didn't see it in full until the DVDs years later.

I definitely remember seeing the occasional episode on Cartoon Network though. It was around the time my family first got Sky TV. I also remember watching some of Superman TAS on there too. Unfortunately they were taken off the lineup before I could get into them properly.

I'm pretty sure Batman was also on CBBC though. I vaguely remember seeing a very small amount of it before my family got Sky. I actually used to have a VHS recording of the episode were Clayface falls off the cliff at the end, although I forget which channel it was.

I watched Mask of The Phantasm and Return of the Joker when they aired on Cartoon Network. I'd already seen Beyond at that point, but seeing those movies really made me interested in watching the OG series properly. For whatever reason TAS never seemed to get any reruns, probably because it was an older show at that point.

Yeah, Batman never really seemed to get reruns the way Spider-Man did — that one always felt like it was on TV. I grew up with Batman Beyond and the Return of the Joker film. Funny enough, it wasn’t until Netflix that I finally watched Batman: The Animated Series last year. That kicked off a whole journey through The New Batman Adventures, Superman: The Animated Series, Justice League, and Justice League Unlimited. I’m literally on the final episode of JLU now, so once I finish that, the whole run will be complete.

If you haven’t seen Superman: The Animated Series all the way through, I’d definitely recommend it. I was reluctant at first because I never found Superman as compelling as Batman, but on a whim I gave it a shot and ended up enjoying it just as much as Batman: TAS. It helps that Justice League and JLU feel almost like a sequel to Superman, especially with how much his rogues gallery shapes Unlimited.

[90sDBZ]

Yeah, Batman never really seemed to get reruns the way Spider-Man did — that one always felt like it was on TV. I grew up with Batman Beyond and the Return of the Joker film. Funny enough, it wasn’t until Netflix that I finally watched Batman: The Animated Series last year. That kicked off a whole journey through The New Batman Adventures, Superman: The Animated Series, Justice League, and Justice League Unlimited. I’m literally on the final episode of JLU now, so once I finish that, the whole run will be complete.

If you haven’t seen Superman: The Animated Series all the way through, I’d definitely recommend it. I was reluctant at first because I never found Superman as compelling as Batman, but on a whim I gave it a shot and ended up enjoying it just as much as Batman: TAS. It helps that Justice League and JLU feel almost like a sequel to Superman, especially with how much his rogues gallery shapes Unlimited.

I actually bought Superman TAS on Blu-ray a couple of years back. I really do need to get round to watching it. I'm actually watching Smallville for the first time now that it's on Netflix funnily enough.

I remember watching bits and pieces of Justice League/Unlimited, although never watched it from start to finish. That's another I'll have to make time for. I definitely remember seeing the Epilogue episode.

[Kid Buu]

Yeah, Batman never really seemed to get reruns the way Spider-Man did — that one always felt like it was on TV. I grew up with Batman Beyond and the Return of the Joker film. Funny enough, it wasn’t until Netflix that I finally watched Batman: The Animated Series last year. That kicked off a whole journey through The New Batman Adventures, Superman: The Animated Series, Justice League, and Justice League Unlimited. I’m literally on the final episode of JLU now, so once I finish that, the whole run will be complete.

If you haven’t seen Superman: The Animated Series all the way through, I’d definitely recommend it. I was reluctant at first because I never found Superman as compelling as Batman, but on a whim I gave it a shot and ended up enjoying it just as much as Batman: TAS. It helps that Justice League and JLU feel almost like a sequel to Superman, especially with how much his rogues gallery shapes Unlimited.

I actually bought Superman TAS on Blu-ray a couple of years back. I really do need to get round to watching it. I'm actually watching Smallville for the first time now that it's on Netflix funnily enough.

I remember watching bits and pieces of Justice League/Unlimited, although never watched it from start to finish. That's another I'll have to make time for. I definitely remember seeing the Epilogue episode.

I definitely recommend watching the entire DCAU run if you’re a fan of Batman: The Animated Series. Funny enough, Epilogue is one episode I feel a bit differently about. I can watch it, but I’ve always felt that Return of the Joker was the stronger and more fitting conclusion to the Batman Beyond storyline.

Ironically, I also started watching Smallville on Netflix a few months ago. I really enjoyed the early seasons when there was a fun “Diet Buffy” vibe to the, but the closer it drifted toward the traditional comic-book storyline, the more my interest faded. I ended up stopping around Season 5. Maybe I’ll pick it back up someday.

Bringing this back to Dragon Ball, watching Smallville actually made me think: if Netflix ever produced a live‑action DB series, a Smallville-style Saiyaman arc could be a really cool approach.

[MasenkoHA]

I definitely recommend watching the entire DCAU run if you’re a fan of Batman: The Animated Series. Funny enough, Epilogue is one episode I feel a bit differently about. I can watch it, but I’ve always felt that Return of the Joker was the stronger and more fitting conclusion to the Batman Beyond storyline.

Funny enough I never cared much for Batman Beyond the show but Return of the Joker is just fantastic. One of the best Batman movies

I never liked the idea of Terry being Bruce’s biological son for the same reason I don’t like more modern Batman media pushing Damien as the one true Robin just because he’s Bruce’s literal son and not just a surrogate one

Ironically, I also started watching Smallville on Netflix a few months ago. I really enjoyed the early seasons when there was a fun “Diet Buffy” vibe to the, but the closer it drifted toward the traditional comic-book storyline, the more my interest faded. I ended up stopping around Season 5. Maybe I’ll pick it back up someday.

The most frustrating thing about the final 3 seasons of Smallville is it’s straight up a Superman show without Superman. Clark is meeting all these costumed super heroes (except ironically enough Batman and Wonder Woman due to licensing reasons) and villains and living in Metropolis and having the 2 person love triangle with Lois and eventual romance but he’s still not Superman. The show runners really should have taken the plunge and rebrand the show as Metropolis and had him become Superman for those final seasons.

Also the series finale is, without any exaggeration, the worst series finale of television I’ve ever seen. I mostly abandoned the show during season 7 beyond a few random episodes here and there but I did tune in for that episode and good god…

But yes Smallville was ironically better when it just wanted to be Buffy so bad.

[JulieYBM]

The series finalé of Smallville still drives me up the wall for just not having any money for its big climactic finish. I could kind of do without the whole costume thing, but also it's so hard not to look back at it and be like, "Mr. Tom Welling, are are you doing? You are going to regret not wearing the damn costume one day!" Smallville is the type of insane American television series that you will probably never see again.

But hey, Michael Rosenbaum and John Glover were on fire in that series!

[Koitsukai]

I loved Smallville, but yeah, after season 5 or 6 the show became unbearable and a chore to get through. Everybody was a superhero but Clark, it felt like he was the kid that wasn't allowed to stay up late, while all of his mates were out there dancing, drinking and having fun.
Like, how much longer does this guy need to wait to learn how to fucking fly? specially if he is already being Clark the Journalist.

After Rosenbaum left, the show lost its touch. It's difficult to lose your few good actors and remain engaging, while being repetitive and dragging your feet.

[MCDaveG]

Hailing from Europe, it's easy to say nah, nothing would change for us, but I believe that the late hype that US created almost decade after it respectively debuted in Japan (episode-wise) and with some delay in Europe (I believe that France wasn't airing it that long after Japan) and with how we got all more globalized and interconnected through media beyond internet, probably gave it more of a steady power and series of events, that made Dragon Ball less of a zeitgeist and more of a phenomenon.

And now we can all enjoy ton of video games, continuations and products at the same time around the world.
Without the english dub, it will be more of a niche product, an anime that was once popular but ended up next to the classics like Fist Of The North Star, Yu Yu Hakusho etc. The European market isn't homogenous and quite small when you break it to respective countries, where the popular franchises enter and leave the mainstream to make space for another thing.

If you told me 20 years ago, that we will have movies, specials, Super series and Daima miniseries and the series would be this alive and kicking, I wouldn't believe you as GT ended in 97 and I saw it first on TV around 2001 and was surprised that it ended at all with no sequel.
Funny thing, the time perception back then was completely different, with "early" modern internet, watching TV the oldschool way and things from the 90s still felt brand new. I remember that I liked a lot of those animated flash websites from Funimation and I believe that the US english dub and late run helped it stay relevant and alive not only in US but everywhere else, being available basically all the time.

The feeling of the series' finality came around the time of Yo! Son Goku and Friends Return, being just a short legacy special and airing of the "remastered" Kai.

[90sDBZ]

Something else I just thought of is the popularity of GT and movie characters overseas.

Characters like Broly, Cooler, Gogeta, and the SS4s were featured heavily in the marketing for Budokai 3, because of how popular they were in the US specifically. All of these characters have been included in many of the games since.

Then there's DBS Broly, which likely wouldn't have happened without the character being so popular overseas. It says something when the original author ends up putting his own spin on a character he didn't originally create.

[Kid Buu]

RE: Smallville

Pretty much agree with main points here. Early Buffy-lite season were best and the Luthors were best characters. I loved Erica Durance as Lois Lane though. The "will they or wont they" storyline with Lana got old fast and kinda wish they just copied the Buffy/Angel format where they get together but she leaves after the HS seasons.

Something else I just thought of is the popularity of GT and movie characters overseas.

Characters like Broly, Cooler, Gogeta, and the SS4s were featured heavily in the marketing for Budokai 3, because of how popular they were in the US specifically. All of these characters have been included in many of the games since.

Then there's DBS Broly, which likely wouldn't have happened without the character being so popular overseas. It says something when the original author ends up putting his own spin on a character he didn't originally create.

I remember reading an interview with a video game producer that GT is more popular with US fans than Japanese fans which has impacted some of the game roster choices.

[Dragon Ball Ireland]

Then there's DBS Broly, which likely wouldn't have happened without the character being so popular overseas. It says something when the original author ends up putting his own spin on a character he didn't originally create.

Akio Iyoku is very in touch with the fandom. He suggested a lot of things to Akira Toriyama, like what characters and concepts were popular, namely Future Trunks, Broly, Super Saiyan 4 etc. We can thank him for all of these appearing in modern Dragon Ball.

[SHINOBI-03]

"What if Dragon Ball was never dubbed in English?"

Well, the simplest answer would be "Something else takes its place as America's popular anime". I mean wasn't Pokemon still fresh in people's minds or its popularity was getting dwindled by the time Dragon Ball entered the picture?

Now Dragon Ball was of course still popular in Japan and overseas, and by that time the "Next Generation" was underway with Naruto and One Piece coming, but would their popularity be as strong as it was without the DBZ connection? Or even affecting other franchises like InuYasha that were labeled "DBZ but for/with [....]".

How different would've been the Shonen landscape without the American exposure to Dragon Ball? Without Naruto and One Piece the future of simulcasting between Crunchyroll and FUNimation would've been drastically different from how it ended up to be.

[MasenkoHA]

"What if Dragon Ball was never dubbed in English?"

Well, the simplest answer would be "Something else takes its place as America's popular anime". I mean wasn't Pokemon still fresh in people's minds or its popularity was getting dwindled by the time Dragon Ball entered the picture?

They more or less co-existed. Dragon Ball Z came to the States first but it didn’t start airing on Toonami and do gangbusters until just before Pokemon made it’s U.S debut. The first movie was released around the time the in-house dub was finally wrapping up the Frieza saga. Pokemania started dying out around the same time Dragon Ball Z was wrapping up if’s original English run.

Now Dragon Ball was of course still popular in Japan and overseas, and by that time the "Next Generation" was underway with Naruto and One Piece coming, but would their popularity be as strong as it was without the DBZ connection? Or even affecting other franchises like InuYasha that were labeled "DBZ but for/with [....]".

How different would've been the Shonen landscape without the American exposure to Dragon Ball? Without Naruto and One Piece the future of simulcasting between Crunchyroll and FUNimation would've been drastically different from how it ended up to be.

One Piece’s audience especially in America (when it finally gained traction not the initial 4kids attempt at a block most kids didn’t watch) is almost an entirely different generation than Dragon Ball’s. There was some overlap with Naruto but it came to Toonami two years after Dragon Ball Z ended. A lot of kids watching Naruto didn’t care what a Goku was.

Both those shows definitely exist BECAUSE of Dragon Ball in Japan. There is zero denying that. But they would have been massive hits in the U.S regardless if Dragon Ball ever crossed over or not.

The anime millennial kids boom was happening with or without Dragon Ball. Those shows would have been brought over regardless.

[Hellspawn28]

We had anime being brought over long before Toonami. The anime industry wasn't built on selling shows to kids as anime on VHS was mostly put for an older audience. Companies like Ubran Vision, Centeral Park Media, Streamline, etc. weren't thinking about what anime would be put on TV, or what is popular with the kiddies.

Toonami was even looked down upon at the time for being edited down for kiddies from anime fans.

[90sDBZ]

They more or less co-existed. Dragon Ball Z came to the States first but it didn’t start airing on Toonami and do gangbusters until just before Pokemon made it’s U.S debut. The first movie was released around the time the in-house dub was finally wrapping up the Frieza saga. Pokemania started dying out around the same time Dragon Ball Z was wrapping up if’s original English run.

Things happened a bit differently here in the UK, with Pokemon being a well established household name for quite some time before Z finally aired in 2000.

And while Z was a massive hit on Cartoon Network UK (and later CNX and Toonami), it didn't come remotely close to Pokemon's level of popularity and recognition.

A big factor in this was Cartoon Network was a Sky Channel, while the majority of kids my age still only had terrestrial channels at the time like BBC1/2, ITV, and Channel 4. Pokemon aired on CITV, which was a programming block on ITV that most kids watched.

I remember being one of very few my age who knew what DBZ was. In a way it made the show feel even more special to me, because hardly any of my peers knew about it.

Anime has always had something of a stigma here too, although it has lessened in more recent years. Our version of Toonami was sorely lacking in anime outside of DB, largely favouring American action cartoons for much of the lineup.

Manga UK acquiring the DB licence back on 2012 was a huge development that often isn't given enough credit (which also probably wouldn't have happened without Kix first aquiring Kai). It lead to a huge revival which went as far as massively successful theatrical runs for the last 3 movies. These days DB is more widely known and talked about here, and it's very common to see merch in places like HMV.

[Kid Buu]

Was Tenchi Muyo on Toonami UK?

I remember Digimon and Sailor Moon on Fox Kids. Yu-GI-Oh! I think was on Nick?

[SaiyamanMS]

If Dragon Ball was never dubbed in English, Funimation as we knew it would have never existed, which given that they were such a major player in the English speaking anime industry for decades, would have drastically changed the landscape of the anime industry. Heck, putting aside the anime staples like Chris Sabat, Sean Schemmel, Sonny Strait, etc., without Funimation, would actors like Laura Bailey and Troy Baker who have expanded way beyond the anime space have the same career trajectory?

Also, no English dub would mean no Dragonball Evolution, no Dragonball Evolution would mean Toriyama wouldn’t have been so pissed off that he wrote Battle of Gods, no Battle of Gods would mean no Super.

Regardless of the fact that the DBZ dub was frequently garbage, it is a huge cornerstone in both the modern English anime landscape and the existence of the 21st century era of Dragon Ball.