Goku's Instant Transmission

DaRealChrono · Post by **DaRealChrono** » Sat Apr 04, 2009 1:35 am

So I was watching some Dragon Ball Z the other day and I started to think about a question...kind of an anomaly of Instant Transmission.

I'm not sure if this has been asked or answered before, but I can't find any info on it, so here it goes.

We all know that during the Cell Games, Goku "saves" the Earth by Instant Transmission-ing Cell to Kaio-Sama's planet, which then proceeds to blow up, Goku dies, etc.

Which brings me to my question. How is it that Goku is allowed to Instant Transmission into essentially a dead state while he's still alive (since he Instant Tranmissions into the after-life) but can't Instant Transmission into a "live" state while being dead? I guess I can see it being a "rule" that you can't pass the seam of life and death while your dead...but I don't feel like this was ever really explained. If there was a "rule" that no one can cross the afterlife to the living world while being dead, wouldn't the same rule applying to the living world to the afterlife?

Sorry if I rambled, I'm just very curious as to how this works.

Post by **Herms** » Sat Apr 04, 2009 2:06 am

Visiting the afterlife doesn't make you automatically dead. Goku teleported to Kaio's alive earlier, when trying to find New Planet Namek, and Uranai Baba can go back and forth at will. So there doesn't seem to be any rule keeping living people out of the afterlife, the trick is simlply finding a way to get there (since you can't exactly walk there).

Adamant · Post by **Adamant** » Sat Apr 04, 2009 2:07 am

Herms wrote:(since you can't exactly walk there).

According to end-of-Dragonball anime filler, you can

mister yummy · Post by **mister yummy** » Sat Apr 04, 2009 2:10 am

I believe Movie 9 gets into this issue a little bit. Unfortunately, as I've never seen that particular movie, I can't say for sure.

It seems to me that Goku can use Instant Transmission to move freely between the living world and the afterlife when he's living. However, when he's dead, he cannot go to the living world. If he were to try, I think, he would show up as a corpse, and simply end up back in the other world anyways. Or, if not a corpse, as a ghostly apparition that can't do much, and fades back into the afterlife.

I suppose I'm not helping much, am I. I don't seem to be able to express my thoughts on the subject succinctly. Let me try again...

If Goku were to IT from the afterlife to the living world while dead, he would simply end up back in the afterlife. This would happen because he's dead, since dead people can't exist in the living world except under strange conditions(Baba's power, crystalisation of the afterlife, big hole in the fabric of space between the Living World and Hell, etc.).

From what I've read, Movie 9 does it this way. Goku IT's to Earth, and is able to help for only a few seconds before fading back out into the afterlife.

Maybe it's like a "if then" argument in computer program. The "system" does a check, sees a dead person in the living world, and moves him into the afterlife.

I dunno...it's late, and I'm rambling. Time to let someone actually say something meaningful in this topic.

DaRealChrono · Post by **DaRealChrono** » Sat Apr 04, 2009 2:48 am

Herms wrote:Visiting the afterlife doesn't make you automatically dead. Goku teleported to Kaio's alive earlier, when trying to find New Planet Namek, and Uranai Baba can go back and forth at will. So there doesn't seem to be any rule keeping living people out of the afterlife, the trick is simlply finding a way to get there (since you can't exactly walk there).

I can kind of see how that works, but it still doesn't seem to make much sense to me.

I mean, getting a little technical and out of the series, If I were to go to the afterlife, I would become dead. I know this strays outside the limits of the conversation a little, but I would figure these same rules would apply to people of the living world (in Dragon Ball).

Note: This may get confusing...lol...
For instance, obviously Kaio-sama and other entities in the afterlife aren't particularly dead, but exists in that "dimension" if you will, so it's their universe/solar system to them. When they would die, they would go further beyond (I assume) their own universe. However, you never really hear of a "living person" traveling above the after-life, in that dimension (the after-life).

When Goku travels up, not being dead, to his "higher universe" it seems to break the chain of how the universe is supposed to or intended to work.

My question wasn't so much of a "How does he do it" in a literal sense, but more of a how is he allowed to bend the rules one way, but not in another way.

In response to mister yummy:

You bought a good point with your analogy, but I think that it would still work both ways. If the after-life did a "scan" and found a living person not belonging to that universe, wouldn't it remove it back to where it was supposed to be?

I guess what I'm saying is, how is Goku able to exist in 2 different dimensions, without breaking the way things are supposed to work. I realize this IS Dragon Ball were talking about, but this seems a little far fetched to me.

As far as the Baba thing goes, you don't ever really see her in the after-life (If I recall correctly). I assume we can consider the check-in station and the after life separate things, since the spirits are transported from the check-in station to their destination. I don't know. I'm drawing a couple of fine lines, it's late, and I may just be rambling to ramble, and I don't know if I'm even making sense at this point. Lol.

Rocketman · Post by **Rocketman** » Sat Apr 04, 2009 3:18 am

But you can be alive in the afterlife. When Shenron revives Goku, he's still on King Kai's World.

And when King Kai and Elder Kai die, they remain in the Otherworld.

Kendamu · Post by **Kendamu** » Sat Apr 04, 2009 5:18 am

I figure that since Goku has his body, he can return to the living world at will with his Shunkan Ido. However, he's simply not allowed to do it and, being the nice and honest guy he is, he remains in the Afterlife because he chooses to follow the rules and not return to the living universe unless he is permitted to do so.

The only thing that I have to really go on, though, is in Movie 9 when Goku pops in for a split second to help Gohan. However, everything else is based on speculation.

mister yummy · Post by **mister yummy** » Sat Apr 04, 2009 9:18 am

Living people occupy the afterlife anyways. King Kai was alive until Cell blew up, afterall.

rereboy · Post by **rereboy** » Sat Apr 04, 2009 9:52 am

DaRealChrono wrote:So I was watching some Dragon Ball Z the other day and I started to think about a question...kind of an anomaly of Instant Transmission.

I'm not sure if this has been asked or answered before, but I can't find any info on it, so here it goes.

We all know that during the Cell Games, Goku "saves" the Earth by Instant Transmission-ing Cell to Kaio-Sama's planet, which then proceeds to blow up, Goku dies, etc.

Which brings me to my question. How is it that Goku is allowed to Instant Transmission into essentially a dead state while he's still alive (since he Instant Tranmissions into the after-life) but can't Instant Transmission into a "live" state while being dead? I guess I can see it being a "rule" that you can't pass the seam of life and death while your dead...but I don't feel like this was ever really explained. If there was a "rule" that no one can cross the afterlife to the living world while being dead, wouldn't the same rule applying to the living world to the afterlife?

Sorry if I rambled, I'm just very curious as to how this works.

Just think of the afterlife as another dimension.

When people die, their souls are automatically drawn to that dimension.

However, that doesn`t mean that no living body can exist there. There are native living creatures that live in that dimension like the "gods" and etc.

So live bodies and creatures can live there. However, live creatures from other dimensions, like ours, can`t normally go there (just their souls).

There are a few exceptions however. Kami and Goku, for example, can travel between those dimensions with ease.

Post by **Herms** » Sat Apr 04, 2009 10:53 am

For instance, obviously Kaio-sama and other entities in the afterlife aren't particularly dead, but exists in that "dimension" if you will, so it's their universe/solar system to them. When they would die, they would go further beyond (I assume) their own universe.

No, when Kaio dies he ends up in the afterlife just like everyone else.

Piccolo Daimao · Post by **Piccolo Daimao** » Sat Apr 18, 2009 8:07 am

Son Goku can teleport to the afterlife while he's living. While he's dead, I'm not so sure. He did it in Movie 9, but only stayed briefly. Possibly there's some sort of barrier between the living world and the afterlife, and that Goku can't teleport to Earth. And even if he did, it would be breaking the rules and Goku's not the type of break rules. Anyway, he was happy in the afterlife and requested not to be wished back to life at the end of the Cell Games anyway.

What about Kami-Sama? He was dead too, but he was able to restore Chaozu's body. That's a completely different technique to Instant Transmission, but it means that Kami didn't lose all of his magical abilities while he was dead. Also, while he was alive, he teleported to Heaven to get Goku, but maybe he can't do that if he's dead.

Bussani · Post by **Bussani** » Sat Apr 18, 2009 8:18 am

The afterlife is a physical place in Dragon Ball. As Herms said, living people can come and go as they please, if they have the ability to. Dead people, on the other hand, theoretically can't leave.

I don't see why this doesn't make sense. It's just how the universe and afterlife are set up in Dragon Ball. It's the very nature of their universe.

caejones · Post by **caejones** » Sat Apr 18, 2009 10:06 am

mister yummy wrote: Maybe it's like a "if then" argument in computer program. The "system" does a check, sees a dead person in the living world, and moves him into the afterlife.

RPGMain_dbz.htm wrote:

Code: Select all

if((hp[cont]<1)&&(loc[cont].indexOf("orld")<0)&&(loc[cont].indexOf("Hell")<0)&&(loc[cont].indexOf("nake")<0)) {
if(goodguys.indexOf(" " + cont + " ")>=0)  loc[cont]="Otherworld-Checkin";
else {
//catch these guys. :P
loc[cont]="Hell";
}
if((cont>22)&&(cont<25)) names[cont]="*";
}//dead. Add stuff for other specifics

Hmm, That was kinda more painful than I expected.

The Mazoku thing makes me wonder... but neah, it's the "afterlife = physical place" thing that makes it work.
... And now I'm wondering what would happen if someone tried to take a spacecraft to the afterlife.
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