Dragon Ball Manga Editions around the world.

coinmanmat · Post by **coinmanmat** » Sat Jul 04, 2009 4:02 pm

Wow if they were refering to the Saiyans as "Space Warriors" then that translation really sucks.

Cold Skin · Post by **Cold Skin** » Sat Jul 04, 2009 6:57 pm

coinmanmat wrote:Wow if they were refering to the Saiyans as "Space Warriors" then that translation really sucks.

Oh yeah, the TV series was the worst translation ever, it wasn't even translation anymore, it was adaptation, and sometimes inconsistant. Names for a same move or character could suddenly be different in one episode, the dialogues could be totally deformed so that it makes no sense in the end, etc... Here are a few examples of what there was.

- Dragon Balls : "Cristal balls"

- Kaio-Ken : "Kaio Move", "Kamehameha", or generic sentences like "I won't let you win!!", and so on...

- Kaio Shin : "Neptune"

- Kakarotto : "Karotto", "Cachalot", or "My son" when said by Baddack who never even once mentions the name itself (they wanted to never mention Goku's Saiyan name if possible, even Vegeta called him "Sangoku")...

- Kame Hame Ha : "Light Pulverisation" when performed by Goku against Cell before he teleports next to him and destroys half of him. Why? We'll never know.

- Kame Sennin : "Great Turtle"

- Kikoho : "Energy Canon"

- Makanko Sappo : "Magic Needle"

- Masenko : "Magic Beam", [singing:] "Tanananana Yeah!!"

- Piccolo : "Little Heart"

- Saiyan : "Space Warrior"

- Son Goku / Son Gohan / Son Goten : "Sangoku", "Sangohan", "Sangoten".

- Super Saiyan : "Super Warrior"

- Taiyoken : "Sun Bite"

etc, etc...

The first translation of the manga was half way adaptation like the TV series, half original text, something in between. Some names like "Sangoku" or "Great Turtle" remained, but names like "Kaio Shin", "Piccolo", "Saiyan", "Dragon Balls", "Kaio-Ken" and else were this time respected... In that first manga translation, Goku's Saiyan name was "Carot".

coinmanmat · Post by **coinmanmat** » Sat Jul 04, 2009 7:37 pm

Cold Skin wrote:
coinmanmat wrote:Wow if they were refering to the Saiyans as "Space Warriors" then that translation really sucks.
Oh yeah, the TV series was the worst translation ever, it wasn't even translation anymore, it was adaptation, and sometimes inconsistant. Names for a same move or character could suddenly be different in one episode, the dialogues could be totally deformed so that it makes no sense in the end, etc... Here are a few examples of what there was.

- Dragon Balls : "Cristal balls"

- Kaio-Ken : "Kaio Move", "Kamehameha", or generic sentences like "I won't let you win!!", and so on...

- Kaio Shin : "Neptune"

- Kakarotto : "Karotto", "Cachalot", or "My son" when said by Baddack who never even once mentions the name itself (they wanted to never mention Goku's Saiyan name if possible, even Vegeta called him "Sangoku")...

- Kame Hame Ha : "Light Pulverisation" when performed by Goku against Cell before he teleports next to him and destroys half of him. Why? We'll never know.

- Kame Sennin : "Great Turtle"

- Kikoho : "Energy Canon"

- Makanko Sappo : "Magic Needle"

- Masenko : "Magic Beam", [singing:] "Tanananana Yeah!!"

- Piccolo : "Little Heart"

- Saiyan : "Space Warrior"

- Son Goku / Son Gohan / Son Goten : "Sangoku", "Sangohan", "Sangoten".

- Super Saiyan : "Super Warrior"

- Taiyoken : "Sun Bite"

etc, etc...

The first translation of the manga was half way adaptation like the TV series, half original text, something in between. Some names like "Sangoku" or "Great Turtle" remained, but names like "Kaio Shin", "Piccolo", "Saiyan", "Dragon Balls", "Kaio-Ken" and else were this time respected... In that first manga translation, Goku's Saiyan name was "Carot".

Wow that seems so bad that it makes FUNimation's orange brick season sets enjoyable

The Tori-bot · Post by **The Tori-bot** » Sat Jul 04, 2009 7:39 pm

Cold Skin wrote:- Kikoho : "Energy Canon"

Well, it's not technically wrong, per se...

MCDaveG · Post by **MCDaveG** » Sat Jul 04, 2009 8:15 pm

sorry to be offtopic, but in Polish version, which is the same as french there were little differences, like Piccolo was Satan Lil' Heart and Vegeta calling Goku as ''clown''

Puto · Post by **Puto** » Sat Jul 04, 2009 8:25 pm

Cold Skin wrote:
coinmanmat wrote:Wow if they were refering to the Saiyans as "Space Warriors" then that translation really sucks.
Oh yeah, the TV series was the worst translation ever, it wasn't even translation anymore, it was adaptation, and sometimes inconsistant. Names for a same move or character could suddenly be different in one episode, the dialogues could be totally deformed so that it makes no sense in the end, etc... Here are a few examples of what there was.

- Dragon Balls : "Cristal balls"

- Kaio-Ken : "Kaio Move", "Kamehameha", or generic sentences like "I won't let you win!!", and so on...

- Kaio Shin : "Neptune"

- Kakarotto : "Karotto", "Cachalot", or "My son" when said by Baddack who never even once mentions the name itself (they wanted to never mention Goku's Saiyan name if possible, even Vegeta called him "Sangoku")...

- Kame Hame Ha : "Light Pulverisation" when performed by Goku against Cell before he teleports next to him and destroys half of him. Why? We'll never know.

- Kame Sennin : "Great Turtle"

- Kikoho : "Energy Canon"

- Makanko Sappo : "Magic Needle"

- Masenko : "Magic Beam", [singing:] "Tanananana Yeah!!"

- Piccolo : "Little Heart"

- Saiyan : "Space Warrior"

- Son Goku / Son Gohan / Son Goten : "Sangoku", "Sangohan", "Sangoten".

- Super Saiyan : "Super Warrior"

- Taiyoken : "Sun Bite"

etc, etc...

The first translation of the manga was half way adaptation like the TV series, half original text, something in between. Some names like "Sangoku" or "Great Turtle" remained, but names like "Kaio Shin", "Piccolo", "Saiyan", "Dragon Balls", "Kaio-Ken" and else were this time respected... In that first manga translation, Goku's Saiyan name was "Carot".

Yeah, Goku's Saiyan name was only ever uttered by Broli. Ever. And even he sometimes referred to him as "Sangoku"... Also, don't forget "Booboo" for Majin Boo. Also, they completely changed the explanation of how the Kaiô-ken works...

rereboy · Post by **rereboy** » Sat Jul 04, 2009 8:30 pm

Basically, the portuguese version that is (in)famous for having a poor Dub, is based off the French Dub.

Meaning that all the things that Cold Skin mentioned are present in the Portuguese Dub.

But it really was not their fault. They didn`t have the original, they only had the french dub, so I consider the Portuguese dub a better dub than the french one.

Actually its quite impressive how good the portuguese dub is considering that it was based off the french one and had a cast of seven or eight people for the whole show. I`ve seen lot worse.

As for the manga, I`m unaware of any portuguese version of the manga. It might exist but it probably is not anything worth mentioning. I just buy the Vizbigs.

Puto · Post by **Puto** » Sat Jul 04, 2009 8:32 pm

rereboy wrote:Basically, the portuguese version that is (in)famous for having a poor Dub, is based off the French Dub.

Meaning that all the things that Cold Skin mentioned are present in the Portuguese Dub.

But it really was not their fault. They didn`t have the original, they only had the french dub, so I consider the Portuguese dub a better dub than the french one.

Actually its quite impressive how good the portuguese dub is considering that it was based off the french one and had a cast of seven or eight people for the whole show. I`ve seen lot worse.

As for the manga, I`m unaware of any portuguese version of the manga. It might exist but it probably is not anything worth mentioning. I just buy the Vizbigs.

There is a portuguese manga published by Planeta Agostini. But it's really hard to find. I bought the first two tankôbons once but I lost them at some point, so I don't remember if the translation was any good or not...

rereboy · Post by **rereboy** » Sat Jul 04, 2009 8:34 pm

Thanks for the information. Didn`t know that.

Puto · Post by **Puto** » Sat Jul 04, 2009 8:40 pm

Puto wrote:Also, they completely changed the explanation of how the Kaiô-ken works...

So this is how they said the Kaiô-ken works:
- Instead of "You can only use it to boost your power to twice your normal strength", they say that "You can only use this attack twice".
- Basically every time Goku uses the Kaiô-ken, it then says "Xth attempt, Kaiô Technique!" (e.g. "I have no choice. I will have to try the Kaiô technique for the third time! 3rd attempt, Kaiô-technique!")

Raki · Post by **Raki** » Sun Jul 05, 2009 1:12 am

Those are some truly horrible translations. Imagine being stuck with that garabge.

Post by **Herms** » Sun Jul 05, 2009 2:25 am

Kaioshin being called "Neptune" comes from the fact that the planet Neptune is called Kaiou-sei in Japanese, "Planet of the Sea King" (as far as I know, the actual god Neptune is never called Kaiou in Japanese). The English version of Legendary Super Warriors called Kaio's planet "Neptune" because in Japanese it is also called Kaiou-sei, only this one means "Planet of the World King". In the character sheets for the Jump Super Anime Tour special, Elder Kaioshin has his name mistakenly written with the kai for "sea" rather than "world".

SHINOBI-03 · Post by **SHINOBI-03** » Sun Jul 05, 2009 3:02 am

Herms wrote:Kaioshin being called "Neptune" comes from the fact that the planet Neptune is called Kaiou-sei in Japanese, "Planet of the Sea King" (as far as I know, the actual god Neptune is never called Kaiou in Japanese). The English version of Legendary Super Warriors called Kaio's planet "Neptune" because in Japanese it is also called Kaiou-sei, only this one means "Planet of the World King". In the character sheets for the Jump Super Anime Tour special, Elder Kaioshin has his name mistakenly written with the kai for "sea" rather than "world".

So that's why Kaio is named Neptune in the Arabic dub, huh.

Cold Skin · Post by **Cold Skin** » Sun Jul 05, 2009 8:19 am

Puto wrote:
Puto wrote:Also, they completely changed the explanation of how the Kaiô-ken works...
So this is how they said the Kaiô-ken works:
- Instead of "You can only use it to boost your power to twice your normal strength", they say that "You can only use this attack twice".
- Basically every time Goku uses the Kaiô-ken, it then says "Xth attempt, Kaiô Technique!" (e.g. "I have no choice. I will have to try the Kaiô technique for the third time! 3rd attempt, Kaiô-technique!")

That's absolutely the kind of change you often find in many conversations throughout the episodes, leading to totally different explanations and facts!
Very nice example!

So needless to say, when we now have a carefully translated manga which respects the original from A to Z, which is the REAL Dragon Ball, every French fan wants to jump on it and buy the whole collection!

coinmanmat · Post by **coinmanmat** » Sun Jul 05, 2009 8:37 am

^ I would love to see that happen but in some translations, the publishing companies like Viz for example will still modify the manga to what they think will be suitable towards the audiance. Hell in some cases they'll even screw up the entire series.

rereboy · Post by **rereboy** » Sun Jul 05, 2009 9:07 am

coinmanmat wrote:^ I would love to see that happen but in some translations, the publishing companies like Viz for example will still modify the manga to what they think will be suitable towards the audiance. Hell in some cases they'll even screw up the entire series.

You are exaggerating. Viz does a very decent job. Believe me. (I`m not saying its perfect or excellent).

Like I said, I know the portuguese (and the french) dub very well so I know how screw up a translation can be. And Viz manages to keep the essence of the original content pretty much every single time, even if sometimes the translation could be more accurate.

Herms himself, who has one of the most complete knowledge of Dragon Ball that I`ve ever seen and understands and is familiar with the original japanese manga, and therefore is very rigorous and demanding when it comes to translations I imagine, said in this very topic that Viz does a decent job:

Herms wrote: They're not terrible by any means (they're still about a zillion times more accurate than the Funi dub), but they do change a number of things. I give them a 7 out of 10.

They do tend to censor nudity, but regarding the translation, what pretty much comes to mind is that they tend to remove curse words and that they changed Mr. Satan name (which pretty much doesn`t really bother me).

NeptuneKai · Post by **NeptuneKai** » Sun Jul 05, 2009 12:58 pm

Man I love reading about this sort of thing. Thanks for the info!
I'd still take an attack called "Magic Needle" over "Special Beam Cannon" any day though.

Cold Skin · Post by **Cold Skin** » Sun Jul 05, 2009 6:07 pm

NeptuneKai wrote:Man I love reading about this sort of thing. Thanks for the info!

Want some more about the French dub? Really, it's so messed up compared to the manga's translation, they should just redo it... with new voices I guess because most dubbers wouldn't even come back for GT.

Note that in France there is a rap song featuring Vegeta (meaning the French Vegeta), who is getting annoyed by the group and laughing at them when they talk about pride and fighting will, claiming he is the prince, and finally giving the group some little credit at the end of the song before having a crazy, evil laugh.

Anyway, some more examples:

- Gotenks : "Gotrunks"

- Kienzan : "Saw Beam"

- Kinto-Un : "Magic Cloud", "Supersonic Cloud", "Kinto" (from the beginning of the Boo era)

- Majin Boo : "Booboo" (written "Boubou" in France, but I try to adapt the names to what it would give in your language)

- Mr. Satan : "H e r c u l e" (there's a filter, would France have inspired other countries on this?:))

- Senzu : "Magic Bean"

- Yajirobe : "Balance"

Can't think of any other right now, but if you want deformed dialogues, then if you find someone who owns the French-dubbed episodes, they would be able to write a whole novel with those!

The Time Traveller · Post by **The Time Traveller** » Sun Jul 05, 2009 6:25 pm

Cold Skin wrote: Note that in France there is a rap song featuring Vegeta (meaning the French Vegeta), who is getting annoyed by the group and laughing at them when they talk about pride and fighting will, claiming he is the prince, and finally giving the group some little credit at the end of the song before having a crazy, evil laugh.

We need a damn LINK, for Justice!

Cold Skin · Post by **Cold Skin** » Sun Jul 05, 2009 7:07 pm

The Time Traveller wrote:
Cold Skin wrote: Note that in France there is a rap song featuring Vegeta (meaning the French Vegeta), who is getting annoyed by the group and laughing at them when they talk about pride and fighting will, claiming he is the prince, and finally giving the group some little credit at the end of the song before having a crazy, evil laugh.
We need a damn LINK, for Justice!

Well, it's in French, so I'm not sure it will bring you much.

But suit yourself, here it is (the video is likely not official, but fan-made with DBZ footage). The group is called Bouchées Doubles and their song is "Fier" ("proud"). I'll put the sentences Vegeta pronounces with a translation (I'll really try to do what I can, but I'm French after all!). I only put Vegeta's speeches, not the song's lyrics by members of the group, cause it would take a lot of time and be hellish to translate! Basically, they react to Vegeta's sentences often by covering the last thing he said: "You don't even know who you are" - "I know who I am..." etc / "What are you proud about?!" - "I'm proud that..." etc / "I'll send you to hell" - "I'm glad some people want to send me to hell..." etc.

If you don't care for the original French lyrics, just follow the bold fonts.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aZC_b0SyzYE

- "Comment les jeunes des guettos peuvent-ils être aussi fiers, alors qu'on leur a tout enlevé ? On les a tellement déracinés qu'ils n'ont plus de valeurs."
- "How can youths in guettos be so proud, when they've been ripped of everything? They've been so much taken off from their roots that they don't have value anymore."

[MUSIC STARTS]

- "Mais qu'est-ce qui se passe ?! Bouchées Doubles ?! Oh non, pas eux ! Non !! Je croyais m'en être débarassé ! Nooooon !! Je suis le prince !! Je suis Végéta !! Comment osez-vous me défier, alors que vous ne savez même pas qui vous êtes ?!!"
- "What the hell's going on?! Bouchées Doubles?! Oh no, not them! No!! I thought I got rid of them! Noooooo!! I'm the prince!! I'm Vegeta!! How dare you even challenge me, when you can't even tell who you are?!!"

[AFTER FIRST CHORUS]:
- "Wah ha ha, vous me faites rire, vous et votre rage en carton! Mais derrière, qu'est-ce que vous en faites de votre rage?! Qu'est-ce que vous avez changé, hein ?!! De quoi êtes-vous fier ?!!"
- "Wah ha ha, you guys make me laugh, with your toy-like rage! But what do you actually do with that rage?! What did you change, huh?!! What are you proud about?!!"

[AFTER SECOND CHORUS]:
- "Fier ? Wah ha ha !! Non, fier c'est moi!! Raah, je suis le prince, et j'aurai votre peau !!"
- "Proud? Wah ha ha!! No, I am pride!! Raah, I'm the prince, and I'll send you to hell!!"

[AFTER BRIDGE]:
- "Parce que c'est ça la fierté pour vous ?! De garder la tête haute alors qu'on vous piétine ?!"
- "So that's what pride is according to you?! Just keeping your head up when you're being stepped on?!"

[END]:
- "Bouchées Doubles, vous êtes comme moi finalement. Le rap n'a plus qu'à s'accrocher !!! WAAAAH HAAA HAAA HAA!!!!"
- "Bouchées Doubles, you're just like me in the end. Rap'd better buckle up!!! WAAAAH HAAA HAA!!!!"