What, you mean you've never heard of the US division of Toei? Why, our forum member DragonBallKaiHD owns it.SparkyPantsMcGee wrote:whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa-?Raki wrote:Toei does have a US branch.SparkyPantsMcGee wrote: I believe it is. I find it funny that this appeared and then there is a massive pull. Youtube pulls videos all the time, but this is the first I heard for reasons outside of the US.
This is the first time I've heard this.
Herms wrote:Really, you could translate either title either way and nobody would care. But God would know.
With that logic, why should you ever pay for food? What happens if you don't like how it tastes? You should only pay for food if you end up liking it.MCDaveG wrote: You know, I'm purchasing only my most favourite things like Dragon Ball or Star Wars and wanna get Saint Seiya on DVD, but tell me, why am I supposed to purchase everything I want to see??? Imagine that you will buy some bad anime or product, that's quite a risk and if you want to sell it back, you must sell it for less or half price. So I'll download series, if it's really good, I'll buy it, if I don't like, I'll deleted and I'm not bothered about shopping and money and I'm not dissapinted then.
While I agree with the point you're making, I think food is on a slightly higher level of importance than anime.laserkid wrote:With that logic, why should you ever pay for food? What happens if you don't like how it tastes? You should only pay for food if you end up liking it.
Rocketman(In response to a post about Pandora's Box) wrote: I sat here for ten damn minutes wondering what the hell God of War had to do with any of this.
Youtube | Art/Animation BlogInsertclevername wrote:I plan to lose my virginity to Dragon Box 2.
I think you hit the nail right on the head there.laserkid wrote:How would you like it if where you work your job decided to not pay you your work hours because they felt your turnout wasnt good enough to be paid for. Your services were rendered, but not paid for. If an employer doesn't like your services, they will stop buying them (read: fire you), but they will still pay you for when they did employ you. So when you buy an anime you don't like the correct response is to stop buying more of that anime. Not to decide you have some right to a product you havent paid for.
I might have already said this at some point in this thread, but if an anime seems interesting enough for you to want to see it, then I think the creators have done their job right and deserve to be paid for it. If a person was really so uninterested in a product, then they wouldn't be downloading it. It's just an excuse, probably more to convince themselves than anyone else.laserkid wrote:With that logic, why should you ever pay for food? What happens if you don't like how it tastes? You should only pay for food if you end up liking it.MCDaveG wrote: You know, I'm purchasing only my most favourite things like Dragon Ball or Star Wars and wanna get Saint Seiya on DVD, but tell me, why am I supposed to purchase everything I want to see??? Imagine that you will buy some bad anime or product, that's quite a risk and if you want to sell it back, you must sell it for less or half price. So I'll download series, if it's really good, I'll buy it, if I don't like, I'll deleted and I'm not bothered about shopping and money and I'm not dissapinted then.
Yeah, the logic doesn't work there either. Unless the product or service is offered to you for free by either the owner, or someone who bought it from the owner, taking it is stealing. When people make anime they are doing it for a livlihood. As this video shows, piracy IS hurting their livlihoods however. So, when you decide its okay to just take what you havent paid for or been rightfully given, you're stealing.
How would you like it if where you work your job decided to not pay you your work hours because they felt your turnout wasnt good enough to be paid for. Your services were rendered, but not paid for. If an employer doesn't like your services, they will stop buying them (read: fire you), but they will still pay you for when they did employ you. So when you buy an anime you don't like the correct response is to stop buying more of that anime. Not to decide you have some right to a product you havent paid for.
I disagree with your disagreement. A poor excuse could be a valid one, even if found to be distasteful from other perspectives...Bussani wrote:I still disagree that it's a 'valid excuse' at times though, for the reasons I stated in my previous post. It seems like a poor excuse. It's all well and good to say you're not interested in the product and thus won't buy it, but if you want to see it enough to download it then you're obviously not completely uninterested in it. If you go ahead and watch the whole series by downloading it, even more so. Using the 'I'm not going to buy it anyway, so they're not losing anything if I take it for free' excuse, you could get away with downloading anything you want.
I think the difference between watching it on TV and downloading it is that someone is still paying for it. If you have cable, you're probably paying for that. In England you have to pay for a TV license at all I think, but let's just ignore that for now. Even if it's not the person watching TV that paid, don't the channels have to buy the right to air the shows?MisterFlashdude wrote:I disagree with your disagreement. A poor excuse could be a valid one, even if found to be distasteful from other perspectives...
Say, for example, I offered to let someone watch me dance... they might be so inclined to watch that dance, if for no other reason than out of morbid curiousity. If I offered that same person the opportunity to buy a dvd of me dancing, I might get spat on.
More seriously, I enjoyed Teen Titans. I watched every new episode as it aired. If I see it's on tv, I'll tune in, but I have absolutely zero interest in ever purchasing a Teen Titans dvd. This particular scenario applies to most of what I watch for free on TV...
If someone told me I had to pay for individual episodes of House or Mythbusters before I could watch them on tv, I think I'd decide I'm not interested in those shows anymore...
Whether it's due to interest, or because of monetary issues (either due to being too poor or too young to spend your own money), it is entirely accurate to say that there are some scenarios in which a person who had no choice but to pay for the series would simply not watch it... Thus, there really is no one losing the opportunity to sell these people dvds... They never would have or could have bought them to begin with.
But those are just instances where that reasoning could apply. Certainly not all cases, possibly not a good excuse even then, and by no means gives someone the indisputable right to the media... But there you go.
Yeah, I agree with this here. Most of the people who have commented are saying that if people stop watching it online and buying the DVDs it will really help the animators. No, it'll just help FUNimation and the Toei CEOs.MisterFlashdude wrote: Thirdly, those guys in the video aren't living crappy lives because you're streaming Dragonball. They have a shitty job.
Matt and Trey have said several times trhat they really don't mind their show being downloaded, they're just happy people are watching it. Besides, they make enough from the DVD sales anyway (see Christian Rock Hard).JAPPO wrote:I like the way South Park is doing it. Show it on TV, sell DVDs for collectors, and then offer every episode online for free (legally) on the official website. And run ads online to pay for the server costs.
The difference, which does exist, is merely in HOW it is marketed, but you're still taking a service (the animation) without paying for it. This is why I pointed out not getting paid at your job before, because your services at a job aren't a physical product either, but if you weren't paid for them it would also be considered theft.MisterFlashdude wrote:I feel inclined to throw my two cents in, however little they may be worth.
First and foremost, try not to get too overwhelmed by these sob stories.
I recall watching a documentary on Chinese gold farmers, and to me and many others they really are the most despicable inhabitants in any MMO community; but they were portrayed so sympathetically that it almost made me want to support their endeavors.
Second, don't confuse watching anime online with stealing an actual object such as food. It's simply not the same because it's not a finite resource available for a number of people to purchase. Stealing an orange isn't just bad because you didn't feel inclined to pay for it, but because you're eliminating the possibility of the orange-seller to make money by denying another individual the opportunity to buy it.
Equating watching anime to stealing food by reasoning "You're not inclined to pay for it, thus the orange-seller will have sold one less orange" is like saying I'm stealing from the orange-seller by planting my own orange tree in the back yard, or with more extreme reasoning you could say I'm stealing from the orange-seller simply by not wanting an orange at all.
Which again is stealing the service of an animation that you didn't pay for. You didn't steal a direct DVD, but you still stole the services of the animators.MisterFlashdude wrote:A more relevant example, burning anime onto a dvd isn't the same as stealing an anime dvd off a store shelf if only because you're creating a new object as opposed to taking an existing one which would deprive both a consumer of a product and a seller the opportunity to sell that item and make money.
No, it isn't a valid argument. If you weren't going to pay for it anyway its STILL theft of services that you recieve the benefit of without paying for them. You still OWE the animators for taking their services and specifically the end product without paying for it, BECAUSE you took it without paying for it.MisterFlashdude wrote:While the "I'd have never payed for it to begin with/I never intended to own that item/Consequently, they aren't really losing any money off of me" is overused and very quickly dismissed (particularly on this board), it can be a valid one .
They have a shitty job yes, but when you steal from them their pay goes down because their services are devalued. This is a direct result of the theft, and so you do have a direct impact on their lives.MisterFlashdude wrote:Thirdly, those guys in the video aren't living crappy lives because you're streaming Dragonball. They have a shitty job.
You're just trying to justify downloading of anime. It's a bad habit many anime fans do have, and while saying you wouldn't pay for it anyway is an excuse to rationalize the theft to ones self, it isn't a logical argument. Thieves who steal other things will also say they wouldn't pay for it either. While those are physical objects that have an additional impact because of it, taking the end product through copying is still theft.MisterFlashdude wrote:Don't get me wrong. I do acknowledge that watching anime online or burning your own dvds when you'd otherwise have the means to pay for the legitimate product inevitably leads to someone having a little less money in their pockets. But it's not these artists. And it's not the bane of anime.
