Two Artist One Scene Discussion.

cRookie_Monster · Post by **cRookie_Monster** » Fri Jan 02, 2009 1:24 pm

Any time there's as much work to do as there is in a series like DBZ I think things are gonna get prioritized and dealt with accordingly...though I also wonder why they didn't just recycle footage. Maybe they weren't in the habit of editing like that? I dunno, seems like in the cartoon business that would be fairly normal.

Pain · Post by **Pain** » Fri Jan 02, 2009 1:28 pm

sangofe wrote:
Pain wrote:
DominatorLost wrote:Oh god some of those last few are bad.
Well the Boo Arc brought the worst out of everyone and everything.
Are you talking about the worst of the Buu saga? Because the best of Buu saga is simply amazing.

No, I meant the decisions that the characters made and some of the terribly drawn episodes. That's what I thought was horrible. Other than that, it was a good little saga.

Rory · Post by **Rory** » Fri Jan 02, 2009 1:35 pm

cRookie_Monster wrote:Any time there's as much work to do as there is in a series like DBZ I think things are gonna get prioritized and dealt with accordingly...though I also wonder why they didn't just recycle footage. Maybe they weren't in the habit of editing like that? I dunno, seems like in the cartoon business that would be fairly normal.

I guess a huge drop is quality would be too noticeable, and take you out of the moment (more-so than over the span of episodes).
(Funny, I was listening to your SSJ5 theme when I saw your post.. damnit it still rocks :p)

biohazard · Post by **biohazard** » Fri Jan 02, 2009 2:58 pm

Do you remember the chapter after Kami was released from the bottle in the Garlick Jr. saga? After the title screen there were 1-2 minutes of recicled footage(The scene in which Piccolo stops pretending to be a Garlick slave and steals the bottle from him) directly from the previous episode (which was a pretty well drawn episode) and suddenly the animation style and drawing quality dropped a lot

Deep Thought · Post by **Deep Thought** » Fri Jan 02, 2009 4:40 pm

Y'know, this topic reminds me that Dragon ball Z needs to be re-drawn. Not mildly polished like the Dragon Box and not cropped and pissed on like the Season Sets. Re-drawn, from beginning to end.

Zenkai Power · Post by **Zenkai Power** » Fri Jan 02, 2009 6:16 pm

Captain Awesome wrote:
Rory wrote: Sorry, it may just be my filthy mind, but Vegeta looks like he's receiving.. something.
I find the AHQ bootleg screen cap to be more disturbing.

The series is as cheap as shit to pick up these days, and people are still downloading?

I downloaded the entire series years ago. I also own the entire series on DVD (well as much that has been released in the orange brick deal). I own the entire Buu saga on VHS still. I've just kept the files on my computer. I still have some realplayer episodes from 2002. I use them for screencaps because they are all already on the computer. Don't be so quick to judge.

JulieYBM · Post by **JulieYBM** » Fri Jan 02, 2009 6:59 pm

cRookie_Monster wrote:Any time there's as much work to do as there is in a series like DBZ I think things are gonna get prioritized and dealt with accordingly...though I also wonder why they didn't just recycle footage. Maybe they weren't in the habit of editing like that? I dunno, seems like in the cartoon business that would be fairly normal.

It's their damn unions!

Back in my day we went out 'n pistol-whipped the pansies 'til they gave us what we wanted.

SHINOBI-03 · Post by **SHINOBI-03** » Sat Jan 03, 2009 2:07 am

Rory wrote:
SHINOBI-03 wrote:I'm a cheap bugger who can't be bothered importing the season sets.
Nothing wrong with importing (in England, that shit's like, twice as expensive in some cases), eBay is your friend.

I didn't say that, OK? If you would quote somthing, don't alter it as you like.

Speaking of importing, sadly, I'm not allowed to have a credit card of my own and I can't buy from the Internet till I graduate and get a real job.

Joey Batz · Post by **Joey Batz** » Sat Jan 03, 2009 2:37 am

What's amazing is that there's no excuses for any of these scenes to have been redrawn the way they are. Looking at the pictures of Gohan's transformation into SSJ2--SPECIFICALLY the ones of Vegeta and Trunks turning around--I noticed that in each set of two, the first picture is a scene directly taken (heck, maybe even photocopied or traced) from the manga while the second is a complete redrawing of the image (with the artist taking some creative liberties as to how he/she thinks it should look). I could see redrawing scenes that are filler or just with different angles or whanot from the manga, but these are images literally taken right out the manga! I even recognize those panels. There's no reason for an artist to have redrawn images from the manga.

Hmm, notice how the images directly taken from the manga are great, but the artists' redrawings suck? Surprise, surprise.....

The Time Traveller · Post by **The Time Traveller** » Sat Jan 03, 2009 2:44 am

I was watching the middle of the Red Ribbon Arc last night where General Blue is going after Son, Kuririn and Bulma, and the Previously thing shows Really badly drawn versions of the past episode, like the headless pirate skeleton is missing detail and even the knife sticking out of his ribs. Also, it was around this episode that I saw a RR Army soldier named "Colonel Blue". What, they run out of colours?

Zenkai Power · Post by **Zenkai Power** » Sat Jan 03, 2009 4:05 am

Joey Batz wrote:What's amazing is that there's no excuses for any of these scenes to have been redrawn the way they are. Looking at the pictures of Gohan's transformation into SSJ2--SPECIFICALLY the ones of Vegeta and Trunks turning around--I noticed that in each set of two, the first picture is a scene directly taken (heck, maybe even photocopied or traced) from the manga while the second is a complete redrawing of the image (with the artist taking some creative liberties as to how he/she thinks it should look). I could see redrawing scenes that are filler or just with different angles or whanot from the manga, but these are images literally taken right out the manga! I even recognize those panels. There's no reason for an artist to have redrawn images from the manga.

Hmm, notice how the images directly taken from the manga are great, but the artists' redrawings suck? Surprise, surprise.....

I don't think they are taken "directly" from the manga. I think that one artist is just better at re-creating it than the other. And perhaps each artist wanted a "crack" at the scene themselves... ??? I dunno.

The Time Traveller · Post by **The Time Traveller** » Sat Jan 03, 2009 7:53 am

SHINOBI-03 wrote:
Rory wrote:
SHINOBI-03 wrote:I'm a cheap bugger who can't be bothered importing the season sets.
Nothing wrong with importing (in England, that shit's like, twice as expensive in some cases), eBay is your friend.
I didn't say that, OK? If you would quote somthing, don't alter it as you like.

Speaking of importing, sadly, I'm not allowed to have a credit card of my own and I can't buy from the Internet till I graduate and get a real job.

Get a Quidity Card, it's what I have. It's just a Prepaid Card, you can get them in the Daily Mirror, or just order them online.

It's what I use, and they're Maestro too so they work ALMOST anywhere, and you can use them for Paypal too, so you can buy from even more places.
Just do you don't misunderstand, prepaid means they're not in anyway connected to your bank or any vital details so if you lose the card, you're not fucked, even if it does get stolen and some idiot puts money on it, you can spend that money, and order another card, so who ever found or stole the card in the first place gets nothing, just useless plastic.

Sadly, you can't buy from Amazon, but they're actually more expensive than most places, so fuck them.

I buy the Season Sets from AxelMusic.com, which I fucking love for their cheap deals and friendly services, and no I don't work for them. They even gave me the first two volumes of Gurren Lagann for free because of a mix-up, fucking awesome.

The Season sets should cost £30 here, and on some sites they do. But preordering them on Axelmusic is about £19, and buying them once they're out is about £22. If these sets magically came out in the UK, we'd probably see them for about.... £70 each.

Signing up for Paypal can be a bitch too, took me like 3 months to figure out what the fuck was going on, just to get verifyed, but you don't even need to do that to buy from most places. And despite it's name, AxelMusic don't sell music other than Soundtracks for some reason...

They sell Australian stuff too but that's over priced and for some reason they're always out of stock... And they never put up the 2 Big Dragon Ball Collections.

B · Post by B » Sat Jan 03, 2009 10:40 am

Uhm, are two episdoes merged into one in this video?

I ask because the animation suddeny turns psuedo-chibi, MOST noticeable in Goku.

The Time Traveller · Post by **The Time Traveller** » Sat Jan 03, 2009 11:39 am

Here's those two scenes from Dragon Ball, it's just two shots, but they're still very different.

The knife is gone, but for some reason there's a fucking machine gun on the floor!

B wrote:Uhm, are two episdoes merged into one in this video?

I ask because the animation suddeny turns psuedo-chibi, MOST noticeable in Goku.

I've only really noticed stuff like that one time, and it was from the most favoured filler episode ever!

His neck is so damn long, and his head is tiny, and so are his arms! What the fuuuuck?!

He shrunk!

Zenkai Power · Post by **Zenkai Power** » Sat Jan 03, 2009 5:42 pm

LOL @ shrinking Goku!!! That was a big contrast. Quality control on the DB series doesn't seem to be tooo high.

Post by **Herms** » Sat Jan 03, 2009 5:49 pm

The Time Traveller wrote:The knife is gone, but for some reason there's a fucking machine gun on the floor!

That's actually how it is in the manga (with the machinegun and no knife, that is).

Joey Batz · Post by **Joey Batz** » Sat Jan 03, 2009 5:50 pm

Zenkai Power wrote:
I don't think they are taken "directly" from the manga. I think that one artist is just better at re-creating it than the other. And perhaps each artist wanted a "crack" at the scene themselves... ??? I dunno.

I don't mean that they just photocopied the panel or anything. I just mean that one artist created an exact duplicate of the panel, only to have the next episode have a different artist take creative liberties with that image. Seemingly, that's what happened I mean. I'm not privy to Toei's animation process but that's what appeared to happen in my eyes.

Zenkai Power · Post by **Zenkai Power** » Sat Jan 03, 2009 11:54 pm

Joey Batz wrote:
Zenkai Power wrote:
I don't think they are taken "directly" from the manga. I think that one artist is just better at re-creating it than the other. And perhaps each artist wanted a "crack" at the scene themselves... ??? I dunno.
I don't mean that they just photocopied the panel or anything. I just mean that one artist created an exact duplicate of the panel, only to have the next episode have a different artist take creative liberties with that image. Seemingly, that's what happened I mean. I'm not privy to Toei's animation process but that's what appeared to happen in my eyes.

Well. One person does not draw an entire episode. So if the art style changes from episode-episode I'm pretty sure it's the "art director" or "director" of that episode that has decided to go that route. Maybe they have different artists for in-between animation do some episodes because the other artists are busy working on a different and more important episode. If you notice, almost every IMPORTANT scene is animated the best it can be the first time it's shown. Gohan going SSJ2, Piccolo sacraficing himself for Gohan, Goku sacraficing himself for everybody during the Cell games... etc. The key episodes are always drawn very well. So maybe the time it takes to draw those results in rushing some other episodes or something?

Omiclock · Post by **Omiclock** » Sun Jan 04, 2009 5:24 am

Am I the only one who finds it bizarre that between episodes Super Saiyajin hair suddenly goes from gold to that bizarre albino white? It always just looks so sickening to me; what did they not have enough money to colour the hair in gold every time?

Tsukento · Post by **Tsukento** » Sun Jan 04, 2009 7:27 am

Omiclock wrote:Am I the only one who finds it bizarre that between episodes Super Saiyajin hair suddenly goes from gold to that bizarre albino white? It always just looks so sickening to me; what did they not have enough money to colour the hair in gold every time?

You're not alone. I never understood what the deal was with making the hair seem like it was almost unpainted.

Here's another:

Gotta also love how ugly Freeza could get at times.

The first being the best. The second being eh. And the third being Triangle Crap.