Actually, without the viewers FOX wouldn’t make any money off of the movie in the first place. Their entire financial stability depends upon the consumers purchasing their product. So they owe quite a bit to us, least of which is a Dragonball movie when they say they’re making one. I’ve already argued why making a faithful adaptation is more financially viable than chucking any remaining semblance of the source out the window.Chrono Trigger wrote: It might not be how you would do it or what you want but once again FOX didn't promise you anything and they don't owe you anything. All they care about is making money.
I don’t know where this notion keeps coming from. Let me make things perfectly clear: no one wants Dragon Ball Volume 1 in movie form. It would be boring as shit. It’s been done a thousand times already. What we want is something that puts a fresh spin on the series while remaining in good faith to it. This isn’t that.Well I can't speak for anyone else but it's not a big deal to me. It's just a movie and I knew from the start they would never do it right anyway. I don't feel like they owe me anything and I don't think there was any "invisible" or "implied" promise. They announced they were making a Dragon Ball movie and I thought "Well this will just be their take on the series." and that's all it is. As long as I'm entertained I really don't care if the story is an exact replica of Dragon Ball Vol.1. If I wanna see that then I'll READ DRAGON BALL VOL.1!
You’re missing the point. I was talking about video quality. With all other aspects being equal, would you really prefer the Season Sets to the D.Box? You don’t even have to go that far—you could replace the D.Box with the UUEs. Any set in 4:3 with at least semi-accurate colors and detail preservation would be preferable to the Season Sets. People just figured there wasn’t any other option for them so they went into denial about it to make the best of a bad situation. It’s the same thing here.I would pick the Season Sets because I can't speak or understand Japanese!
I’m sorry, but when people line up to defend a company that is giving them a raw deal, it feels like the fandom doesn’t have any standards. In most cases I probably would exhibit the same existential attitude as you, but Dragon Ball is something dear to me that has had one of the worst breaks with American audiences ever, and this is just continuing it. What would it take for the fans to no longer tolerate it? Are they merely numb from everything that’s happened thus far that they don’t care anymore?You're right. Nobody should be allowed to try and enjoy something for what it is. It's not about watching a fun action/adventure movie! It's about being able to walk into a theater with Vol.1 of the manga and being able to follow along and yell out spoilers to all the people that don't know what's going on. Nobody is "bending over" for anyone. I'm just going to the movies to see a movie that just happens to be called "DRAGON BALL". If it's good it's good and if it's not then it's not.
Granted, but that doesn’t necessarily mean the lesser priced of the two is worth your money either. By buying the Season Sets, you willingly support a bad job. You send that company the message that they don’t have to try any harder for you to open up your wallet to them. And while it’s one thing for the misinformed masses to do so because they believe the advertising, for you to know that it sucks and still do it only hurts the cause for a better treatment.Super Ghost Kamikaze wrote:However STUPID the "remastering" of Funi's season sets are, they have the enormous benefit of costing ten times less than the Dragon Boxes for the same amount of episodes. For someone who just wants to see the series from start to finish, who is on a budget, and who wants Steve Simmons's subtitles...the season sets are the choice.
Yes, if given the choice between the two for free, I'd snag the Dragon Boxes. But when the reality of the situation, some moral outrages just aren't worth a difference of $1,800.
I haven’t seen the 1998 Psycho but I believe that’s a case where, when something achieves legendary status, not even an exact replica will be acceptable by most people. The original has too much of an established cultural identity, and a lot of involved feelings are already associated with it. The very fact that it’s shot-for-shot shows that they didn’t want to push the envelope too hard. Dragon Ball isn’t nearly on that level and doesn’t warrant the same kind of trepidation. As a dedicated fan I do have some of those same involved feelings, which is what elicits this type of response from me. But they aren’t so great that nothing but the original will do. I just want someone to take the same care that a true fan would with the film. Yes, we only have bits and pieces, but I know enough about it to know that that wasn’t done. And I’m sorry to say but that kind of thing cheats the very people it’s purportedly made for, unless you force yourself not to think about it.And we've seen bad "faithful" adaptations in history, as well. In 1998, we had a shot-for-shot remake of Psycho that just wasn't the same as the original. FACTS of the story can be changed while retaining the SPIRIT. Yes, a lot of facts of the story look different now. But we only have a few interviews and a shaky-cam audio-less teaser.
The way I see it, if several million other people are just casual fans, or don’t really care too much about it in the first place, why not just make it for the fans? They would probably still see it and like it.And back on the subject of realities, it's just not going to happen the way *we* imagine it. They have several million other people besides us to consider. I don't feel it's bending over backwards, here. I honestly am just sitting here to see the theatrical trailer.
And I was speaking more to the point of people glazing over the unsightly aspects and acting as if everything’s A-OK, or that we should lower our expectations because this is an adaptation and as such forgoes accuracy.
I was always pumped for the new Joker, and it actually turned out way better than I could have anticipated. But the reason it worked was because he was a new spin on a familiar concept. He still retained all of the frightening/humorous qualities that we’d come to expect of the Joker, but portrayed it in a new light that invigorated the character. Maybe it’s too early to tell with DB, but even with the hindsight of The Dark Knight in mind, I don’t think this will follow a similar pattern.Joker looked HORRIBLE to the Batman fan in me in pre-release shots of Dark Knight. The Batmobile looked awful in pre-release shots of Begins(though to be fair, I still hate the tumbler, but I get the sentiment behind it). Hell, I didn't like how they combined two characters that I really like in Begins.
But DAMN, was it a good movie.
Well, for the record, I do have some problems with the Spider-Man and X-Men films as well; particularly the third installments, but with those, yes, the major plot points are all covered. However, I don’t seem to recall them ever putting Peter in the woods as part of a perceived necessity to segue into the rest of the story. And at least Tobey Maguire actually looked like Peter Parker. And Venom was black (rather than blue, thank God). And none of the bad guys came to be because of the aligning of the planets. Do you see what I’m getting at here? There’s only so far you can go until you overstep your boundaries and end up in a place wholly different from where you started. Spider-Man and X-Men know their boundaries, but I’m not so sure Dragon Ball does.Onikage725 wrote:You kind of get this feeling, reading these topics, that people just want a shot for shot recreation of the series. A lot of people say this doesn't have the spirit of the series (how we know that from 40 or so seconds of no-audio bootleg footage, is beyond me), but some people have bashed the Spiderman films in these threads too. Those films do stay, for the most part, thematically similar. They alter plenty of events significantly, but the heart is there. Pete's still the dork who can't catch a break, except for the whole super powers thing. Norman was still the driven scientist and businessman who who, due to an untested experiment, ended up flying around in green intent on torturing Spiderman. His son was still Peter's best friend turned worst enemy, redeemed before his death. Eddie Brock was a crock photographer and rival that Peter got fired, who bonded in church with the symbiote and sought revenge. These are major elements that more or less are present in both.
In Dragon Ball, it seems like most of the major plot points are there, and we're holding out to see the impact the alterations to the other stuff has. But I can't see how the changes I've read about so far are any worse than the X-Men film series. And those certainly seemed to do well. And you know what? Wolverine may not have worn yellow spandex, been 5'4, had hair that stuck up 8 inches to either side above his head, had claws extend from between his fingers as opposed to above the knuckles, and had no knowledge of Lady Deathstryke... but Hugh Jackman *is* Wolverine, and he owns that role.
As I’ve mentioned before, I for one don’t actually want a panel-for-panel recreation, and that isn’t what I’m arguing for.Acid, you said "Film is really just another method of storytelling; it serves the exact same purpose as Television, comics, novels, or verbal exchange. There is nothing inherent about the medium that mandates fucking with established characters and plot, save maybe time constraints."
I guess what I'm asking is for one example. What is this mythical 100% panel for panel recreation comic or game or cartoon adaptation? And if we had such a thing... couldn't really just go watch our DVDs? Or play the games with the recreation cutscenes?
To be clear, I only cried foul when I heard about the changes. I strongly believe in the faithful adaptability of Dragon Ball for the screen. This just isn’t it.Pretty much every comic or game to movie, tv to movie, or movie to tv adaptation I've ever seen has undergone changes in the process. Many of them are still pretty good in their own right. The way I see it, this movie could be pretty decent with cool fights, or it could be an utter suckfest. But a lot of people have been crying foul since the announcement that a movie was even being made.
