Christopher Sabat drops hints on Kai's dub...

penguintruth · Post by **penguintruth** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 12:37 am

jjgp1112 wrote:We're not talking about anime fans. Just regular ol' fans of Dragon Ball Z who you see on video game forums and the like.

I couldn't care less about those people. DBZ is an anime, Funimation licenses anime, an anime should be be treated with respect by its licensor. Fans of the "version" they put out have been pandered to for a decade, it's time a dub reflect what DBZ is, not what Funimation wanted it to be.

I'm sure there are tons of folks who will shell out money for that. They're the folks who're buying the Dragon Boxes. They've been waiting for more than a decade for a real DBZ dub.

Funimation has made plenty of money off the first group. Isn't it good business to try the other, too?

Taku128 · Post by **Taku128** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 12:44 am

penguintruth wrote:
jjgp1112 wrote:We're not talking about anime fans. Just regular ol' fans of Dragon Ball Z who you see on video game forums and the like.
I couldn't care less about those people. DBZ is an anime, Funimation licenses anime, an anime should be be treated with respect by its licensor. Fans of the "version" they put out have been pandered to for a decade, it's time a dub reflect what DBZ is, not what Funimation wanted it to be.

I'm sure there are tons of folks who will shell out money for that. They're the folks who're buying the Dragon Boxes. They've been waiting for more than a decade for a real DBZ dub.

Funimation has made plenty of money off the first group. Isn't it good business to try the other, too?

On the other hand, does that group care about a dub? After watching the Japanese version for so many years would they care about an accurate dub outside of liking that FUNimation is respecting the series? Would they actually watch it? Would it make them more money that way when they could keep the old cast and appeal to Japanese and English fans at the same time?

jjgp1112 · Post by **jjgp1112** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 12:45 am

penguintruth wrote:
jjgp1112 wrote:We're not talking about anime fans. Just regular ol' fans of Dragon Ball Z who you see on video game forums and the like.
I couldn't care less about those people. DBZ is an anime, Funimation licenses anime, an anime should be be treated with respect by its licensor. Fans of the "version" they put out have been pandered to for a decade, it's time a dub reflect what DBZ is, not what Funimation wanted it to be.

I'm sure there are tons of folks who will shell out money for that. They're the folks who're buying the Dragon Boxes. They've been waiting for more than a decade for a real DBZ dub.

Funimation has made plenty of money off the first group. Isn't it good business to try the other, too?

Like you said, this is a ten year old property (as far as America is ocnerned). I hate hearing all of this bullshit about "blah, blah, they've been catered to forever let us have a turn yada yada." Those fans are still the most profitable audience and Funi and they still matter. Making a release to appease a bunch of crybabies after they already released a bunch of boxsets that sold like hotcakes is one thing, but they'd be fools to do a whole redub of a property like Dragon Ball and leave the casual fans in the dust. That's just the result of all of the things Funi's done in the past, so either deal with it or stop hoping for this perfect fantasy dub.

BlueSky · Post by **Kaboom** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 12:49 am

Saying that FUNimation should just keep all the bad and inaccurate crap from their old dub and purposely carry it over to a potential new one is the stupidest thing I've heard in a long time.

The simple truth: The way they did it before is the WRONG way. Licensing and dubbing a new version of the series is an opportunity to do it the RIGHT way, and they'd be foolish to not take advantage of that.

Note that I didn't say, "old way" vs "new way," nor "what the fans have gotten used to" vs "what fans would like." It's straight-up right and wrong, correct and incorrect, proper and improper, fact and fiction.

Taku128 · Post by **Taku128** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 12:50 am

SSj Kaboom wrote:Saying that FUNimation should just keep all the bad and inaccurate crap from their old dub and purposely carry it over to a potential new one is the stupidest thing I've heard in a long time.

The simple truth: The way they did it before is the WRONG way. Licensing and dubbing a new version of the series is an opportunity to do it the RIGHT way, and they'd be foolish to not take advantage of that.

Note that I didn't say, "old way" vs "new way," nor "what the fans have gotten used to" vs "what fans would like." It's straight-up right and wrong, correct and incorrect, proper and improper, fact and fiction.

I don't think anyone is arguing that. This is simply about the voice cast.

penguintruth · Post by **penguintruth** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 12:51 am

jjgp1112 wrote:crybabies

Yeah, those fans of the real DBZ are such crybabies. They should just shut up and enjoy all the HARDCORE RAWKING of the English dub DBZ or else get into something different!

Same with Macross fans, how dare they not like Robotech! It's THREE SHOWS IN ONE!

Post by **VegettoEX** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 12:52 am

Last chance to stay on-topic in a civilized way.

jjgp1112 · Post by **jjgp1112** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 12:54 am

SSj Kaboom wrote:Saying that FUNimation should just keep all the bad and inaccurate crap from their old dub and purposely carry it over to a potential new one is the stupidest thing I've heard in a long time.

The simple truth: The way they did it before is the WRONG way. Licensing and dubbing a new version of the series is an opportunity to do it the RIGHT way, and they'd be foolish to not take advantage of that.

Note that I didn't say, "old way" vs "new way," nor "what the fans have gotten used to" vs "what fans would like." It's straight-up right and wrong, correct and incorrect, proper and improper, fact and fiction.

It may be the right thing as far as fan relations go and all of that shit, but it's not all that smart of a business move to me. Funi still has to make money. They're not gonna just say "Hey dollars, meet toilet" just to make a dub that will satisfy 10 people. There are certain things that we just can't change and it'd just be silly to see Funi do the whole thing over this late in it's history in America.

We've had a dub that lasted 5 years - with that cast and with those names.

We've gotten video games every year for the past 7 years - with that cast and with those same names

And now all of a sudden, Funi's gonna say "Oh hey guys, we're doing a dub of this new Dragon Ball series but we're doing it with completely different voices and names and shit from what we've been giving to you for the past 10 years but please, please, please support us with cherries on top!" That's like how That 70s Show replaced Eric with Randy in Season 8.

I'm simply speaking from a business perspective.

ShadowDude112 · Post by **ShadowDude112** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 1:01 am

VegettoEX wrote:Last chance to stay on-topic in a civilized way.

I'd listen to this guy. I don't want this thread locked.

Rocketman · Post by **Rocketman** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 1:04 am

penguintruth wrote:I couldn't care less about those people.

They outnumber you and everybody who thinks like you (in America!). And that's why Funimation will never remake the dub: because y'all won't watch it. You, penguintruth, have said numerous times that you don't find any dub preferable to the original Japanese.

Why should Funi spend all that money on rescripting/hiring/recording/etc just so the sub fans can turn up their noses at it anyway because it's still not ~NOZAWA~?

BlueSky · Post by **Kaboom** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 1:05 am

If you ask me, FUNimation wouldn't have to be too extreme with the recasting and voice direction, and only make a select few replacements (FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, NEW FREEZA!).

Otherwise, the majority of the "changes" from the old Z dub to the new Kai one would be related to the script. Mainly, actually keeping it accurate. That would be a plus for the dubbies, too. As I imagine they aren't used to actually having a faithful dub, it'd be like a whole new frontier for a lot of them. They may discover plot points and character quirks and motivations they never even knew existed.

jjgp1112 · Post by **jjgp1112** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 1:06 am

Rocketman wrote:
penguintruth wrote:I couldn't care less about those people.
They outnumber you and everybody who thinks like you (in America!). And that's why Funimation will never remake the dub: because y'all won't watch it. You, penguintruth, have said numerous times that you don't find any dub preferable to the original Japanese.

Why should Funi spend all that money on rescripting/hiring/recording/etc just so the sub fans can turn up their noses at it anyway because it's still not ~NOZAWA~?

Nail? Meet the head. Get acquainted.

BlueSky · Post by **Kaboom** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 1:08 am

I'm not as much of a stickler for perfection or precise imitation as others. I love me a dub when it's actually well-done. I can freely switch between languages with a good amount of other anime, particularly from FUNimation (namely One Piece and YuYu Hakusho), and enjoy the English version just as much as the original.

But DragonBall remains one of the sad exceptions. I deeply want to have an English DragonBall Z/Kai dub that I can actually watch in my native language and enjoy. I know I'm not alone in that.

penguintruth · Post by **penguintruth** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 1:09 am

Rocketman wrote:
penguintruth wrote:I couldn't care less about those people.
They outnumber you and everybody who thinks like you (in America!). And that's why Funimation will never remake the dub: because y'all won't watch it. You, penguintruth, have said numerous times that you don't find any dub preferable to the original Japanese.

Why should Funi spend all that money on rescripting/hiring/recording/etc just so the sub fans can turn up their noses at it anyway because it's still not ~NOZAWA~?

First, I disagree that they outnumber the people that think like me. Their voice seems slightly louder than the people who think like me, because most of the people who think like me don't talk much about DBZ anymore. I imagine they might again if there was an accurate dub available, though.

Second, just because I think a Japanese cast is superior, doesn't mean I won't appreciate a great English dub. What sort of mental gymnastics did you do to get to that conclusion?

Gogeta 00 · Post by **Gogeta 00** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 1:09 am

On the other hand, a brand new dub could be a smart move for Funimation.

They've already convinced a good portion of the fan population to buy the series (possibly several times). How exactly are they going to turn around and say "Hey here's the series you've already bought, except it's about a hundred episodes shorter, it's on blu-ray, and it has a new name!" They can't really use the HD thing as there main selling point, because they already told everyone that the season sets were HD. Basically, a brand new dub could be one of the only ways they can sell this thing. By saying that they will treat the series like Japan did, with a complete re-dubbing, it could appeal to many anime fans.

But in the end, it's DragonBall, so I don't think Funimation will really have to worry about it selling anyway.

penguintruth · Post by **penguintruth** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 1:11 am

Gogeta 00 wrote:ut in the end, it's DragonBall, so I don't think Funimation will really have to worry about it selling anyway.

This. It will sell regardless. It's license to print money.

They might as well try their hand at doing a competent dub for once.

Taku128 · Post by **Taku128** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 1:12 am

SSj Kaboom wrote:I love me a dub when it's actually well-done. I can freely switch between languages with a good amount of other anime, particularly from FUNimation, and enjoy the English version just as much as the original.

But DragonBall remains one of the sad exceptions. I deeply want to have an English DragonBall Z/Kai dub that I can actually watch in my native language and enjoy. I know I'm not alone in that.

But if the dub still sucked would you not buy Kai? If the dub is different the dub fans have no track to fall back onto, but you have the Japanese track. If they have an "Americanized" English track and a Japanese track they can appeal to two audiences with two different tracks to make more money. If they have a faithful English track and a Japanese track they're appealing to one market twice and completely missing out on a second already existing market.

jjgp1112 · Post by **jjgp1112** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 1:12 am

Gogeta 00 wrote:On the other hand, a brand new dub could be a smart move for Funimation.

They've already convinced a good portion of the fan population to buy the series (possibly several times). How exactly are they going to turn around and say "Hey here's the series you've already bought, except it's about a hundred episodes shorter, it's on blu-ray, and it has a new name!" They can't really use the HD thing as there main selling point, because they already told everyone that the season sets were HD. Basically, a brand new dub could be one of the only ways they can sell this thing. By saying that they will treat the series like Japan did, with a complete re-dubbing, it could appeal to many anime fans.

But in the end, it's DragonBall, so I don't think Funimation will really have to worry about it selling anyway.

Uh, the Season sets have never been released on Blu-Ray. Only the movies. Sure, they can do a new script, but KEEP THE GODDAMN VOICES AND NAMES THE SAME. After 10 years, it'd be stupid of Funi to do so.

BlueSky · Post by **Kaboom** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 1:15 am

Taku128 wrote:But if the dub still sucked would you not buy Kai?

No, I would not. Actually, a new, well-done dub is the only reason I would buy Kai, since I already have a great way to collect Z.

If the dub is different the dub fans have no track to fall back onto, but you have the Japanese track. If they have an "Americanized" English track and a Japanese track they can appeal to two audiences with two different tracks to make more money. If they have a faithful English track and a Japanese track they're appealing to one market twice and completely missing out on a second already existing market.

I see what you're getting at.

But a better dub for everybody is worth some people being a little confused at first. People who only knew the "Americanized" dub, if that's the euphemism we want to use for it, will get used to actually having an accurate one in time.

jjgp1112 wrote:Sure, they can do a new script, but KEEP THE GODDAMN VOICES AND NAMES THE SAME. After 10 years, it'd be stupid of Funi to do so.

Sure, I'd say most of the voices can stay, aside from a few that desperately need changing for the sake of characterization (i.e. Freeza). In the same vein, some names SHOULD be changed. The ones that are just plain, well, wrong. Like "Tien" and "Pikkon" and Bardock's entire crew...

jjgp1112 · Post by **jjgp1112** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 1:19 am

SSj Kaboom wrote:
Taku128 wrote:But if the dub still sucked would you not buy Kai?
No, I would not. Actually, a new, well-done dub is the only reason I would buy Kai, since I already have a great way to collect Z.

If the dub is different the dub fans have no track to fall back onto, but you have the Japanese track. If they have an "Americanized" English track and a Japanese track they can appeal to two audiences with two different tracks to make more money. If they have a faithful English track and a Japanese track they're appealing to one market twice and completely missing out on a second already existing market.
I see what you're getting at.

But a better dub for everybody is worth some people being a little confused at first. People who only knew the "Americanized" dub, if that's the euphemism we want to use for it, will get used to actually having an accurate one in time.

I think the last thing on a casual DBZ fans mind is how accurate the dub is to the original. Hell, even I could care less.