Kai Episode 3 (19 April 2009)

[Smooth Criminal]

Granted the mistakes for GT episode titles were MUCH MUCH bigger..That episode where Goku finally kills Bebi was originally going to be called "Only 5 Seconds To Leave Planet Tsufuru?!" or something.

Eh? How do we know this?

Ok, I FINALLY found the website. It's Dragon Ball Arena. Check this except out:

"Episode #40
(Aired 03/05/97)

Chikyuu Bakuhatsu! Pikkoro no Juudaina Ketsui
Earth Explodes!! Piccolo's Serious Determination

(Just a quick note.)
It seems that there is now a "missing episode" for DBGT. Both Newtype Magazine, and the Toei Studios web site list a different episode for number 39. Apparently, episode 39 was slated to be:
Kutabare Bebii! Konjyou no Ichigeki
Shit on Baby! A Spirited One-Punch Attack

Then, things get interesting. Newtype lists episode 40 as:
Everyone Escape!! 5 Seconds Before Earth Explodes

However, the Toei web site gives a preview for the next 2 week's shows. According to the web site, episode 40 was to be:
This is How It Ends! Finally, Baby's Extinction

Which of course is the episode that actually aired last week. This implies that Toei actually created artwork for "Kutabare Bebii", but had pulled that episode for some reason.
What makes things more interesting is that the real episode 40 doesn't have the same name that Newtype lists as being episode 40. Unfortunately, the Toei Studios page doesn't have the preview for episode 41 posted -- that would have made things much more tantalizing. I'm wondering too whether Toei will correct the episode numbering on their page next week, or if they'll perpetuate it."

This is what I was referring to with episode naming mistakes.

Original page: http://dragonballarena.gamesurf.it/engl ... s_pag5.php

In order to clarify your post a little bit, it should be noted that your quote comes from one of Curtis Hoffman's episode summaries from 1996, back when these episodes were originally airing.

This discussion about this "missing" episode of DBGT could probably have an entire thread of discussion dedicated to it, however, I'll just add my little bit here.

The 'original' episode 39, titled "Kutabare Bebii! Konjyou no Ichigeki" was ditched at the last minute, and the final episode of the Baby fight took its place. Based on information I learned about this episode WAY back in the day on the newsgroups, I believe from Curtis himself, this episode was to be a 'recap' of the Baby fight, using mostly recycled footage from prior episodes. Ratings for GT at the time were low, and so (based on speculation), TOEI decided to scrap the episode and conclude the arc more speedily, as the original episode 39 was largely expendable. I do believe the TV special also aired the following week.

I've tried to do some research about this recently but nothing has come up. I'm reciting this information solely from memory, and therefore it cannot be taken as fact.

However, we can logically conclude based on a comparison between episodes 38 and 39 of Dragonball GT, that a 'recap' episode would have fit in there perfectly, as a renewed SSJ4 Goku was just about to get his second win.

Hopefully this clears up a little bit of the mystery concerning the 'lost' episode of Dragonball GT.

[NeoKING]

Eh? How do we know this?

Ok, I FINALLY found the website. It's Dragon Ball Arena. Check this except out:

"Episode #40
(Aired 03/05/97)

Chikyuu Bakuhatsu! Pikkoro no Juudaina Ketsui
Earth Explodes!! Piccolo's Serious Determination

(Just a quick note.)
It seems that there is now a "missing episode" for DBGT. Both Newtype Magazine, and the Toei Studios web site list a different episode for number 39. Apparently, episode 39 was slated to be:
Kutabare Bebii! Konjyou no Ichigeki
Shit on Baby! A Spirited One-Punch Attack

Then, things get interesting. Newtype lists episode 40 as:
Everyone Escape!! 5 Seconds Before Earth Explodes

However, the Toei web site gives a preview for the next 2 week's shows. According to the web site, episode 40 was to be:
This is How It Ends! Finally, Baby's Extinction

Which of course is the episode that actually aired last week. This implies that Toei actually created artwork for "Kutabare Bebii", but had pulled that episode for some reason.
What makes things more interesting is that the real episode 40 doesn't have the same name that Newtype lists as being episode 40. Unfortunately, the Toei Studios page doesn't have the preview for episode 41 posted -- that would have made things much more tantalizing. I'm wondering too whether Toei will correct the episode numbering on their page next week, or if they'll perpetuate it."

This is what I was referring to with episode naming mistakes.

Original page: http://dragonballarena.gamesurf.it/engl ... s_pag5.php

In order to clarify your post a little bit, it should be noted that your quote comes from one of Curtis Hoffman's episode summaries from 1996, back when these episodes were originally airing.

This discussion about this "missing" episode of DBGT could probably have an entire thread of discussion dedicated to it, however, I'll just add my little bit here.

The 'original' episode 39, titled "Kutabare Bebii! Konjyou no Ichigeki" was ditched at the last minute, and the final episode of the Baby fight took its place. Based on information I learned about this episode WAY back in the day on the newsgroups, I believe from Curtis himself, this episode was to be a 'recap' of the Baby fight, using mostly recycled footage from prior episodes. Ratings for GT at the time were low, and so (based on speculation), TOEI decided to scrap the episode and conclude the arc more speedily, as the original episode 39 was largely expendable. I do believe the TV special also aired the following week.

I've tried to do some research about this recently but nothing has come up. I'm reciting this information solely from memory, and therefore it cannot be taken as fact.

However, we can logically conclude based on a comparison between episodes 38 and 39 of Dragonball GT, that a 'recap' episode would have fit in there perfectly, as a renewed SSJ4 Goku was just about to get his second win.

Hopefully this clears up a little bit of the mystery concerning the 'lost' episode of Dragonball GT.

Ah, thank you for explaining.

[Hero 004]

This episode looked great, especially the hand-to-hand scenes. If the Raditz vs Goku and Piccolo fight looks this smooth I can't wait for later ones. I don't know if the makankosappo was tweaked at all but it looked really good as well.
I kinda had mixed feelings when the "Dragon Soul" theme played when Gohan landed out of the space pod. I didn't much like it at first, but on second thought it made it feel like his hidden power was the climax of the fight and the series centers around his development, which is how I like to think about DBZ up to the Cell Games.
When I saw Nappa's armor I thought they weren't gonna do it, but was really happy to see Vegeta's the right colors, I'm glad it's corrected for this version. Of course, I don't mind the armor at all, what bothered me originally was that brown-red hair!

[Wasted Wisher]

SSj-Rambo>
Those digital distortion effects in the fight scene with Raditz? Yeah, those are new.

The terribly dark double-lines under dying Raditz' eyes! Not mine! YAY!

Umm...wait...did I draw that scene with Kuririn? CRAPCRAPCRAP I may have done it again.

[Tanooki Kuribo]

Something about the new V-Jump that contains part 2 of the manga adaptation of the Jump Super Anime Tour. It has some Kai stuff on the front; hopefully someone can read some of it...

I'am actually getting a copy of that issue, but I won't get it for about a week or two.

[Fuujin]

For me, the Newgrounds-style redrawn cels are much more of a travesty than any of the censorship. DeamonCorps posted this screenshot in the other thread - http://i734.photobucket.com/albums/ww34 ... bkai05.jpg .

Look at his face. Just look at it.

He looks like a Fusion of Raditz and Chiaotzu.

[Kendamu]

For me, the Newgrounds-style redrawn cels are much more of a travesty than any of the censorship. DeamonCorps posted this screenshot in the other thread - http://i734.photobucket.com/albums/ww34 ... bkai05.jpg .

Look at his face. Just look at it.

He looks like a Fusion of Raditz and Chiaotzu.

That half-a-second you're pointing out did stick out a bit for me, but I think it had more to do with the background being bright red for that moment more than anything. Had they drawn a real background I wouldn't have noticed so much.

[shotkeeper]

For me, the Newgrounds-style redrawn cels are much more of a travesty than any of the censorship. DeamonCorps posted this screenshot in the other thread - http://i734.photobucket.com/albums/ww34 ... bkai05.jpg .

Look at his face. Just look at it.

He looks like a Fusion of Raditz and Chiaotzu.

That half-a-second you're pointing out did stick out a bit for me, but I think it had more to do with the background being bright red for that moment more than anything. Had they drawn a real background I wouldn't have noticed so much.

I really think that it got nothing to do with the background. It's about the face and that is really fucked up.

If it stands out or not, is a different story.

[Smooth Criminal]

Isn't that an "in-between" animation? Like, it's on screen for like .05 seconds.

In any event, I agree it sucks shit. But that particular example isn't really that big of a deal.

[Hujio]

For anyone that's interested, we have our page up on Kanzentai for the third episode of DragonBall Kai. I hope everyone enjoys it!

DBK Episode 003, "A Battle with Their Lives on the Line! Goku and Piccolo's Fierce Suicidal Attack"

Not to specifically pimp my own section of the page, but I'd really suggest checking out the "Altered Material" section, since I know many people have asked how many re-animated or re-drawn scenes there were. That is all...

Credits:
Manga Comparison: Herms
Original Broadcast Comparison: Hujio
Music/Voice Performance Comparison: DBW

-----------------------------------------------------------

For me, the Newgrounds-style redrawn cels are much more of a travesty than any of the censorship. DeamonCorps posted this screenshot in the other thread - http://i734.photobucket.com/albums/ww34 ... bkai05.jpg .

Look at his face. Just look at it.

He looks like a Fusion of Raditz and Chiaotzu.

While that screen shot is fine and all, I think the biggest problem is that it's straight-up just re-drawn. Raditz looked that bad in the original too. I don't think it stands out so much more now because of the poor animation, but rather the new animation itself stands out from the rest of the scene.

I know it's not the exact same image as DaemonCorps, but I think you'll get the idea.

[Captain Awesome]

The problem there is the background, it's just a really lazy gradient fill that absolutely kills any sense of depth, It looks like they teleported to a disco planet mid-fight.

[Saiyavenger2941]

The problem there is the background, it's just a really lazy gradient fill that absolutely kills any sense of depth, It looks like they teleported to a disco planet mid-fight.

"What are they doing?"
"They're breakdance fighting!"

[Captain Awesome]

I'm tempted to edit that into a video clip with coloured lighting and a strobe effect with some kind of cheesy disco music.

[Super Ghost Kamikaze]

The problem there is the background, it's just a really lazy gradient fill that absolutely kills any sense of depth, It looks like they teleported to a disco planet mid-fight.

I'd watch that episode.

[Fuujin]

While that screen shot is fine and all, I think the biggest problem is that it's straight-up just re-drawn. Raditz looked that bad in the original too.

You say it's because it was drawn in a different style. I say it's crap. Let's compromise and say it's in a different style that's crap.

Why would they even do that? Were the original cels too messed up or something? God knows DBZ has enough bad animation as it is, there's no need to additionaly trace it in Flash or something, the effect is all vectory and over-simplified.

[XanatosVanBadass]

While that screen shot is fine and all, I think the biggest problem is that it's straight-up just re-drawn. Raditz looked that bad in the original too.

You say it's because it was drawn in a different style. I say it's crap. Let's compromise and say it's in a different style that's crap.

Why would they even do that? Were the original cels too messed up or something? God knows DBZ has enough bad animation as it is, there's no need to additionaly trace it in Flash or something, the effect is all vectory and over-simplified.

but that's not what he said. It looks pretty much exactly like the original, lack of shading and all. The only reason people are complaining is because it doesn't blend as well as they hoped it would, especially with that background.

[Fuujin]

but that's not what he said. It looks pretty much exactly like the original, lack of shading and all.

Except that it doesn't. It looks like the original traced by a Newgrounds kiddie. Like a xerox of a copy of a redrawing. Have you ever seen a drawing by a beginner artist who tries to learn by tracing a professional work? That what it reminds me of - you can still see the original through it, but it lacks coherency, a certain touch.
Besides, you could say the same about the FUNi remastering. It looks almost exactly like the original. But that "almost" still gets me.

The background is a seperate problem, but I'm not just talking about that one half-a-second shot. That was just an example, and if that was the only problem, I wouldn't even bother to post. However, there were whole scenes redrawn this way. You can check the Kanzentai page (BTW. My hat's off to Hujio for all the work) for more screenshots.

[Rod]

I love the kanzentai episode guides, I really hope you keep up the goodwork

[Zenkai Power]

but that's not what he said. It looks pretty much exactly like the original, lack of shading and all.

Except that it doesn't. It looks like the original traced by a Newgrounds kiddie. Like a xerox of a copy of a redrawing. Have you ever seen a drawing by a beginner artist who tries to learn by tracing a professional work? That what it reminds me of - you can still see the original through it, but it lacks coherency, a certain touch.
Besides, you could say the same about the FUNi remastering. It looks almost exactly like the original. But that "almost" still gets me.

The background is a seperate problem, but I'm not just talking about that one half-a-second shot. That was just an example, and if that was the only problem, I wouldn't even bother to post. However, there were whole scenes redrawn this way. You can check the Kanzentai page (BTW. My hat's off to Hujio for all the work) for more screenshots.

I agree. They attempted to keep it just like the original. Good intentions. But the original was painted and drawn on cels and when photographed into the shot it looks less "simple" than this digital drawing. Copying what they did here just makes the shot look bad. They really should have touched it up a bit and given it more shading or something to make it nicer. It really DOES look like it was just traced in flash. But that fault is because they tried to make it look exactly like the original shot on a computer. It just won't look as good.

Obviously computer animated stuff CAN look good, but DBZ DOES have some original shots that looked pretty bad ... they should at least try to ... fix them up a bit.

Imagine the scenes of Vegeta fighting Android 18... I hope they like... would maybe fix some of those shots. Please.

[Super Ghost Kamikaze]

...wow.

So I just got the chance to sift through the whole Kanzentai comparison page. It's really interesting!

Collapsible per-episode comparisons, larger images, the whole format is just AMAZING. I thought the first two were impressive, but this just outdoes them to a whole other level. It's just really, really nice! A huge thumbs up to the Kanzentai folks!

The part about Goku and Piccolo charging Raditz is the most interesting to me. When I watched the start of the fight, something felt "Wrong" to me, and on a second viewing I noticed that the charging of Raditz just didn't look as cool or "martial arts-y", and in fact it took me a couple re-watches to even notice that they actually passed in front of each other because it goes by so fast(arguably, too fast). Considering the "martial arts" feel is a lot of what I like about the Saiyan saga stuff, it's a bit of a shame for me to see it go in favor of what Kai has done with the fights.